Help with fin rot

[chippensteiner]

Hi all. This is Lenny - I got him two months ago from Petsmart. He was on discount after having been there for about four months. He was emaciated, dull, torn, and had a crooked spine. He flourished. Quite suddenly, on 11/6, I noticed that he had appeared to have torn his top fin. Prior to this, I hadn't noticed anything (but he is dark finned) but he was quiet and breathing heavy. I dug around and realized that it looked more like fin rot. I immediately started him on erythromycin. I have attached pictures - the first is from 11/6, the second from 11/9, and the remainder from today. His parameters are and have been consistent - ammonia just above 0 (comes out of the tap this way ), 0 nitrites, 5 nitrates, and pH of 8-8.2. His temp is 80 degrees and he is in a 5.5 gallon planted tank. The only thing that was new was that I added in his live plants - he had a really awful algae bloom and when I noticed he was acting off, I did a full water change to get rid of the algae in case that was causing the issue. I monitored his parameters and the cycled medium successfully maintained the tank after the change.
Anyway -- I don't know what to do. I have never had a fish with fin rot before. I am assuming he probably had it when I got him and I just didn't notice because of the color of his fins. I dewormed him when I got him, but that was it. Does it look like, from 11/9 to now, that the fin rot is progressing? I was told that the diseased fin inevitably drops off even if treatment is successful, so I don't know if that's what is happening here. I am also concerned about the discoloration under the primarily affected fin and am worried it is turning into body rot.
Help? Advice? He was my "impulse rescue" after I lost my very old special needs boy and while I know he wasn't healthy, I am surprised to see what is happening so suddenly. As an aside, since doing the treatment, he has become more active but his breathing is still heavier than I'd like. He still eats great.

 

[chippensteiner]

One more picture...

Here's one more picture from today.

 

[King Fisher]

Do 50% water changes every 2 days. Use Seachem Kanaplex after his round of Erythromycin.

 

[chippensteiner]

Thanks. He already finished his round of erythromycin - today is day two off. I just did a water change today as well as yesterday.
Does this look like it's progressive rot that needs a new treatment to you, or is the kanaplex to be safe?

 

[King Fisher]

He'll need multiple treatments. You can do back to back treatments. You've gave him a couple days without meds. Generally, dose the meds for two days, do a 50% water change then dose again. He'll probably need a few weeks of this. He's in bad shape.

 

[chippensteiner]

Is he? I didn't think he looked too awful, maybe just a bit roughed up. His attitude has improved.

How do I know when the treatment is working? Is he past the point of trying clean water and meth blue baths?

 

[Remington]

I did a post about my betta. I am using salt for mine. But his was due to a fight and or sharp edges on decoration. Salt supposedly will kill / help with bacteria issues.

 

[chippensteiner]

Thanks for the advice. There are so many different medications and so many treatments that my head is spinning trying to figure out what's best.

 

[King Fisher]

How did he get this bad? Fighting? Or did it just come on suddenly? If it's the latter I'd assume it's a bacterial disease/bacterial fin rot. So you'll want to treat with a bacterial medication. Erythromycin is good. Kanaplex is good. I'd skip baths and run the meds in the tank. Dose appropriately. Salt can be used and does help but will not kill disease, rather helps healing.

Are you using dechlorinator?

 

[King Fisher]

I'll add that bacterial fin rot is a gram negative bacteria. Seachem Kanaplex treats gram negative.

Erythromycin is for gram positive bacteria. I'm guessing it won't work if it's bacterial fin rot.

 

[chippensteiner]

This was pretty sudden. I noticed he had a little tear in his top fin, but I presumed it was from a plastic plant in his tank that he perpetually was shoving himself into. The fin went from a little torn to almost gone, with the other fins affected, in just a few days - and I started the erythro pretty quickly after realizing what it was. He does have dark fins, so it's totally possible he had mild fin rot when I got him and I just didn't know the signs.

He did have an attitude improvement on the erythro, but I just can't tell if the fins are worsening or if those white tips are some fin regrowth. Is it worth trying the erythro one more time to see if that does anything, or am I really best off switching? I've read some pretty scary things about the intensity of Kanaplex and that makes me worried. What about something like Jungle Fungus Clear? Nitrofurazone and furazolidone both treat gram positive, and some gram negative.

I do use a dechlorinator; I use prime with every water change. Lately, I have been adding stress coat in as well just to see if it might keep him comfortable.

 

[King Fisher]

I think if you did the appropriate dosage time with the Erythromycin I would then use Kanaplex. Then you've covered the gram negative and gram positive bacteria.

Ive used several API products, several Seachem products and Kordon products. I've never noticed a difference in strength nor have I killed a fish with meds. I prefer Seachem products because 1) they've proven to be very affective and 2) a lot of Seachem meds can be mixed together which a lot of other brands you can't.

That being said, you can choose whatever product you like. Your tank, your decision. I'd treat for gram negative because I'm pretty sure he's got bacterial fin rot with that kind of deterioration within a couple days.

 

[Remington]

King fisher has never lead me down the wrong path. Keep us posted. I take a picture of my betta every other day to monitor regrowth and or relapse.

 

[chippensteiner]

Thanks - I obviously want to do what's best for him. So I need to treat for gram positive, ultimately. Kanaplex would need to be ordered, and it'd take a few days to get to me. Should I go ahead and try a round of the Jungle Fungus Clear to see if there's improvement, then try Kanaplex, or should I wait to do anything?

 

[Remington]

I would follow king fishers advice. If it was me I would do daily water changes until medicine arrived at the very least

 

[King Fisher]

Thanks - I obviously want to do what's best for him. So I need to treat for gram positive, ultimately. Kanaplex would need to be ordered, and it'd take a few days to get to me. Should I go ahead and try a round of the Jungle Fungus Clear to see if there's improvement, then try Kanaplex, or should I wait to do anything?

Gram negative you should treat which Kanaplex covers. Gram positive you've already treated with Erythromycin.

I've never used jungle fungus clear so I'm not sure if that will work or not. If it's for fungus, hence the name, it wouldn't do much for him since he doesn't have a fungus infection.

I'd probably dose erythromycin for a few days until the Kanaplex arrives. Or like Rem pointed out, just do daily water changes and keep the water pristine until the meds arrive.