Dual 20 gallon and 55 gallon fishless water cycle and builds

[graphicpunk]

So I bought a couple $20 20 gallon tanks off Craigslist to put in my garage and these tanks will mainly serve as holding tanks for the winter until I can move my fish back into the pond. The 55 gallon is more of my "show" tank and my indoor office tank. After joining this forum I have some ideas to sort of redo that tank plus it needs a good cleaning.

I am going with the separate tanks because I don't want to over crowd my 55gallon. I have lost a couple fish, over the winter last year, possibly because of over crowding the tank. I am sure it was water quality as well since I used to think "cycling" the tank was just letting it sit for a few days before you put the fish in.

Anyway on to the cycling process. I am getting one of my 20gals set up for cycling process so I can move the one fish from the 55gal into this 20gal while I clean out and cycle the 55gal.

I have at least a dozen goldies out in my pond plus one koi. At least 3 of the goldies are 6"+ and the other handful are between 2" and 4". My plan is to permanently move the big goldies into the 55gal while the other ones will make the switch from tank to pond.

On to the cycle. I started buying supplies for these 20gal builds and my first question is if I got the right Ammonia? I was at Fleet Farm and I just happen to ask if they had "pure ammonia" and they directed me to the isle where they had 3 different types. I choose the "original" ammonia which happens to be clear. The other two I think were fancy ammonia I think. They were different, darker colors.

Anyway here are a couple pics and I need to know if I got the right stuff before I start the process?

Is there anyway to tell if this is the pure ammonia?

Otherwise I bought the API Freshwater Master Kit and a few other supplies I didn't have before. I got the water in and the filter going all while the heater is heating up the water. Just be a day or two before the water gets up to the right temp to begin.

Erik

 

[Jacca]

Welcome to AA. On the ammonia check and see if it contains Sufacants if it does say shake the bottle and see if it foams up like soap if it does then it is no good. Good luck with your cycling I am currently cycling 2 55's and getting ready to start cycling a 10 soon.

 

[graphicpunk]

Nope doesn't say it contains that. Doesn't say it contains anything other than Ammonia. I have done the shake test and it doesn't foam up. Hopefully this stuff works I am going to start the process tonight. The tank has been heated up to the right temp.

 

[Jacca]

Well hopefully it goes quick and I will be subscribing to this thread.

 

[graphicpunk]

I checked the tank this morning and it was above 83 degrees so I turned the heater down and when I get home I will start my installments of Ammonia.

Here are a couple pics to boot:

I took some gravel from my 55 gallon and some gravel from one of the used 20 gallons to hopefully speed up the process. Water is still a little cloudy from the sand but it was clearer this morning.

 

[graphicpunk]

Water is cooking up to 86 degrees so I put the Ammonia in. I put a little too much in. My reading was over 8ppm. So I did a water change, which cooled off the water a bit and now I am just waiting to see if I knocked the Ammonia down a bit.

 

[graphicpunk]

Ok so I believe I am good to go. I got the Ammonia levels between 4.0ppm and 8.0ppm and I didn't want to do another water change. I put too much Ammonia in to begin with and I probably changed out 15 gallons of water in a 20 gallon tank. I hope I am fine with not being right on the dot with the 4.0ppm. I would assume the same process takes place it just takes a little longer since there is more Ammonia.

Since I got the API Freshwater Master kit I tested all the other stuff as well to sort of get a baseline.

Here is my first nights log:

Friday Sept. 23rd water temp 80-94 degrees

Ammonia between 4.0ppm - 8.0ppm
Nitrite around 5.0ppm
Nitrate between 0ppm - 5.0ppm
PH 7.6+ (off the chart)
PH High 8.8 + (darker than the chart)

So I don't know if these reading are normal and what you are looking for when cycling the tank.

Let me know if there might be any concerns here because I have no problem draining the tank and starting over. I just want to get it right.

 

[eco23]

Ok so I believe I am good to go. I got the Ammonia levels between 4.0ppm and 8.0ppm and I didn't want to do another water change. I put too much Ammonia in to begin with and I probably changed out 15 gallons of water in a 20 gallon tank. I hope I am fine with not being right on the dot with the 4.0ppm. I would assume the same process takes place it just takes a little longer since there is more Ammonia.

