Fishless Tank Holds Cycle For 1 Month?

[McLumpy]

Ok, I'm not exactly sure if this is a topic worth posting about or not, but I need some input from the cycle experts as I've never ran into this situation.

I have a 10g tank that housed a Betta and 2 ADF's. I lost my Betta a month ago and I ended up moving my 2 ADF's to my 55g tank. I had intended on breaking down the tank and storing it away, but that never happened. In fact, I left the filter running and lights off, then just never got around to doing anything w/ the tank.

Today I decided I was going to break it down this weekend and start up a new cycle w/ seeded media. But, to my surprise, I tested the water parameters tonight and they were... Ammonia-0, Nitrite-0, Nitrate-40, pH-7.6.

Is this right? Can a tank, w/ nothing feeding the bacteria, really hold a cycle for a month? I'm not complaining at all... I think it's great! I guess I'm just confused about how it's still holding the cycle? Decaying food in the gravel, maybe?

 

[rich311k]

It was probably 0,0 when the stock was removed. With nothing to add ammonia of course the ammonia would still be zero. To test the cycle add some ammonia and see what happens.

 

[McLumpy]

It was probably 0,0 when the stock was removed. With nothing to add ammonia of course the ammonia would still be zero. To test the cycle add some ammonia and see what happens.

This is my first experience w/ a tank that sat dormant for a month. I guess, for some reason, I was thinking that w/o fish in the tank that the good bacteria would die off and I would need to cycle the tank again.

Man, I feel like a total n00b.

What exactly would adding Ammonia tell me about the cycle?

 

[rich311k]

Adding ammonia will show you whether or not any BB survive. I imagine the tank needs to recycle.

 

[McLumpy]

Adding ammonia will show you whether or not any BB survive. I imagine the tank needs to recycle.

Unfortunately, I don't have any ammonia to add to the tank... so I guess that test is out of the question.

My original plan was to drain the tank completely, refill w/ fresh dechlorinated water, and do a quick cycle w/ seeded media from my 55g. However, when I saw that the water parameters were unchanged from when I had stock in the tank, I figured I could just do a large pwc, a thorough gravel vac, and add the seeded media.

 

[rich311k]

That will be fine. There is no ammonia or nitrites because there was nothing to put it in the tank, ie stock. Do a water change add seeded media and you should be good to go.

 

[McLumpy]

That will be fine. There is no ammonia or nitrites because there was nothing to put it in the tank, ie stock. Do a water change add seeded media and you should be good to go.

That's what I figured I could do, but wanted to get some input first. I really didn't want to drain it completely and start w/ a new cycle.

Thanks for your help!

 

[James_in_MN]

Unfortunately, I don't have any ammonia to add to the tank... so I guess that test is out of the question.

A bottle of janitor strength (pure) ammonia at Ace Hardware is less than $5. I think that's a small price to pay to find out if there is still bacteria in the filter media.

When I was cycling my 10g tank, I accidentally discovered that the nitrogen cycle bacteria live at least 2 weeks (that's how long the conference was that I had to leave for mid-cycle). What's to say they couldn't possibly live longer?

You have a chance to find out.

 

[Flossie]

But if there were any left over food or waste it could use that right ?? Idk I'm a Newbie for sure lol

 

[jsoong]

If there is gunk in the tank, there might be some bacteria surviving, and you would not need to go through a cycle from scratch.

So unless there is disease in the tank, I would not take it down & sterilize it.

OTOH, since you have a 55 to seed the tank with, it would make no difference (in cycling time) either way.

 

[McLumpy]

Thanks for the advice/comments, guys!

Yesterday, I performed a pwc, changed out the filter media w/ one that was seeded from my 55g, and tested the water parameters later in the day... all was good!

I went to Petco to get a few plants for my 55g and found myself looking at Bettas. Eh, yep... I got a one! lol I told myself I wasn't going to, but I couldn't help it!! He looks just like the little guy I lost not too long ago. So far he's doing extremely well in his new home!

Unfortunately, after I got him settled in, I discovered that the light fixture above the 10g was FUBAR so he had to sit in the dark until I got a new one at Petco today. And, well, while I was there... I got 2 Bamboo Shrimp and some snails to keep the Betta company. lol They have also made themselves at home... and the new light fixture is working great!

As far as how my tank held the cycle so long... let me tell ya, when I did a gravel vac, there was a lot of 'gunk' in there! For once, my procrastination pays off in a positive way! lol

 

[Flossie]

Thanks for the advice/comments, guys!

Yesterday, I performed a pwc, changed out the filter media w/ one that was seeded from my 55g, and tested the water parameters later in the day... all was good!

