Algae Aquascaping?

[lordofworms]

Quick question for you all out there...well actually (2)

1) I know alot of aquarists do not want any algae in their tanks, I perhaps may be an exception but I wanted to get a good understanding of what could happen down the road. I have a large peice of bogwood/driftwood in a 55 gallon that is moderate/to semi-heavy planted. I have 2 t5 HO lights on the standard 4 on 4 off system. my question is this.

I have what I believe to be green hair algae growing upon my driftwood, it is bright bright vivid green and sways within the current of one of my closer powerheads.... and i really like it, I like the look, I like the 'naturalness of it. it seems to be slowly gaining ground on my driftwood but havent seen any of it growing anywhere else.
is this ok to have for the tank? my plants seem to be growing just fine with new growth,etc I am just concerned that if I allow to much of this algae to grow it will outcompete my plants for nutrients and they all will die but I would really like to see this whole chunk of wood covered in this nice pretty green stuff! (and its a LARGE piece of driftwood I would say almost 10-15% of the water volume)
question, concerns comments? for my plants I have mostly anubias and java moss/ferns. a bunch of wisteria too.



my second question, is about dechlorinator.
I used to use that aquasafe dechlorinator you can get at walmart and such stores but upon joining this forum saw so many use Prime. so i switched over and I have been happy with not having to buy so much dechlor all the time (since prime uses so little compared)
BUT it states that it detoxes/removes

ammonia - Yay! (but tank is cycled so I havent had issue yet)
Nitrites - Yay! (again, tank is cycled so I never have readings of this)
Chlorine and chloramine - Yay!

Nitrates! - ummm...uh oh? dont my plants USE nitrate as part of their growing process, and by doing water changes am I hurting anything? I do water PWC about once every week (15%-20%) so is this affecting much or am I being overly cautious?


Thanks a ton, this site is indispensable for info!

 

[Andrewz00]

oh wow... ya know.. i NEVER thought about that! i use prime too.... hmmm... tagging along for an answer...hopefully soon...

 

[meegosh]

Not sure how to answer your question about the prime. I guess if I get some free time I could set up my old 5g QT and dose it with some nitrates, test and then add some prime and test again.

As far as the algae, as far as I am concerned, you could let it go crazy if you want. Most people consider it to be a nuisance so they avoid it like the plague. My driftwood had some of the same hair algae as you until I covered it with some moss and then it died off. I liked the look of the moss being pushed around more than the algae.

 

[BigJim]

I haven't used Prime, so no comment there.

I had a piece of slate that was completely covered in BBA. I left it alone because I kinda liked the look and I figure that the BBA was on the rock would use up nutrients and prevent BBA elsewhere in the tank. After a few months the BBA on the rock died off and BBA started growing elsewhere in the tank. That's the problem with trying to keep algae. It rarely stays where you want it.

 

[Andrewz00]

im currently awaiting a reply from Seachem regarding this questions! ill let you know if/when i hear from them!

 

[Andrewz00]

Wow that was quick!!! below is the reponse i got from Seachem:

Hello Andrew,

Thanks for the email. Prime does not necessarily remove the nitrates from the system, but binds to them making them inert and allowing for the biological filter to consume them. Here is a quote from our FAQ page on Prime:

Q: How does Prime make a difference in reducing Nitrates?

A: The detoxification of nitrite and nitrate by Prime (when used at elevated levels) is not well understood from a mechanistic standpoint. The most likely explanation is that the nitrite and nitrate is removed in a manner similar to the way ammonia is removed; i.e. it is bound and held in a inert state until such time that bacteria in the biological filter are able to take a hold of it, break it apart and use it. Two other possible scenarios are reduction to nitrogen (N2) gas or conversion into a benign organic nitrogen compound.
I wish we had some more "concrete" explanation, but the end result is the same, it does actually detoxify nitrite and nitrate. This was unexpected chemically and thus initially we were not even aware of this, however we received numerous reports from customers stating that when they overdosed with Prime they were able to reduce or eliminate the high death rates they experienced when their nitrite and nitrate levels were high. We have received enough reports to date to ensure that this is no fluke and is in fact a verifiable function of the product.