Since I got the API Freshwater Master kit I tested all the other stuff as well to sort of get a baseline.

Here is my first nights log:

Friday Sept. 23rd water temp 80-94 degrees

Ammonia between 4.0ppm - 8.0ppm
Nitrite around 5.0ppm
Nitrate between 0ppm - 5.0ppm
PH 7.6+ (off the chart)
PH High 8.8 + (darker than the chart)

So I don't know if these reading are normal and what you are looking for when cycling the tank.

Let me know if there might be any concerns here because I have no problem draining the tank and starting over. I just want to get it right.

Ummm.......odd.

First, 4ppm really is what you want to shoot for. Too far over and you'll just slow down and complicate your cycle.

NitrIte already at 5ppm? Has this tank been cycling for a lot longer than I thought? 5ppm nitrIte starting out initially should be an impossibility unless you've already had fish in there before (and in a really bad situation).

Unless you've got nitrAte in your tap water...the reading should be zero in an uncycled tank.

Normally pH is of no concern...but 8.8+ may be reason for worry. One of the things I've seen with impure ammonia is that it launches your pH up.

First thing is let me know if I read too fast and missed anything different about the tank other than adding some seeded media. Was there an ammonia source in there previously?

Second, test your tap water. We've got to find out if any of those levels are coming from your water source (hopefully not).

 

[graphicpunk]

This tank is new to me. Since I cleaned it there has been no fish in it. A little background on that for the record. I cleaned it out with water and vinegar to get any left over lime, chemical build up. Not sure if that would affect anything.

2nd I got some play sand from Menards but I properly cleaned it using a 5 gallon bucket.

3rd I do have a live bamboo stick in there from Ikea. Not sure if that would affect anything but I just want to get all the details in the open.

4th I added some natural rock (2 big slabs) from my yard but I pressure washed them and let them dry before adding them to the tank.

Finally that heater was in my 55gallon tank a few months back when I had an outbreak of ich with some koi's and some other goldfish. I had to raise the water temp to get rid of the ich. Also moved some rocks and an air stone from my 55gal which has a case of Alge growing.

Also I do believe I have a carbon based filter. I just bought it the other night. It is a Aqueon QuiteFlow rated for 20 gallons.

Just trying to get any info I can to make sure we can figure this out. Should I just fill up the tubes with my tap water and run the same tests to see what the water is at. Supposedly, in my city, we have the cleanest water (which might not be the best for fish tanks).

If this still doesn't make sense I will do a full water change and start over. I do think I put way too much Ammonia in the tank to start with. It now sounds like just a little bit is all you need. I also put in some dechlorinator+water conditioner.

Let me know if this helps at all?

 

[eco23]

Yeah, I'd run the exact same tests on water directly out of your faucet, there's just some thing that don't add up.

Depending on what type of rocks you used there's the potential they're raising the pH...but the no2 level is the real mind blower here.

*Also, just FYI bamboo isn't fully aquatic. I don't know the the exact placement...but I think you've got to keep the top out of water or it's a goner. Some people have had luck keeping in the tank though...just worth keeIng an eye on.

 

[graphicpunk]

Testing the water right out of the faucet. I will get you the results soon. I can already say the Ammo, right out of the faucet, looks to already be at like a 0.25ppm. Not sure if that is natural.

Also with these test tubes I can just rinse them out and that shouldn't affect the next tests right? I just want to make sure I am doing the tests right. X amount of drops, shake or twist and then wait?

 

[eco23]

Testing the water right out of the faucet. I will get you the results soon. I can already say the Ammo, right out of the faucet, looks to already be at like a 0.25ppm. Not sure if that is natural.

Also with these test tubes I can just rinse them out and that shouldn't affect the next tests right? I just want to make sure I am doing the tests right. X amount of drops, shake or twist and then wait?

Yeah, I think you're supposed to rinse them in tap water and let them air dry after doing tests. Just make sure you're following the instructions in the booklet, not just what it says on the bottles.

I'll be online for a few more minutes then I'm turning in. If I don't see your results I'll check em out tomorrow.

 

[graphicpunk]

That could be a problem. I was running tests but I don't think I was letting the tubes properly dry out.