I went to Petco to get a few plants for my 55g and found myself looking at Bettas. Eh, yep... I got a one! lol I told myself I wasn't going to, but I couldn't help it!! He looks just like the little guy I lost not too long ago. So far he's doing extremely well in his new home!

Unfortunately, after I got him settled in, I discovered that the light fixture above the 10g was FUBAR so he had to sit in the dark until I got a new one at Petco today. And, well, while I was there... I got 2 Bamboo Shrimp and some snails to keep the Betta company. lol They have also made themselves at home... and the new light fixture is working great!

As far as how my tank held the cycle so long... let me tell ya, when I did a gravel vac, there was a lot of 'gunk' in there! For once, my procrastination pays off in a positive way! lol

That's awesome I'm patiently waiting on my fishless cycle.... I'm almost there yay!! Im just a Newbie but I was thinking if there were enough debris in the tank it could keep the BB fed .. So for once the dirtiness is a good thing huh ?? Lol!! oh and congrats on the new betta

 

[McLumpy]

That's awesome I'm patiently waiting on my fishless cycle.... I'm almost there yay!! Im just a Newbie but I was thinking if there were enough debris in the tank it could keep the BB fed .. So for once the dirtiness is a good thing huh ?? Lol!! oh and congrats on the new betta

Thanks! Yeah, about the cycle, had I not been a busy mom, taking care of a hyper toddler, I would have cleaned the tank a month ago! Kudos to my little guy for keeping me from starting all over on the tank!

You're cycling a 55g, right? A good size piece of Mopani Wood, (found in the reptile section of Petco), would look great in there and your Pleco will love it! That's what I did w/ my 55g and my Pleco is constantly resting beneath the wood. It's good for their digestive system too.

Good luck on your cycle!

 

[eco23]

Hi guys, I don't mean to rain on any parades, but I don't think the tank is still cycled :-( The nitrAtes are a stage of the nitrogen cycle and are not as easily converted into the final stages as ammo and no2 are. I think what is most likely is that the no3 levels are remnants of the previously stocked tank and have not been converted by anaerobic bacteria into gas so they still appear on your tests.

The good news is that since you have the seeded filter media you'll have a huge head start on re-cycling the tank. You can either VERY slowly stock the tank keeping a constant eye out for ammonia spikes, or IMO the best option would be to do a fishless cycle with pure ammo if your new Betta would be suitably re-homed for a bit in the 55 gallon. The seeded media would result in a super fast fishless cycle and would allow you to stock the tank much, much faster and safer.

 

[McLumpy]

UGH!! Eco, are you trying to make me twitchy?! lol I have a Betta, 2 Bamboo Shrimp, and Snails in there! If there was any doubt in my mind, I would never add them to an uncycled tank. Which is why I made this thread. I wanted to make sure before I added anything to the tank. But now... you're definitely making me feel like I'm full of fail! lol

So, would it be uncycled even w/ the parameters that I posted earlier? They tested close to identical after the pwc. I didn't check them again though after I added some decor from my 55g. When I initially setup the tank a couple of months ago, I used the same method, (added seeded media/decor), and it cycled immediately.

Ok, now I want to test the parameters again!! lol

Oh and there's no way a male Betta would make 'friends' in my 55g. I have a Red Tail Shark that got a beating from the last male Betta that my husband insisted on putting in there. I could see my Shark seeking revenge w/ this one. lol

 

[eco23]

UGH!! Eco, are you trying to make me twitchy?! lol I have a Betta, 2 Bamboo Shrimp, and Snails in there! If there was any doubt in my mind, I would never add them to an uncycled tank. Which is why I made this thread. I wanted to make sure before I added anything to the tank. But now... you're definitely making me feel like I'm full of fail! lol

So, would it be uncycled even w/ the parameters that I posted earlier? They tested close to identical after the pwc. I didn't check them again though after I added some decor from my 55g. When I initially setup the tank a couple of months ago, I used the same method, (added seeded media/decor), and it cycled immediately.

Ok, now I want to test the parameters again!! lol

Oh and there's no way a male Betta would make 'friends' in my 55g. I have a Red Tail Shark that got a beating from the last male Betta that my husband insisted on putting in there. I could see my Shark seeking revenge w/ this one. lol

Sorry, been out of town, lol. Honestly, with a bio-load as light as you have, mixed with the media from the other tank...I wouldn't worry about it. Just keep a close eye for ammo spikes. The 55 gallons filter will do wonders for you, and as long as you don't throw too many fish in too quickly it'll be fine. The fishless cycle would be ideal...but not necessary with how you've gone about it.

