Brookster123
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Yeppers.. does yours spread sideways faster or upwards?
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BCarl's 26 gallon Bf Build
- Thread starter bcarl_10gal
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Yeppers.. does yours spread sideways faster or upwards?
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Fresh2o
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They grow straight up. And halfway up they sometimes send out roots.
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Brookster123
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bcarl_10gal
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Its quite an interesting plant i hope its successful!
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Sk3lly
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I always thought i had DHG in my last tank but it turned out it was standard hairgrass. It always grew up to like 4-5" which is prob why i hated it so much.
Ive just planted true DHG in my new setup. Think it stays 1-2" in height
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bcarl_10gal
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Woke up to this today. A stunted ludwiga and freshly melted star repens. Getting very frustrated at this point and considering a blackout to get the GSA under control
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Brookster123
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Ouch... this is crazy?? What's going on in there?
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bcarl_10gal
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Good question another plant same tank. Looks happy
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Sk3lly
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What parameters have you changed recently, if any??
What is the distance from substrate to light? Which light do you use? Do you know the PAR ratings at that depth?
I think from memory your dosing EI? If your not then start. That will cover your phosphate, nitrate, micros. You may have to add extra potassium by using potassium sulphate.
Those star repens look to of melted through change in conditions. Mine did that in my tank when i moved it to the cupboard for storage. They lost the bml xb light and got some rubbish light. They lost all lower leaves except the top few. Looks exactly like yours.
The GSA is almost certainly down to too much light. In my opinion this dose extra phosphates to prevent it is a myth. Plants dont care if theres 3ppm or 10ppm, just that theres phosphates present when they need it. I bet if you bumped your phosphate up you'd still get it. If your dosing EI then it provides more than enough phosphates
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What is the distance from substrate to light? Which light do you use? Do you know the PAR ratings at that depth?
I think from memory your dosing EI? If your not then start. That will cover your phosphate, nitrate, micros. You may have to add extra potassium by using potassium sulphate.
Those star repens look to of melted through change in conditions. Mine did that in my tank when i moved it to the cupboard for storage. They lost the bml xb light and got some rubbish light. They lost all lower leaves except the top few. Looks exactly like yours.
The GSA is almost certainly down to too much light. In my opinion this dose extra phosphates to prevent it is a myth. Plants dont care if theres 3ppm or 10ppm, just that theres phosphates present when they need it. I bet if you bumped your phosphate up you'd still get it. If your dosing EI then it provides more than enough phosphates
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bcarl_10gal
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I bumped up phosphates to around 5ppm and have not seen a change. I also have added nitrates to get me around 20ppm.
For potassium sulfate I was WAY overdosing it, I mean 50g diluted in a 500ml bottle and 20ML per day in addition to some equilibrium at the beginning of the week.
I have my regular BML turned down to about 30% on the dimmer so I am getting around 50-60 for 6 hours a day. This tank used to be a jungle when I ran it at 100% for like 3 months with no algae issues.
I am doing a 50% water change tomorrow. My purigen was also really dirty so I am regenerating that as well.
I just find it weird that the Pogo has never grown better along with the L.Aromatica and other plants are just stunted.
For potassium sulfate I was WAY overdosing it, I mean 50g diluted in a 500ml bottle and 20ML per day in addition to some equilibrium at the beginning of the week.
I have my regular BML turned down to about 30% on the dimmer so I am getting around 50-60 for 6 hours a day. This tank used to be a jungle when I ran it at 100% for like 3 months with no algae issues.
I am doing a 50% water change tomorrow. My purigen was also really dirty so I am regenerating that as well.
I just find it weird that the Pogo has never grown better along with the L.Aromatica and other plants are just stunted.
Brookster123
Aquarium Advice Addict
I think it's substrate related along with co2... sk3lly is def. The leading voice in this thread but when I bumped my co2 up with a nice substrate infusion the star repens responded almost immediately. . Keep in mind I'm pushing 50/60 par max..
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bcarl_10gal
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I still keep looking in the direction of the 100% RO water, I would mix it down but we are on a well system that uses both bleach and salt with the water softener.
Brookster123
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I'm not sure.. I've heard planted tanks need alot of the minerals in tap.. maybe try cutting the ro with spring water? Is there anything else to remineralize aside from equilibrium out there??
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bcarl_10gal
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I have heard of people using Kent's RO right but I have not looked into it to much.
Brookster123
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I started adding a small dose of equilibrium per recommendation of old scales, can't hurt. Aside from blowing put your tds.. can't see much harm in trying the combo?? That is using ro right in tandem with eq.
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Sk3lly
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Yea plants need calcium, magnesium and molybdenum. These are normally found in the tap water. They are also in the EI micro mix as far as I'm aware. 100% RO water is a defo no no. So equilibrium is the correct advice although not having used it I don't know what it contains. Between the macro and micros there are what's known as 'mobile' or 'immobile' elements within plants.
Mobile meaning the plant can quickly transfer these nutrients to where they are needed. So deficiencies will show on old leaves as the plant moves these nutrients to the new growth
Immobile are the nutrients that the plant struggles to transfer. This means when new growth is calling for something, the plant can't sort it in time so the new leaves show deficiency signs.