Here are my test results in picture form

Then my PH levels were like 7.6 for low and around 8.0 for the high. Maybe I will rinse out the tubes let them dry over night and do more tests tomorrow.

Thanks for all your help so far!

 

[eco23]

That could be a problem. I was running tests but I don't think I was letting the tubes properly dry out.

Here are my test results in picture form

Then my PH levels were like 7.6 for low and around 8.0 for the high. Maybe I will rinse out the tubes let them dry over night and do more tests tomorrow.

Thanks for all your help so far!

Sounds good...that nitrIte test is throwing me for a loop. I agree to clean it really well and let it air dry...then retest tomorrow. Have a good night

 

[graphicpunk]

So I did a 90% water change and I got the Ammonia down to where I had to add a little bit to get it back up to 4.0ppm. I also tested the Nitrite and Nitrates and yielded the same results.

Nitrite 5.0ppm
Nitrate about a 5.0ppm. It was the same result as when I tested it straight out of the faucet. So I guess my tap water already has ammonia and nitrates in it. I don't know what I can do other than just let it sit for a few days and retest it?

 

[graphicpunk]

Update.

So I have used this stuff in one of my tanks to help speed up the process:
Nutrafin Cycle Biological Aquarium Supplement - Water Clarifiers - Water Conditioners - PetSmart

I know I should be trying to create bacteria naturally but I have less than a month to get my fish out of the pond and I don't have the time to wait. I got that tank to the point where I can put the Ammonia back to 4.0ppm and by the next day it is back to zero. The nitrites are also off the chart. Just waiting for the Nitrates to go off the chart to do my fist major water change.

My question is my water already comes with Ammonia, Nitrites and Nitrates in it. I bought some Prime to neutralize it. Should I prime the water before adding it into my tank? Or what other options are there to neutralize my water before trying to cycle a tank?

Right now I have the two 20 gallons cycling out in my garage. I need to at least get the one tank ready so I can move the one fish out of the 55 gallon so I can start on cleaning and cycling that tank. Once I can get something established I might go back later on and properly start to cycle the tanks.

 

[eco23]

Update.

So I have used this stuff in one of my tanks to help speed up the process:
Nutrafin Cycle Biological Aquarium Supplement - Water Clarifiers - Water Conditioners - PetSmart

I know I should be trying to create bacteria naturally but I have less than a month to get my fish out of the pond and I don't have the time to wait. I got that tank to the point where I can put the Ammonia back to 4.0ppm and by the next day it is back to zero. The nitrites are also off the chart. Just waiting for the Nitrates to go off the chart to do my fist major water change.

My question is my water already comes with Ammonia, Nitrites and Nitrates in it. I bought some Prime to neutralize it. Should I prime the water before adding it into my tank? Or what other options are there to neutralize my water before trying to cycle a tank?

Right now I have the two 20 gallons cycling out in my garage. I need to at least get the one tank ready so I can move the one fish out of the 55 gallon so I can start on cleaning and cycling that tank. Once I can get something established I might go back later on and properly start to cycle the tanks.

Oh dude, you were so close to doing it naturally. The Nutrafin is not one of the respected brands...and one I'd definitely recommend against using. However, since you're so far into your cycle it shouldn't make a world of difference.

If you're using buckets, add Prime to each individual one before adding it to the tank. If you're using a water changing system, add the Prime directly to the tank before refilling based on the entire volume of the aquarium...not just what you're replacing.

 

[graphicpunk]

Oh I didn't know that wasn't a trusted brand. It seemed to help the cycle along a bit.

So can I just transfer some of the water from the almost cycled tank to the not cycled tank to help speed that one up? I just bought some more of that nutrafin but if I can avoid it I will return it.

Both these 20 gallon tanks have the same set up. So same filters, same water heaters same air tubes.

 

[graphicpunk]

And I use a siphon to do water changes. So I use standard 5 gallon buckets. I will add a little Prime to each one when I do the 50% water change.

 

[graphicpunk]

I figure I will add a couple photos of the two tanks in action.

This is the second tank cleaned out before I put in the sand and water

Here is tank two currently cycling:

Here is tank one which is getting close to being cycled:

And a shot of both tanks:

The water has cleared up nicely after cleaning the sand. Can't wait to get in and clean my 55 gallon tank!