Can't get nitrates under control - need drastic action

[Allistah]

Hello all --

I have a 55 gallon tank thats 4' long and about 20" high. I've got various cichlids (about 11) in there that are about 2.5" - 5" long in there along with a Pleco, a catfish thats about 6" long, and a crawfish.

It was my ex wifes tank and when the divorce started she stopped caring for the tank. As soon as she moved out I started taking care of it about 5 months ago. It went without care for so long, the nitrate levels were out of this world and off the charts. Nothing died - which is amazing. But now that I'm giving the tank attention, I cannot for the life of me get the nitrate levels down to a respectable level. I've done vacuuming, and water changes. I've done probably 5-6 50% water changes over the past 2 months.

The problem is that there is so much waste in the gravel that any time I move anything around in the tank, it stirs up more nitrates that are embedded in the gravel. It's pretty nasty. Every time I touch anything in the tank I think the stuff that gets stirred up just pollutes the tank again. She let it go for so long that I think something drastic needs to happen to fix it.

This has got to get under control now. What I want to do is completely clean ALL the gravel to get all that dirty stuff out of there so that I can manage it like a regular tank would be managed including all of the chemicals in the water so they can be monitored and be seen within normal ranges.

I want to take all of the fish out of the tank somehow, remove all the water, take the tank into the back yard and use the hose to literally wash all the gravel until the water runs crystal clear and then set the tank up again in the house after the water temp has come back to the right temp.

How can I do this without killing my fish? Since it will be 100% new water, can I just get the water temp up to where it should be and add conditioners and then put the fish back in?

I just have to do this right and get this tank clean and the nitrate levels under control.

I was thinking of taking all the fish out of the tank into fish bags like you do at the fish store and setting them into the top of a 10 gallon tank so they won't change temp too much while I do this. Is there any better way to do this?

If anyone has any tips for me I would appreciate it.

-Alli

 

[CementShoes]

Plastic tub: siphon the existing water into the tub, put the fish , decorations, heater, air stone. Take your filter media and out it in there too to save the bacteria.

Clean your tank, refill, acclimate, re-introduce.

Ditch the old water.

Be sure to match your water paramters (minus the nitrates of course) as close as possible (ph, temp, hardness, etc). Watch for possible mini cycle, treat with Prime as needed.

 

[Allistah]

How big should the tub be for this? The fish won't wig out or start attacking each other while they're in the tub? What came to mind was a plastic tub you get from the hardware store for storage or something? It doesn't have to go very big I would imagine?

 

[neurotik]

I would be a bit hesitant about removing everything from the tank entirely and trying to rinse everything off that way, because that may put you at risk of having to re-cycle the tank for a bit after you get it all set back up.

What does the tank look like visually, as far as the water goes and what not? Is it cloudy? If so, what color is the cloudiness, white or more greenish? Is there a lot of algae on the glass and so forth, and can you easily rub it off with a sponge or algae scraper or something?

If I were in this situation, I think I would start off by just gravel vacuuming the tank every single day and just be gentle with the gravel while doing so, you don't need to rip everything up and move it all around the tank as far as decorations and so forth are concerned. Just gently work your way around the bottom of the tank, pushing the vacuum down into the gravel a bit and letting it suck up some of the gunk, slowly lifting it back up just enough to move it over an inch or so to the next section of gravel and doing the same thing, until you have slowly worked your way all around the entire bottom of the tank that is accessible with your gravel vac. Each day that you are gravel vacuuming, try to remove about 25% of the water and then stop vacuuming for that day. Replace the water that you removed, add conditioner, and then wait until the following day. Be sure to never miss a day, and I would think if you do that for a solid week or more that you will start to see your nitrates drop down to a reasonable level. It just takes some time, patience, and consistent partial water changes until you are completely caught back up on the whole maintenance schedule and then you can go back to doing partial water changes on a weekly basis like most people do with their tanks.

Lastly, what type of water test kit are you using to test for your nitrate levels? I'm also curious if you are getting any ammonia or nitrite levels when you test your water each time, or if you are only getting nitrate readings from the tank.

Respond back when you get a chance and hopefully we can get your tank back to where it needs to be!

 

[spoonman]

I use the plastic tubs that they sell to put beer kegs in. They have the rope handles. I think they are usually about $5 or $6. Put an airstone and the filter media in their like cement said and you should be fine. I was in the same situation moving a 115G from a friends house to mine. The only thing I kept was the filter media. Everything else was either cleaned or new. Just use water to clean and dont use chemicals. And make sure that you dechlor the water and match the temp. Good luck!

 

[CementShoes]

I would disagree, if the filter media and decorations are saved and kept intact the chance of a major cycle is minimal. Nothing wrong with a clean start when things get that bad.

Why do you assert that a full recycle may be needed?

The tub doesn't need to be that big. I assume you plan on cleaning and rebuilding right away (same day).

 

[neurotik]

My mistake, I was about to head out to lunch so I briefly skimmed through the post and I thought he was just planning to rip everything out and start fresh and not preserve any of the filter media or anything along those lines.

As others have suggested though, the tub method should work just fine if you feel that is the only way to get things under control, but I still personally feel as though that is a lot of extra work to fix a problem that could more than likely be fixed through daily partial water changes for a week or two and proper gravel vacuuming.

 

[CementShoes]

"I've done probably 5-6 50% water changes"

 

[spoonman]

I've got various cichlids (about 11) in there that are about 2.5" - 5" long in there along with a Pleco, a catfish thats about 6" long, and a crawfish.

