Help! Fishless cycle-Now worms appeared!

[animaluvr]

Hi there,

I have been doing a fishless cycle for the past few weeks... I am at the point where my ammonia goes to 0 and my Nitrites are spiking and Nitrates have appeared. But I also have these white worms that have appeared and are on the back of my fish tank. They are very small with a slightly larger head, almost like sperm. I read on line this is a sign of over feeding or a dirty tank but I have no fish!!! The tank has only been running for just over 3 weeks. How can it be dirty? Most importantly, how do I get rid of them before I put fish in! I have only put in gravel, new decorations, lava rock, stones, one real plant and two pieces of wood I bought at the store. I guess they came on the plant?

 

[gzeiger]

There are many species of worms that could have hitchhiked on the plant. If they are surviving without fish in the tank they shouldn't be harmful to your fish, though they can be unsightly. In many cases the problem will be self correcting because they will get eaten when you add fish. I wouldn't worry about it for now. They may just be feeding on microalgae. Ammonia you're adding right now is an excellent plant fertilizer, and there are airborne algae spores everywhere.

 

[krap101]

Are you adding pure ammonia or something like fish food/raw shrimp? If your using food, that's probably why.

 

[animaluvr]

I am adding pure ammonia. Micoalgae... I was wondering what they were eating. They just give me the creeps. I hope the fish eat them! I also found a very small snail this morning. That plant is causing more problems than its worth. I will think twice before adding anymore real ones. Hopefully my cycle will end soon and I can add the fish to eat them before I get too many.

 

[happygirl65]

I wouldn't worry about it. It's pretty common during the cycle. It is always a good idea to rinse plants really well and even do a hydrogen peroxide dip before putting them in the tank.

Once you add fish the little worms will get eaten no matter how many you have. And the snails are not always bad either they are almost a given in a planted tank. They can help control algae, some fish eat them, and as long as you don't over feed they won't get out of control.

 

[animaluvr]

Thanks everyone for the advice... from what everyone has said it looks like the fish will eat them when I put them in , but I was hoping there is something I could put in there now to kill them. Once the fish are in, if they don't eat them then I am limited with what I will be able to do to kill them.

 

[happygirl65]

Well, you could always dose a massive amount of ammonia....it will be pretty much starting your cycle over but it would more than likely kill them.

 

[animaluvr]

I read somewhere that if they are the panaria worms they like ammonia. I don't think I have the patience to start my cycle again... my poor son, he is almost 2, keep walking up to the tank and saying fish, fish. Poor little guy wants the fish a bad as I do. Is there anything at the LFS that I can buy?

 

[happygirl65]

If it bugs you that bad you can probably use something like CLOUT to kill it, it is a medication for parasites available at any pet store even walmart usually. It is supposed to be safe for your bio filter. It is fairly inexpensive as well. I understand wanting the peace of mind. This stuff is supposed to work on planaria.

I had planaria and nemotodes in two of my tanks as they cycled and within 1 day of adding fish they were all gone. They don't seem to exist in optimal water conditions only when things are a little funky as they are during a cycle.

 

[gzeiger]

If snails bother you a higher ammonia dose will certainly kill those. However, if you have a moment's patience to watch and explain what's happening I think snails would be at least as interesting as fish for a 2 year old. I can definitely remember watching snails in a fish tank when I was 3 or 4. My vote is to keep both and just let the fish handle the worms. I'm pretty confident they won't have any negative effect on the fish, and lots of people go to a fair amount of trouble to culture them as food for very young fry.

 

[animaluvr]

Oh yeah, I think the snails are cool. They are a bit small for my son to see but I have been carefull with my ammonia as to add just enough to keep my cycle going but hopefully not too much for the two little snails. If I add the clout will it kill my snails? If it would then I guess I will wait and have the fish take care of the problem. Looks like my Nitrites are starting to come down... I can see the light!!! I think my cycle is coming to an end. I am so glad for sites like this that told me about the fishless cycle. I had no idea even about cycles let alone what a regular one does to the poor fish. For my 50 gallon take if all goes well this weekend it would have taken me just over 3 weeks to cycle.

 

[Da Squid]

What is considered a high enough ammonia reading to kill snails? I've been cycling my tank for over a month with no success and the snails are the only moving thing I've got going for me I'd hate to accidentally kill them.

 

[gzeiger]

Once you see a noticable reduction in nitrite level you should be finished in no more than two days, maybe one. I don't know about Clout and snails. Snails will grow soon enough.

 

[animaluvr]

Thanks gzieger glad to know it should only be a few days... can't wait.

Da Squid - Now that my ammonia has spiked and is at 0 each day I have been adding enough to get it around 1-2ppm to keep the bacteria going. At first though before I knew I had the snails it was around 5ppm. The plant they must have arrived on was in the tank at the time so it looks like they survived that amount. One thing I did in the middle of my cycle that seemed to help was to raise the temperature. I had it around 79 at the start then read it should be high so I put it up to 83. Once I turned it up I noticed the ammonia dropping. It may have just been a coincidence but if your temp is low you may want to turn it up.

 

[Da Squid]

Thanks Anima, its good to know the little slugs will live at 5 ppm. Mine has been at 4 ppm for about a month now with the temp in the 85 range. I've got Many live plants set up thanks to one of Forts amazing packages and have found it quite relaxing to go "snail hunting" every day when I get back from work. Still no nitrites after a month of cycling though. I suspect the problem is in my water parameters somehow...
Congrats on your cycle almost finishing! I shall live precariously through your tank, haha.

 

[animaluvr]

Da squid what did you use to seed your tank?

 

[Da Squid]

Unfortunately I'm the only one I know with a fish tank so I have no established filter media to tap into. I'm tempted to try that bacteria in a bottle stuff but I dont want to waste my money.
I'm treating it as a science problem more than a frustration. I know theres a reason the cycle isnt working, I just havent figured it out yet. You'll know when I do, I'll be shouting it to the hills!

 

[gzeiger]

Squid - can you elaborate on your problem? Plants normally take up both ammonia and nitrite. If you've been dosing ammonia to 4 ppm repeatedly and just haven't seen nitrite I'd say you're good to go on fish and you should stop dosing ammonia. If ammonia has stayed at 4 ppm for a month without intervention that's quite unusual, and I would say that (1) you should see progress soon and (2) you may want to look into a better light for your plants, as they are obviously not growing.

Bacterial growth is temperature dependent, with optimal temperature being in the upper 80s to mid 90s (the numbers have been definitely established, but are different for Nitrosomonas and Nitrobacter).

 

[Da Squid]

I was being a bit vague there. I'd love to say that I've been dosing ammonia repeatedly but it's still the same ammonia from a month ago. So it's staying at around 4 ppm and holding strong. The plants were only put in about 10 days ago and while I know very little about them, they seem to look pretty healthy. I'm currently running a 54 watt t5 light in the 10,000 K range. I keep that on in my 55g tank about 9 hours a day. Since the plants are all low light types, they should be doing ok I think. If it won't hurt the plants, I could raise my temp from 85 to 90 ( and I will) but that still doesnt seem to account for my lack of nitrite activity.
My API test kit hasn't expired yet. I know my water contains chloramines so I dosed a capfull of Prime in there. To start, and another capful a few days ago just in case the chloramine might still be present somehow.
Sorry for the long rant, I'm out the door here to go sailing (that outta calm me down!) and I wanted to include any info you might think helpful.

 

[animaluvr]

It sounds like you many not have seeded your tank. I was in the same situation as you, I am the only one with a tank so I used the Seachem stability to start then when I ran out of that I used Big Al's bio. IF you are just using the plants that you added 10 days ago then the process will just be starting.