Constant cyano-- please help

[AquaTricia]

Ok. So what I've got here is a mini-cycle. Haven't fed the fish since Thursday or Friday, I forget now, and then it was pellets. I will feed rinsed frozen Mysis today before the water change. I will get the BB additive.


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[Gregcoyote]

It's still going to cause another ammonia spike. I would continue the water exchanges or get the livestock out for a while. Your live rock will have enough bacteria to repopulate the sand if you change it out. I would get rid of the die off source if it's the sand.


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[jeffaquarius]

I agree that ammonia will come back when you stop the cycling treatment with Nutrafin. New sand will have the same process as well.

 

[Gregcoyote]

Why would sterile sand add to the bio load? If it's the "live" sand causing this, removing it would be my first action before using any bio booster. But Jeff may be right that it will reduce the cycle, but not eliminate it.

Best advice I have is remove the sand entirely by siphoning it out so you don't release more organic material into the tank. Nothing wrong with going bare bottom for a while and add aragonite later. I don't like silica based sands as they can promote diatoms. JMO

Alternately you could just keep up big water exchanges until it all flushes out. But the ammonia is dangerous, so be monitoring that closely.

You'll get it to finally settle out. It's why we recommend waiting a few weeks at least before slowly adding live stock. Smaller systems are even a bit more challenging as stability is one key to keeping a reef and the more water, the slower things change. Best of luck !


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[AquaTricia]

Well, it sounds as if I can't win for losing. Can't get the livestock out because I have nowhere to put them. I also have 4 freshwater tanks. Space is definately limited. Will do another 10-15 gallon water change tomorrow and vacuum out the top layer of gravel. I added the BB additive this afternoon and put Purigen in the trickle filter with Chemi-Pure Blue, Poly-Filter and some floss. Would vacuuming the top layer of gravel (which is covered in cyano) cause problems with regaining my BB since I added the additive? A reminder: I only put the new gravel in there in the first place because I had vacuumed out so much of my original live sand substrate trying to get rid of the the turf algae I began with and the cyano I have had for 4 months now. I like the looks of a substrate rather than a bare bottom tank and was trying to give cover, etc to the Nass snails and brittle star.


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[AquaTricia]

Oh, and I checked. The gravel I placed on top of the original 1/2 inch of sand I had left is aragonite dry.


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[Gregcoyote]

Did you mention how much live rock you have and where it came from?

The BB will circulate in the water and permeate everywhere it can.


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[Gregcoyote]

Cyano is a really common pain. I am also battling some for the first time in years, but I just remove it. It will eventually go away. It is very sensitive to flow. So adding or redirecting power heads will help a lot.


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[AquaTricia]

And another comment. I know this is a long forum, so I like to remind everyone occasionally what transpired before. This is a 2 year old tank started with live rock and live sand. The 1/2 inch of sand I had left was from the original 3 inch sandbed of two years ago.


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[AquaTricia]

So, I should just keep vacuuming the very top layer of substrate to help get rid of the cyano while I'm working on the ammonia problem? What causes cyano to hit a 2 year old tank anyway?


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[Gregcoyote]

I understand. Look back to when your problems started and look at what you changed. That's why I recommend doing one thing at a time so you can see what works or doesn't work.

There seems to be some relation that turf algae outbreaks once resolved turns into cyano issues.


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[AquaTricia]

That may be something. The cyano began just when I got my big center rock covered in the algae and poured 2 pints of hydrogen peroxide on it slowly, let it sit 10 minutes, then let it sit for 1/2 hour in ro/di water with stress coat in it. I rinsed it thoroughly and placed it back in the tank. A few days later, cyano. I wondered if there was a correlation.


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[Gregcoyote]

You may have nuked the bacteria in that rock with the peroxide and fresh water soak.


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[jeffaquarius]

My gosh that's explains everything. You should have mentioned that hydrogen peroxide on the 1st page. I was right when I first mentioned you do not have enough bb.

 

[jeffaquarius]

What I would suggest is you prepare a shallow plastic container with new sand and rocks to cure while you are away. Use Nutrafin on tank and replace sand with cured one when ready.

 

[AquaTricia]

All right, I realize that I killed the BB on that rock. It is a branching rock that weighs only two pounds of the more than 20 I have in the tank. I can't imagine it would have done as much damage as the turf algae I had had for a couple of months that was spreading to my corals. Admittedly, in what you guys are saying, is that the timeline of the hydrogen peroxide and the cyano is very close and could be related. But, I still MAY have my doubts. I tried everything on that Gelidium, including putting the rock in my lap for 30 minutes at a time and picked the little Vines off with tweezers. The next day it had come back.
Ok, the possibility may exist that I caused the cyano and the ammonia. Of course I did, otherwise it wouldn't be there. I have to fix it now.


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[Gregcoyote]

Well, she doesn't have enough bb but that rock slowly leached enough organics to allow cyano to grow. If that's the case, this is a tank cycle and ammonia is expected. Purigen is good for nitrates and silica. The Chemipure absorbs some toxins and phosphates. You need a ammonia reducer. Suggestions?


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[AquaTricia]

The Purigen packaging states that it's good for removing ammonia as well. I, frankly, am running out of room. Yes, this appears to be a belated cycle, but I would have expected diatoms and not cyano. I had also read (I read everything) that shrimp will be the first to go when params go haywire, but mine are flourishing. I guess I am fortunate all my critters are intact. Throughout all of this, I have lost only two Turbos, on the same day. Nothing else. I hate my ammonia kit, a Seachem with these little dots you put in a few drops of tank water. Admittedly, it's easy, but is it correct?


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[carey]

Do you have any prime water additive? That will neutralize the ammonia, at least temporarily. This can help the critters in the tank but wont do much for your overall issue.

Nuking that rock may have also caused the ammonia spike, putting it in fresh water would have killed the bacteria and anything else on the rock. Then putting it back in and saltwater let the dying organisms infect the tank so to speak.
if it were me, and this is just my opinion, I would go with the prime to keep the fish and critters safe as well as the beneficial bacteria additive. I would leave the sand, but siphon out the cyano that you can. Then just keep up with water changes. Go to a limited light cycle while you are gone and get to those water changes when you get back.
Just what I would do....

 

[AquaTricia]

Thanks Carey. I do have some Prime. Didn't know you could use it for salt. Will do that before bed. I've been so worried about the critters, that I've been afraid I'd wake up every morning and they'd be gone. I will take the advice that the others, and you too, have given and I might get out of this alive. Or at least the critters will.


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