Your ludwigia is showing signs of new leaf crinkling/deficiency so your looking at immobile nutrients. Iron, calcium, suffer and boron. With your potassium sulphate dosing it's unlikely to be sulphate. Iron is included in EI so I'd rule that out too. Boron I also think is in the EI micro mix. So I'd look at a calcium deficiency which makes sense as your not getting any from tap water. What is your KH? If it's low then it may be an indication of poor calcium. Maybe try adding more equilibrium?
Your star repens have lost all lower growth. So we are looking at a mobile nutrient deficiency I think. Mobile nutrients are nitrogen, phosphorous, potassium, magnesium and molybdenum. Well straight away we can rule out nitrate, phosphate and potassium as you know your dosing these. Molybdenum I know nothing about but I'm 95% sure it's in the micro mix. Magnesium is an interesting one. Alongside calcium it's present in tap water and gives water the buffering values. Adding magnesium or calcium should raise KH, so I'm guessing this equilibrium contains these two. Have a look on the contents please?
It seems convenient to me that both these deficiencies are pointing to the fact your using 100% RO. I think a cure is to try more equilibrium and to get a KH reading of maybe 6ish. Then that can be ruled out.
Hope this helps
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Mobile meaning the plant can quickly transfer these nutrients to where they are needed. So deficiencies will show on old leaves as the plant moves these nutrients to the new growth
Immobile are the nutrients that the plant struggles to transfer. This means when new growth is calling for something, the plant can't sort it in time so the new leaves show deficiency signs.
Your ludwigia is showing signs of new leaf crinkling/deficiency so your looking at immobile nutrients. Iron, calcium, suffer and boron. With your potassium sulphate dosing it's unlikely to be sulphate. Iron is included in EI so I'd rule that out too. Boron I also think is in the EI micro mix. So I'd look at a calcium deficiency which makes sense as your not getting any from tap water. What is your KH? If it's low then it may be an indication of poor calcium. Maybe try adding more equilibrium?
Your star repens have lost all lower growth. So we are looking at a mobile nutrient deficiency I think. Mobile nutrients are nitrogen, phosphorous, potassium, magnesium and molybdenum. Well straight away we can rule out nitrate, phosphate and potassium as you know your dosing these. Molybdenum I know nothing about but I'm 95% sure it's in the micro mix. Magnesium is an interesting one. Alongside calcium it's present in tap water and gives water the buffering values. Adding magnesium or calcium should raise KH, so I'm guessing this equilibrium contains these two. Have a look on the contents please?
It seems convenient to me that both these deficiencies are pointing to the fact your using 100% RO. I think a cure is to try more equilibrium and to get a KH reading of maybe 6ish. Then that can be ruled out.
Hope this helps
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bcarl_10gal
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Sk3lly: Good post, I am getting ready to run out and I will respond in a bit.
Interesting article: Reconstituting R/O water: Equilibrium vs Kent liquid R/O right? - Page 2 - General Aquarium Plants Discussions - Aquatic Plant Central
Interesting article: Reconstituting R/O water: Equilibrium vs Kent liquid R/O right? - Page 2 - General Aquarium Plants Discussions - Aquatic Plant Central
Brookster123
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×1. Excellent my friend! !
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bcarl_10gal
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Okay, Sk3lly has some good points. Lets consider everything that happened in this tank up to this point. I had an AR mini Star repens jungle for the entire summer. I trimmed the star repens and replanted the new stems. I saw the melting in both the replanted and existing plants. Then I had the bad hair algae due to poor CO2 which was addressed a month ago. I was overdosing K2SO4 and Iron so now i've corrected that issue. I have NEVER added MgSO4 to the tank. I started adding this since. My gH has always been around 6-8 deg. I do have seiryu stones so they may contribute some to the hardness. When I tested my calcium about a month ago I was at around 60ppm. If I dose 1 tablespoon of Equilibrium weekly I would yield: 31ppm of K, 13ppm of Ca, 4ppm of Mg and Mn of .1ppm. This in addition to my dosing of K2So4 at 7ppm daily would over time put me off the chart! So over a 6 month trend assuming a 75% absorption would put me around 40ppm + 31ppm (from equilibrium). So yes my K is crazy high but I have stopped dosing it.
On to the Mg, from equilibrium I get 4ppm of Mg from equilibrium plus the MgSO4. I get about .4ppm of Mg from that solution dosed 3 times a week. If you assume the plant absorbs at a rate of 25% I would have about 15ppm in the water column in 3 months.
At this point we should just start ruling things out: Nitrate, phosphate, potassium(overdose??), Iron.
So what do you guys think....
On to the Mg, from equilibrium I get 4ppm of Mg from equilibrium plus the MgSO4. I get about .4ppm of Mg from that solution dosed 3 times a week. If you assume the plant absorbs at a rate of 25% I would have about 15ppm in the water column in 3 months.
At this point we should just start ruling things out: Nitrate, phosphate, potassium(overdose??), Iron.
So what do you guys think....
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bcarl_10gal
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A few other things to add, The potassium ppm is even higher since i didnt include the nitrate and phosphates amounts. Also I have read some bad reviews about RO right. Can any suggest a gh booster with less potassium?
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