Low Maintenance / No Water Change Tank

[BBradbury]

Low Maintenance Tanks

If pure water conditions was the most important then you'd be doing your 'preached 50% weekly changes'. Wether you have time or not.

PB has a point. You seem to contradict yourself


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Hello again Sk...

What I've preached is pure water conditions. Whatever it takes, so the fish and plants have an environment as close to their natural habitat as possible. Not in those words, but close. Fish and plants have to have a constant, pure water environment. This tank is getting away from what I've done since forever, which is changing out the water every week to remove forms of nitrogen before they have time to build up in the tank water. The idea of a plant that will maintain pure water conditions, is too interesting not to investigate.

B

 

[jetajockey]

I think that PB has a good point. I believe that the nitrifying bacteria in the filter/tank is doing the bulk of the work by converting ammonia, rather than the plants uptaking it directly via nh4+. I say this because even with a large mass of plants, without pretty substantial lighting, aren't going to be using nh4+ very quickly at all. That tells me that the nitrifiers are likely doing the bulk of the work.

They still obviously serve a good purpose in nitrate reduction in an appropriately stocked tank, but I think the notion that the nitrifiers only work when the plants are resting is a bit off.

 

[Sk3lly]

I think that PB has a good point. I believe that the nitrifying bacteria in the filter/tank is doing the bulk of the work by converting ammonia, rather than the plants uptaking it directly via nh4+. I say this because even with a large mass of plants, without pretty substantial lighting, aren't going to be using nh4+ very quickly at all. That tells me that the nitrifiers are likely doing the bulk of the work.

They still obviously serve a good purpose in nitrate reduction in an appropriately stocked tank, but I think the notion that the nitrifiers only work when the plants are resting is a bit off.

Would the phosphates from the fish food build up faster than the low light plants could use also?


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[Brookster123]

I don't agree with fish needing the purest of water conditions. Fish adapt.. period.. if your tank, ever so slowy, turns toxic? Chances are the fish will adapt to the gradual change (barring needy fish). For example, in mass, the Charles River was so polluted at one point that I could have sworn a 3 eyed turtle winked at me 3 times!! Yet the fishing was still excellent and the bass looked great??? By all rights the entire river should have died? Maybe some trout went belly up, tougher species adapted.. experiments are fun and all but I don't see much substance here B.

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[BBradbury]

Low Maintenance Tanks

I think that PB has a good point. I believe that the nitrifying bacteria in the filter/tank is doing the bulk of the work by converting ammonia, rather than the plants uptaking it directly via nh4+. I say this because even with a large mass of plants, without pretty substantial lighting, aren't going to be using nh4+ very quickly at all. That tells me that the nitrifiers are likely doing the bulk of the work.

They still obviously serve a good purpose in nitrate reduction in an appropriately stocked tank, but I think the notion that the nitrifiers only work when the plants are resting is a bit off.

Hello jet...

The interesting part of using the land plants, is they require only subdued room light. But, they need it for a long time every day. The lighting in the tank room is on for 14 hours every day. The mechanical filter is only necessary until the plant becomes accustomed to the water environment. Once the aerated roots begin to take in the nitrogen, the filter can be removed. The remaining bacteria living on the surfaces other than the filter media will work to use the small amount of nitrogen the fish produce when resting during the hours at night. I'll likely keep the filter running, because I'm only interested in never having to change out the tank water.

If you have enough plants and they're large, you don't need any mechanical filtration, past the break in time.

B

 

[BBradbury]

Low Maintenance Tanks

Hello PB...

You don't need to explain your position to me. Your opinion is fine. I'm revisiting this type of tank and putting the idea out just in case someone is interested in finding out how it all works. I didn't think I'd get so many questions, I was caught a bit unprepared, but it's a small matter.

I had a similar tank a few years ago and it worked well. This one is a bit larger, but so far, is working well.

B

 

[BBradbury]

Low Maintenance Tanks

BB, are you measuring TDS at all?

It seems like long term you would end of with a TDS build-up.

Hello dal...

If you're referring to "total dissolved solids", I have no means of testing this and am relying on the plant to take all dissolved minerals that could potentially foul the tank water.

B

 

[Delapool]

Would the phosphates from the fish food build up faster than the low light plants could use also?


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Not sure in low light. I have almost 0 phosphates in a small tank with a large plant. Main tank goes at 5 to 10ppm with small plants for comparison.

 

[Delapool]

Hello PB...



You don't need to explain your position to me. Your opinion is fine. I'm revisiting this type of tank and putting the idea out just in case someone is interested in finding out how it all works. I didn't think I'd get so many questions, I was caught a bit unprepared, but it's a small matter.