I would use a good size container just to minimize the stress. That is alot of relatively big fish. You will also probably need to put something over it to keep them from jumping out.

 

[neurotik]

"I've done probably 5-6 50% water changes"

Yes, in a two month period of time he said. I've done that same amount on my 55 gallon that is in perfect condition in the last two months just by doing once a week PWC.

Doing PWC on a daily basis for a week or two would make a much bigger difference over time than only doing them once a week over a two month period of time, especially if you are trying to lower the amount of something in your water and clean it up a bit.

Either way, choose whichever solution feels right to you. I've just always thought that if you can fix something through a series of daily PWC that it is better to do that than to risk losing fish due to moving them from your tank to a tub and stressing them out more in the process, and having to carry around a big tank and so forth. If it was a small tank, sure, I'd say quickly empty it out and rinse it and change the gravel out and be done with it, but on a big 55 gallon it is a bit more time consuming and you will need someone to help you move the tank around and what not more than likely.

Good luck with whichever you choose to do though! Keep us updated on the situation.

 

[Allistah]

Thanks for all the info guys. Yeah, the filter, all the rocks, and the gravel will be staying. I just need to wash out all the gunk from the gravel so that when something moves it doesn't cloud up the tank again andstir up more nitrates from gravel. You have no idea - this tank went without any care for probably almost 6 months. No water changes, no filter changes, no vacuuming, nothing. The only reason they lived was because there was a bunch of live plants in there which they ate over time. It's really frustrating trying to get it back to "normal" and I know how I am.. If I get frustrated over a longer period of time I'll just give up. So I need to fix it so I can move forward and feel like I'm making the tank work right. I haven't made any progress in the past couple of months so I need to step up the actions to physically remove the problem.

Thanks again for all the posts. I'll be doing this this coming weekend and I'll post back the results.

-Alli

 

[neurotik]

That sounds like a pretty terrible situation, I feel so bad for the fish

Good luck this weekend!

 

[spoonman]

What kind of filter does this tank have on it. If it is a HOB does it have 2 places for media? If it does, do you guys think it would be a good idea to swap out one of them?

 

[Allistah]

The filter is an AquaClear 110 HOB. It's got the big square sponge at the bottom, then I have one of those ammonia(white)/charcoal combo chemical filter, then the white bio rock things along with a bag of de-nitrate on the top to try and help soak up the nitrates.

I just put the white/black chemical bag in there 4 days ago so I'm going to be keeping the filter exactly the same. All I will do is rinse off the sponge filter to get out all the chunks of stuff thats caught in there.

Looks like I'll do this on Sunday when my girlfriend is home and can help me out.

 

[spoonman]

Sounds like a plan. Good luck and keep us informed.

 

[Allistah]

I forgot to report that the nitrate test kit that I'm using is from API (Aquarium Pharmaceuticles). Here is a picture of it for reference. I always make sure that I shake it as instructed for the correct times.

Nitrate Test Kit - API

Is this test kit any good? Is there a better one that I should be using?

 

[neurotik]

That test kit should be fine. That is the same nitrate test kit that is included in API's freshwater master test kit, which also includes tests for pH, ammonia, and nitrite as well. The main thing you want to stay away from when it comes to test kits are those strip tests, they are usually pretty inaccurate. Liquid/drop tests are much better.

 

[spoonman]

Thats the one I use. No problems for me.

 

[Allistah]

Hey all --

Short version:
---------------------
(Tank is a 55 gal long, contains about 10 African cichlids, a pleco, a catfish, and a crawdad)
I got the water transfusion done and cleaned all the gravel so it's nice and clear. Numerous fish are "scratching" where they go next to a rock or something and quickly rub their body on it. Any idea what this is and what I need to do to fix it? If I put the same rock back in and the same filter thats been established, will the tank go through another cycle? Or is it a filter that goes through the cycle?


Before I moved the fish back, I took chemical readings:

• Ph - 8.0
• Ammonia - 0.25
• Nitrite - 0.0
• Nitrate - 0.0

I have the heater set at 79 degrees. I'll be taking chemical readings every other day to make sure things are stable and don't get out of whack and then start spacing the readings out as I see that things are stable.

Long version:
---------------------
I just got done with my tank transfusion about two hours ago. I bought two 19 gallon round tubs and started by putting current tank water into the tubs. Then when there was enough water I moved the rocks into the tubs. I then put more water in the tubs until they were about 3-4" from the top of the tubs. Then I transferred the fish one by one into the tubs. I also put the airstones in the tubs as well. Then I drained the remaining water from the tank and took it out on the back lawn. I then proceded to use the hose to wash out the gravel. It was so dirty that the water was dark brown and you couldn't see through it at all. I would clean the gravel and dump the water, rinse, repeat. I must have done this about 25 times or so until the water stopped getting any cleaner. Dumped all the water out again and brought it back inside where I then proceded to fill it up. I filled it up and then installed the new Fluval E200 heater. I started by moving all the rock back into the tank and moving the air stones back as well. Once it was up to temp I used bags to move the fish back into the tank to make sure there wasn't any temp difference. Once I got all the fish back in things are going well. I have however noticed that some of the fish are "scratching" (I think it's called). The go next to a rock or something and then with a quick move rub themselves on it. Not sure what to look for here but any tips would be appreciated.

Thanks,

-Alli

 

[Allistah]

Hrm, I'm also noticing that some of the fish have front fin damage now. I'm guessing from being in the tubs with the rocks. Will that take care of itself or is there something that I should do to help these fins heal up?