Prime will not impact the plants negatively by removing the nitrates. With fish waste and plant decay always being produced, there will inevitably be nitrogen available for your plants. In the future, if your tank becomes heavily planted and starts to have a very high growth rate, you may have to dose a nitrogen supplement to compensate for the utilization. I hope this addressed your concerns. Please let us know if you need further assistance. Have a great day!
Seachem Support 100215

 

[meegosh]

Thanks for posting that. I'm still interested to find out how many ppm of nitrates a recommended dose would actually remove. I got a pound of KNO3 so I was thinking dose a 5g to get to the 40ppm range then add the recommended dose of prime. I'll have to try this out this weekend maybe.

 

[Andrewz00]

from what i understand from the reply i got from Seachem... it doesnt actually "REMOVE" the nitrates... it simply detoxifies them (bound and held in a inert state until such time that bacteria in the biological filter are able to take a hold of it, break it apart and use it.)

does that mean the plants can also "break it apart and use it" ?

wonder if that would give a type of a false-positive reading from a test kit?

 

[BigJim]

It removes the nitrates by converting them to a non-toxic compound. I'd be curious to know what Prime converts nitrates into and how accessible the nitrogen in the mystery compound is to the plants.

I have a feeling Seachem knows more than they're letting on. I've heard from my LFS that Excel was discovered by accident as a byproduct. I have a hard time believing that Prime also has many unexpected beneficial qualities too. That's catching lightning in a bottle too many times.

 

[lordofworms]

Hmmm...Interesting. I mean I know I was probably being over the top with that question but I just started worrying about it because as it stands when I test my water i am usually in the 0-10% range of Nitrates (my tank again is moderately to heavily planted) but I was assuming my plants were eating the rest..obvious enough but then dosing prime in water changes I am curious as to how much harm I am doing, well maybe harm is a strong word...seachem states it wont 'harm' your plants...yes that may be true but it could surely stunt them I am thinking?
maybe i should start testing/dosing nitrates now?? i dont want to stop using seachem as I like their line of products and its very convenient for me to get locally.

 

[Andrewz00]

well.... i did it again! contacted SeaChem directly.... this time referring to this post exactly... and insisting that they become more active on these forums... well see the response this time!

 

[Crepe]

Go for it. It would be interesting to see an algae scape. I imagine it would be very hard to balance. You could probably purchase pure strains of algae from a biological supply store. Ask your local college.

 

[timwag2001]

i think that it removes/detoxifies/whatever they claim it does to organic nitrogen. however potassium nitrate that most of us dose i think is unaffected because its not oraganic

 

[Andrewz00]

SeaChems Reponce to me latest email:

Hello Again,
Thanks for pointing us to this discussion. It is generally frowned upon for manufacturer's to come into public forums and discuss their products without actually being a forum sponsor. Out of respect for this online community, I will not post in the thread, but will be happy to answer anyone's questions about Prime (or any other product) in our forum, through emails, or phone calls. As mentioned in the FAQ, the mechanism employed in the detoxification of nitrate is not clear. Through sufficient and repeated anecdotal evidence, we have found that Prime is able to impact the toxicity of nitrite and nitrate, but it does not reduce the levels of these compounds in the aquarium. Thus, the ability of a hobbyist-grade test kit to discern the impact of Prime on nitrates, to our knowledge, is not possible. The nitrates are still present in the water until they have been "removed" via consumption (by plants or beneficial bacteria) or physical removal. The amount of nitrates that will be able to be "detoxified" by Prime is likely dependent upon many variables (ie: pH, amount of other compounds present in the water, etc., etc.) causing it to be even more difficult for us to quantify and exact amount for you on the bottle. This is why we choose not to provide this information as it will not be accurate to our standards. I will inquire with the research department here to see if, at some point in the future, they can look into a study that might be able to provide a little more insight into this aspect of Prime. We really appreciate everyone's support of our products over there at aquariumadvice.com and are more than happy to answer any additional questions or concerns with regard to this. You can contact us via the following methods:

support@seachem.com
Seachem Support Forums
( 888 ) 732-0003

Thanks!

Tech Support 10201

 

[meegosh]

That is kind of what I figured the response would be. If they really found a way to reduce nitrates I think they would market a separate product just for that purpose. Guess I don't need to do my experiment after all.

Thanks for posting your response.