I had a similar tank a few years ago and it worked well. This one is a bit larger, but so far, is working well.



B

Keep posting! Hugely curious on where it all ends up.

 

[jetajockey]

Hello jet...

The interesting part of using the land plants, is they require only subdued room light. But, they need it for a long time every day. The lighting in the tank room is on for 14 hours every day. The mechanical filter is only necessary until the plant becomes accustomed to the water environment. Once the aerated roots begin to take in the nitrogen, the filter can be removed. The remaining bacteria living on the surfaces other than the filter media will work to use the small amount of nitrogen the fish produce when resting during the hours at night. I'll likely keep the filter running, because I'm only interested in never having to change out the tank water.

If you have enough plants and they're large, you don't need any mechanical filtration, past the break in time.

B

I understand that common houseplants have a low light demand, but the main point I was making is that less light = less energy. Less energy = less use of fertilizers (N, for example). So low/subdued lighting may keep the plants alive, but they aren't going to be sponging up ferts without a pretty substantial light source.

 

[BBradbury]

Low Maintenance Tank

Hello jet...

The only other lighting I have is a dual shop light strip with a couple of T8, 32 watt, florescent bulbs from the hardware store. This is all the Hornwort requires in my other tanks, so this is what I use. The Hornwort is doing well as is the Duckweed, unfortunately. I'll need to skim it off like I do my other tanks.

B

 

[SFAquariums1]

because the whole concept behind this type of set-up is natural filtration via plants, not a filter system.

Like I said, add filter systems and all and don't do any water changes, all you end up with a poorly maintained planted tank.

natural systems exist, but not in the fashion or methodology Bb is using.
This approach is much, much closer to the "unflushed toilet" analogy he/she likes to toss around.

Am I the only one who finds it odd that the person who is always counseling people that the ONLY way to keep fish is by changing at least 50% of the water weekly is now contradicting themselves?

I can appreciate it as an experiment, but it does call into question the OP's actual grasp of what is going on in an aquarium environment, even if it is "silly chemistry stuff".

I was waiting for someone to bring this up! Going from any issue you ever have, even if a light bulb breaks! It can be fixed with 50% wTer changes to making a tank that requires no water changes.

All in all I'm commenting to follow along.


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[Delapool]

I was waiting for someone to bring this up! Going from any issue you ever have, even if a light bulb breaks! It can be fixed with 50% wTer changes to making a tank that requires no water changes.

All in all I'm commenting to follow along.


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I believe an explanation for this thread was given earlier on. As well as why the approach was different.

 

[BBradbury]

Low Maintenance Tanks

Added a smaller "Ag" plant to the 55 G. The Hornwort is growing nicely. Just have a dual bulb shop light with a couple of 6500K T8s for tank lighting.

Feeding the Guppies roughly every other day. Their growth is steady. The larger "Ag" plant has three new leaves in the last week. Have added a trace of Seachem's Comprehensive to the replacement water. The tank needs roughly a gallon or so replaced every week. With the drier winter coming, the tank will likely need another half gallon of replacement water.

Roughly 30 days into this test and all seems to be fine.

B

 

[Delapool]

Do you find the topping up goes ok in general? I tend to have covers to prevent it but sounds like no issues your end?

 

[BBradbury]

Low Maintenance Tanks

Do you find the topping up goes ok in general? I tend to have covers to prevent it but sounds like no issues your end?

Hello Del...

No issues with topping off the tank. I replace a liter or quart every morning. So, there's quite a bit of water lost to the air. But, the replacement water is just treated tap water with a trace of liquid aquatic plant fertilizer.

B

 

[Delapool]

Thanks, it does seem a lot as not used to having that much water evaporate this end but no doubt over thinking it here.

 

[RadMax8]

BBradbury,

At what point do you think the plant will start pulling nitrogen and you can remove the filter you have in there? I'm interested in seeing how well the plants can "filter" the water on their own. Very interesting concept!


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[JRT83]

I'm moving this thread to the "lets see if this works" section.

Lets teach hobbyists just getting into the hobby how to not do routine maintenance with their tanks, great idea....

Guess the name of the forum isn't "Aquarium Good Advice"

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[bud29]

I'm moving this thread to the "lets see if this works" section.

Lets teach hobbyists just getting into the hobby how to not do routine maintenance with their tanks, great idea....

Guess the name of the forum isn't "Aquarium Good Advice"

So I guess I missed the part where he recommended this setup for new hobbyists. Bradbury himself is usually very pro-water change, this is just a thread to document his low-maintenance setup. Not sure why you found it as a reason to attack him and the rest of the forum?