Struggling with first fishless cycle

[Ponch]

Hey - I'm new here and in the market for some advice. Bought a 5gallon tank with a built in filter for my son a couple months back, added a heater, some water conditioner and then some guppies ( 3 or 4 initially ) and proceeded to watch fish after fish die for about a month ( a total of 10-12 - lost count).

Since learned about cycling and figured that guppies are not exactly the type of durable fish that can withstand increasing ammonia levels. So I'm now trying to fishless cycle that is seemingly taking forever.

Stats

• 87 degrees
• lowered water level so water exiting filter breaks surface of water, adding oxygen
• Tap water PH about 7.8
• Using the API test kit
• Blue Ribbon clear ammonia

Here's my cycle log/diary
9/4 - Ammo (4.0), Ph (8.0?)
9/5 - Ammo (4.0), Ph (7.8)
9/6 - Ammo (4.0), Ph (7.8)
9/7 - Ammo (4.0), Ph (7.8)
9/8 - Ammo (4.0), Ph (7.9)
9/9 - Ammo (4.0), Ph (7.9)
9/10 - Ammo (4.0), Ph (7.9)
9/11 - Ammo (4.0), Ph (7.9)
9/12 - Skip
9/13 - Ammo (4.0), Ph (7.9)
9/14 - Skip
9/15 - Ammo (4.0), Ph (7.9)
9/16 - Skip
9/17 - Added water to keep filter running, replenish after water evaporation
9/17 - Ammo (3.0), Ph (8.0)
9/18 - Ammo (3.0), Ph (7.9)
9/19 - 50% water change
9/19 - Ammo (3.0), Ph (7.8), Nitrites (0)
9/20 - Ammo (3.0), Ph (7.8), Nitrites (0)
9/21 - Skip
9/22 - Ammo (3.0), Ph (7.8), Nitrites (0)
9/23 - Ammo (3.0), Ph (7.8), Nitrites (0)
9/24 - 50% water change to bring Ammo down to 1.0-2.0 - thought too high
9/24 - Ammo (1.5), Ph (7.8), Nitrites (didn't test)
9/25 - Ammo (1.5), Ph (7.8), Nitrites (0)
9/25 - Added 3 drops Ammo to bring up to 3.0 ppm
9/25 - Ammo (3.0), Ph (7.8), Nitrites (0)
9/26 - Ammo (3.0), Ph (7.8), Nitrites (0)
9/27 - Skip
9/28 - Ammo (3.0), Ph (7.8), Nitrites (0)
9/29 - Ammo (3.0), Ph (didn't test), Nitrites (0)
9/30 - Ammo (3.0), Ph (didn't test), Nitrites (0)
10/1 - Ammo (3.0), Ph (7.9), Nitrites (0)
10/2 - Ammo (3.0), Ph (didn't test), Nitrites (0)
10/3 - Ammo (3.0), Ph (didn't test), Nitrites (0)
10/4 - Ammo (3.0), Ph (didn't test), Nitrites (0)
10/5 - Ammo (3.0), Ph (didn't test), Nitrites (0)
10/5 - Added water to keep filter running, replenish after water evaporation

i've been at this over a month and am starting to grow weary! What the heck is going on here? Any ideas? Do I need to get myself some pantyhose and a raw shrimp to kick-start this process? Please help!

 

[picture_117]

The ammonia doesn't have any additives does it? Ive heard of that brand before but I can't recall if it was the right kind.
As far as adding shrimp you would just raise the ammonia higher. No need.
Have you added ammonia since you started cycling?

 

[AquaRick]

The Ace brand ammonia seems to work pretty well. It's 10% ammonia and a little goes a long way. Might be worth it if there's an Ace hardware around.

 

[Brian_Nano12g]

http://www.supremehardware.com/servlet/the-36468/Ace-Ammonia/Detail

The above link was posted by another member on this forum. Apparently this is the good stuff! But if the ammo you're already using is comparable (meaning No color, no scents/perfumes, and no surfactants), you should "seed" your tank with some media from an established tank. Or add some Tetra Safe Start to introduce the ben bac.

 

[Ponch]

The ammonia doesn't have any additives does it? Ive heard of that brand before but I can't recall if it was the right kind.
As far as adding shrimp you would just raise the ammonia higher. No need.
Have you added ammonia since you started cycling?

