Still having problems with fishless cycle!!

[bsud]

It has been right at 4 weeks now since i first started. Ive been checking ammonia and nitrites daily with no change what so ever. 4ppm ammonia and 0 nitrites. I tested nitrates today and they look to be about 40 or 80ppm hard to tell with those two colors. I am just puzzeled as to after all this time why ammonia hasnt dropped not even the slightest. Ive also done pwcs over the period and ammonia just will not drop! What should i do??

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[bud29]

It has been right at 4 weeks now since i first started. Ive been checking ammonia and nitrites daily with no change what so ever. 4ppm ammonia and 0 nitrites. I tested nitrates today and they look to be about 40 or 80ppm hard to tell with those two colors. I am just puzzeled as to after all this time why ammonia hasnt dropped not even the slightest. Ive also done pwcs over the period and ammonia just will not drop! What should i do??

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So your ammonia did not drop, nitrites did not rise, and yet you have 40-80 ppm nitrate? There had to be some sort of conversion going on for you to have nitrates, what test kit are you using?

 

[bsud]

So your ammonia did not drop, nitrites did not rise, and yet you have 40-80 ppm nitrate? There had to be some sort of conversion going on for you to have nitrates, what test kit are you using?

correct no drop in ammonia ive seen no rise at all in nitrites and my nitrates are reading between 40-80. Im using the api master kit. The only thing different I did was add a bottle of Safe start to see if it would kickstart the bacteria but that was done in the early part of cycling

 

[bud29]

Have you tested your tap water for ammonia and nitrate? The ammonia should at least be dropping with a water change, if not from bacteria.

 

[bsud]

Tap has .25 ammonia and 0 nitrates. Should i just keep doing water changes until i get ammonia down to 0ppm and the consider it cycled?

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[bsud]

I also use prime as my tap water conditioner

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[bud29]

Tap has .25 ammonia and 0 nitrates. Should i just keep doing water changes until i get ammonia down to 0ppm and the consider it cycled?

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No, you still need to build up bacteria colonies to convert the ammonia (and then the nitrite). You may want to consider converting to a fish-in cycle if your fishless cycle isn't going anywhere.

Fish-in Cycling: Step over into the dark side - Aquarium Advice

 

[bsud]

No, you still need to build up bacteria colonies to convert the ammonia (and then the nitrite). You may want to consider converting to a fish-in cycle if your fishless cycle isn't going anywhere.

Fish-in Cycling: Step over into the dark side - Aquarium Advice

Ok let me ask if i do a fish in will i have to tear it down and start over or just put fish in there and continue to use prime?

 

[GreenLily]

I'm not Bud29, but you don't need to tear anything down to do a fish-in cycle. You will just need to do plenty of water changes to get the ammonia down to 0 or .25 before adding fish. When you do the fish-in cycle, do not use anymore bottled ammonia- if you've read the article provided, you probably understand that already.

and always use Prime.

 

[bsud]

Thank you! Thats probaly what i will end up doing cause this just isnt making any sense

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[Delapool]

Have you checked ph just to make sure not too low?

 

[bsud]

yes Ph is 7.6

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[Britty]

This happened to me also. I started using Prime at the start of my fishless cycle. Around 4 weeks into it, my ammonia had not fallen from 4ppm. The test was bright green, all the time. Absolutely nothing was happening. Didn't even have nitrite or nitrate reading for the entire time.

So I did a big water change and got ammonia to under 0.25 then used API water conditioner for all the replacement water. This only renders chlorine, chloramines and heavy metals inert. It has no effect on ammonia, nitrites and nitrates. The following week my ammonia readings started to drop and I was having to top up every few days. Then as time went on the cycle just took hold and finished 4 weeks after the big WC.

Not sure if it was the API that helped or the big WC, a combination of both or some magic cycling hoodoo. But by that stage it was getting frustrating and had read across various forums that some people who swear by fishless cycles don't like using conditioners that render ammonia inert. I had nothing to lose so I gave it a try. Kick started the whole process.

 

[bsud]

Ok so today i did a big water change and got my ammonia level down to around 1 maybe 2ppm kinda hard to tell but its no more than 2 for sure. Now im wondering what i should do. Should this get my cycle back started? Im thinking my problem may have been that i overdosed way too much ammonia cause this makes the 2nd water change ive done and im just now getting it down to where i should have started. Any advice now that ive lowered it?

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[Britty]

My advice.

Make sure your water temp is around 81 - 84 F. This accelerates the bacteria growths. Remember to turn it back down when you're ready for fish.

I'd also say don't use prime for fishless cycle. A regular ammonia and heavy metal water conditioner is all you need. Prime is fine once you have your fish in.

When nitrates really peak, to way more than your test kit can measure, reduce the ammonia dose or dose every second day with the same dose youre'doing. Overloaded nitrites may even require multiple water change to bring the levels within your test kit range, else it can stall your cycle until nitrites are reduced.

 

[Delapool]

This happened to me also. I started using Prime at the start of my fishless cycle. Around 4 weeks into it, my ammonia had not fallen from 4ppm. The test was bright green, all the time. Absolutely nothing was happening. Didn't even have nitrite or nitrate reading for the entire time.

So I did a big water change and got ammonia to under 0.25 then used API water conditioner for all the replacement water. This only renders chlorine, chloramines and heavy metals inert. It has no effect on ammonia, nitrites and nitrates. The following week my ammonia readings started to drop and I was having to top up every few days. Then as time went on the cycle just took hold and finished 4 weeks after the big WC.

Not sure if it was the API that helped or the big WC, a combination of both or some magic cycling hoodoo. But by that stage it was getting frustrating and had read across various forums that some people who swear by fishless cycles don't like using conditioners that render ammonia inert. I had nothing to lose so I gave it a try. Kick started the whole process.

Dang it - I had been using API ammo lock, then shifted to API stress coat. Both dealt with the ammonia and chlorine/chloramines as I gather.

Then I found 4 litres of API tap water conditioner and assumed it did the same as I find API don't give all details.

However saw above that it doesn't treat ammonia and after looking at the product data safety sheet, am thinking 'oops'.

Intend to test for ammonia next water change and see how much ammonia there is. Has anyone done this where they have used a tap water conditioner that doesn't treat ammonia and then tested for ammonia after a pwc? Wondering if I should pick up 4 litres of stress coat again (yikes).

 

[Britty]

My local tap water measures 0.25ppm or less. It varies but 0.25 is the highest I've seen. API water conditioner is fine for water changes because my tank water is zero ammo all the time. All healthy tanks should be. For water changes the tap water trace ammmo is heavily diluted in the tank water and the filter just cleans any trace. Its fine for the weekly 20% water change.

I also use it for fishless cycling as I mentioned already.

But for a complete fish in tank fill or large WC, like 70% or more, I use prime so the ammo in tap water is rendered inert for a short while before the bio filter has time to chew it up.

 

[Delapool]

My local tap water measures 0.25ppm or less. It varies but 0.25 is the highest I've seen. API water conditioner is fine for water changes because my tank water is zero ammo all the time. All healthy tanks should be. For water changes the tap water trace ammmo is heavily diluted in the tank water and the filter just cleans any trace. Its fine for the weekly 20% water change.

I also use it for fishless cycling as I mentioned already.

But for a complete fish in tank fill or large WC, like 70% or more, I use prime so the ammo in tap water is rendered inert for a short while before the bio filter has time to chew it up.

Handy info Just chasing up seachem safe now. Playing it safe as some pwc's are quite large and I want to try home-made substrate ferts capsules.