People set up QT's like you have all the time and it works fine. I just don't want you to go crazy and try to max out the bio-load...and for future reference for people without seeding material from another tank...I didn't want them to think this was how it worked. No worries, just keep an eye out and stock slowly and everything will be fine

 

[eco23]

But yeah, sorry...I didn't mean to freak you out...I just don't want other people to see the title of the thread and think a tank will hold a cycle indefinitely...it doesn't. Even if there was some level of rotting food in the substrate...it might be enough to begin a cycle, but would die off when that ammo source was depleted.

 

[McLumpy]

Sorry, been out of town, lol. Honestly, with a bio-load as light as you have, mixed with the media from the other tank...I wouldn't worry about it. Just keep a close eye for ammo spikes. The 55 gallons filter will do wonders for you, and as long as you don't throw too many fish in too quickly it'll be fine. The fishless cycle would be ideal...but not necessary with how you've gone about it.

People set up QT's like you have all the time and it works fine. I just don't want you to go crazy and try to max out the bio-load...and for future reference for people without seeding material from another tank...I didn't want them to think this was how it worked. No worries, just keep an eye out and stock slowly and everything will be fine

Whew!!! Ok, that makes me feel a little better. No worries on me maxing out the bio-load, trust me! In fact, I don't plan on getting any other fish or critters for at least another couple of weeks. I always make sure my first round of stock survives first. Then the next stock will be put in my QT for a couple of weeks, then moved to my 10g.

Thanks again for the input! I will keep an eye on the parameters.

 

[James_in_MN]

But yeah, sorry...I didn't mean to freak you out...I just don't want other people to see the title of the thread and think a tank will hold a cycle indefinitely...it doesn't. Even if there was some level of rotting food in the substrate...it might be enough to begin a cycle, but would die off when that ammo source was depleted.

The problem, Eco, is that there is limited information on the web on how long the nitrogen cycle bacteria are capable of surviving without a food source.

I can tell you from personal experience that the bacteria are capable of surviving for 2 weeks. I left midway through a fishless cycle for a conference that lasted for 2 weeks, and still had bacteria in the tank that immediately sprang back into action when I added ammonia.

If nitrogen cycle bacteria can live for 2 weeks, who's to say they can't live for 3? Or 4? Or a month? There isn't enough information on the web to clearly say either way.

Here's my thread on the topic of my 10g bacteria test.

http://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums/f12/bacteria-longevity-test-148088.html

 

[eco23]

The problem, Eco, is that there is limited information on the web on how long the nitrogen cycle bacteria are capable of surviving without a food source.

I can tell you from personal experience that the bacteria are capable of surviving for 2 weeks. I left midway through a fishless cycle for a conference that lasted for 2 weeks, and still had bacteria in the tank that immediately sprang back into action when I added ammonia.

If nitrogen cycle bacteria can live for 2 weeks, who's to say they can't live for 3? Or 4? Or a month? There isn't enough information on the web to clearly say either way.

Here's my thread on the topic of my 10g bacteria test.

http://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums/f12/bacteria-longevity-test-148088.html

Yeah, I remember taking part in the thread. While it was interesting, I think its a totally different situation than here. For one, you were in the process of fishless cycling where you were adding 4ppm of ammo per day, the cycle was not complete and you had no2 present in the tank when you left. A fishless cycle at 4 ppm is designed to grow a huge amount of BB, which is not equal to a cycled tank where the bio-filter has adjusted to a actual stocked level. Also because you were mid-cycle and had no2 in the tank there was plenty of food remaining for no2 to no3 bacteria to continue colonizing while you were gone. I'd assume there was plenty of bacteria die off, but since a fishless cycle grows such a massive bio-filter and they really hadn't gone that long without food (4ppm ammo before you left and no2 remaining) there was still BB remaining to continue the nitrogen cycle.

The OP had a stocked, established tank with a much smaller colony of BB. When the fish were gone...the nitrifying bacteria were instantly deprived of food.... no one last big dose of 4ppm ammo, no remaining nitrItes. While some decaying organic matter might have provided some sort of food source, I can't imagine it sustaining them to a level that would keep the tank considered cycled. I think it would have very quickly become a fish in cycle if the tank was simply restocked because the tank was considered cycled.

Regardless, the OP will be fine since she has the 55 gallon filter, I just think it's a dangerous precedent to let people assume a tank will stay completely cycled after a month. I still think the reason it read 0's with remaining no3 is simply because anaerobic bacteria had not converted the nitrAtes. At the very least, the tank should be tested with pure ammo to see how much ammo it can convert to no3 in 24 hours before we assume anything.

It would have been interesting though if the OP had a bottle of ammo laying around before. I know where I'd put my $...but hey, I might be surprised