Picture-117 - nope No additives at all in the ammo. Shake it and it doesn't even bubble. I have added ammo once in cycle after I replenished the water in tank because so much had evaporated. After adding the water ammo dropped to 1.5 and then added three ammo drops which brought it back up to 3.0. Am I right in thinking this shouldn't take so long?

 

[picture_117]

Yeah it takes long in some people's tanks but not a whole month, you would have at least, seen some nitrites by now.
FW API master test kit being used correct?
I really don't see anything that you've done wrong. You could try a really large water change to maybe start the cycle again.

 

[Ponch]

BrianNano & AquaRick - yeah Ive read good things about the Ace ammonia. Nearest Ace is about 50 miles away so I might have to order this online. I think I will try some seeding material first though and see if that does the trick. Not sure if a LFS will oblige that and had been avoiding asking as I'd read that with enough oxygen in the water these bacteria would grow naturally - but that seems to be a good place to possibly start. Then move to the Ace ammonia if that doesn't do the trick...

 

[jlk]

Are you dosing ammonia everyday? I am suspicious of the brand of ammonia-it might be worthwhile to call the manufacturer to verify that there is nothing in it. Even if nothing is on the label, many brands (particularly, those from the dollar store or supermarket) have additives that you wouldnt know about unless you called the company! It might explain whats going on.

 

[Ponch]

Yes - freshwater API kit. I'm really clueless on this. THinking about some seeding material per other suggestions....

 

[Ponch]

Are you dosing ammonia everyday? I am suspicious of the brand of ammonia-it might be worthwhile to call the manufacturer to verify that there is nothing in it. Even if nothing is on the label, many brands (particularly, those from the dollar store or supermarket) have additives that you wouldnt know about unless you called the company! It might explain whats going on.

No not dosing everyday for fear this would quickly send ammo off the charts. Have done a little R&D on the Blue Ribbon ammonia and it is seemingly clear of any additives or chemicals

http://apps.risd.edu/envirohealth_msds/ID/PattersonBlueRibbonClearAmmonia.txt

 

[picture_117]

Yes - freshwater API kit. I'm really clueless on this. THinking about some seeding material per other suggestions....

Found the thread talking about blue ribbon ammonia, it is the correct one.
Yes seeding is the best way.

 

[LyndaB]

When I set up my first tank, it took a good 6 weeks for it to cycle. Being patient offers the biggest rewards in fishkeeping.

 

[librarygirl]

A month of no ammonia dropping is odd. Are you using dechlorinator and if so what kind?

 

[Chino1130]

Turn your heater up as high as it can go and keep the lights off as much as possible, this will encourage bacteria growth. If you don't have any seeded material, go to a fish store and see what they have in their tanks. Ask if you could purchase a plant or two (a fake filthy one would probably be best) out of one of their tanks that is filled with fish. Odds are that it will have plenty of bacteria on it to seed and jumpstart your cycle.

 

[jlk]

Its worth noting that the API test kits do expire . Perhaps you bought one that sat on the shelf for a year (or longer) and your getting inaccurate results. Have you tried testing for nitrates? If you have a readable amount of nitrates then you have to have nitrite production! Make sure you shake the nitrate bottles well before use. Let us know!

 

[jlk]

Also make sure your tank hadnt been contaminated with anything. Spraying febreeze or using carpet powder in the vicinity of your tank are evil culprits. And having lotion or other stuff on your hands before sticking them in the tank can cause ill effects.

 

[AquaRick]

Its worth noting that the API test kits do expire . Perhaps you bought one that sat on the shelf for a year (or longer) and your getting inaccurate results. Have you tried testing for nitrates? If you have a readable amount of nitrates then you have to have nitrite production! Make sure you shake the nitrate bottles well before use. Let us know!

Yup was going to suggest to have your water tested by an LFS and see what they get? Maybe your test kit expired?

 

[Ponch]

librarygirl - I'm using aqeon water conditioner. Hopefully that is a good brand and actually removing that bateria killing agents that would otherwise explain this month of waiting?!

 

[Ponch]

Found the thread talking about blue ribbon ammonia, it is the correct one.
Yes seeding is the best way.

awesome - that's one variable off the table

 

[Ponch]

When I set up my first tank, it took a good 6 weeks for it to cycle. Being patient offers the biggest rewards in fishkeeping.

6 weeks?? yikes. I'm actually almost there now - thanks for the reminder