Chaeto and Ph

[aadair22]

I just bought a ball of chaeto and tossed it in my sump, started reading online about lighting cycles (which from what I gather, it's good to run the sump lights opposite the DT lights..?) and came across it messing with ph.. Has anyone had experience with ph swings from adding chaeto? I saw one comment that the reason for running the light opposite is to help control these swings. Any help here is much appreciated.

 

[Convict2161]

Never heard about the pH thing and most do the same. They run the light opposite the DT lights.

22engine has a awesome setup with his macro algae. Look him up.

 

[Shan69743]

I just bought a ball of chaeto and tossed it in my sump, started reading online about lighting cycles (which from what I gather, it's good to run the sump lights opposite the DT lights..?) and came across it messing with ph.. Has anyone had experience with ph swings from adding chaeto? I saw one comment that the reason for running the light opposite is to help control these swings. Any help here is much appreciated.

Yes running opposite lighting schedules will reduce the swing in PH. Cause when all lights are off you PH will drop. I run my sump lights 24/7

 

[CorallineAlgae]

Yes, pH drops at night because all fish, inverts, corals and algae take in oxygen and expel CO2 when the lights go off. CO2 then builds up as carbonic acid in the water and lowers the pH. Keeping plants in the sump lit at night allows them to absorb the dissolved CO2 and produce oxygen. This is what helps to stabilize night time pH swings. It takes a good bit of cheato to do it but it'll grow.

 

[aadair22]

Thanks for the replies everyone.. Is it necessary to run 24/7 or is it preference..? Just wondering.

 

[Convict2161]

I'm confused a bit. Adding cheato does not cause pH swings. That was the question. Everyone is saying pH will swing, correct due to lights going off at night. But NOT because you added macro algae.

I just wanna be clear or am I missing something?

 

[aadair22]

My understanding is that as it grows it would just contribute to a bigger swing?

 

[Sniperhank]

It isn't effected by the algae, it is effected by the lighting cycle. Lights go out and ph drops, this is normal. By having lights on opposing your DT, this then prevents the swing.

This should explain it, I think I have the right link...
Boardroom Aquatics

 

[Convict2161]

My understanding is that as it grows it would just contribute to a bigger swing?

During the daytime, the Chaetomorpha will help raise the pH by consuming carbon dioxide from the air. During the night, it might add a bit of carbon dioxide back in but shouldn't have much effect on pH.

The lights I would think have a greater impact on pH but then again I wouldn't think that drastic. I only have a BC29 but my pH swing if any is barely noticeable with tests.

 

[Convict2161]

It isn't effected by the algae, it is effected by the lighting cycle. Lights go out and ph drops, this is normal. By having lights on opposing your DT, this then prevents the swing.

This should explain it, I think I have the right link...
Boardroom Aquatics

That makes more sense. Thank you Hank

I was getting confused for a second.

 

[aadair22]

Thanks a lot guys, nice link

 

[CorallineAlgae]

That makes more sense. Thank you Hank

I was getting confused for a second.

Yeah, I didn't have a link and my explanation wasn't clear. Sorry about that. Can't think when I'm ill.

That said, the link doesn't actually explain how plants in a refugium, lit on an opposite light schedule, helps to maintain pH and alkalinity. If you already understand the whole process it's obvious that another link is needed. I'm on my iPod so I can't post one. It's worth a google search to start to understand the relationship between light cycles, pH drops due to CO2, carbonate hardness depletion, and how a RDP refugium works to counterbalance each of these processes.

 

[aadair22]

I thought your explanation was pretty clear.. I think I understand the process, may need to read up on carbonate harness depletion..? I guess
I'm going to plan on running the lights on a reverse schedule instead of 24/7 unless there is a good reason to run them that long.

 

[Convict2161]

Yeah, I didn't have a link and my explanation wasn't clear. Sorry about that. Can't think when I'm ill.

That said, the link doesn't actually explain how plants in a refugium, lit on an opposite light schedule, helps to maintain pH and alkalinity. If you already understand the whole process it's obvious that another link is needed. I'm on my iPod so I can't post one. It's worth a google search to start to understand the relationship between light cycles, pH drops due to CO2, carbonate hardness depletion, and how a RDP refugium works to counterbalance each of these processes.

No need to be sorry

We all hiccup every now and again.

Feel better

 

[CorallineAlgae]

I thought your explanation was pretty clear.. I think I understand the process, may need to read up on carbonate harness depletion..? I guess
I'm going to plan on running the lights on a reverse schedule instead of 24/7 unless there is a good reason to run them that long.

Carbonate hardness depletion is partly caused by co2 build-up. If co2 issn't allowed to build-up when the lights are off in the main tank then the pH and dKH levels stay more constant (higher). Growing algae in the sump at night allows it to absorb the co2 from the main tank and turn it into oxygen. This keeps co2 low all the time and that's what stops the tanks pH from falling. When pH doesn't fall, dKH levels stay higher, too.

I always run my refugiums on a reverse light schedule, same as you. The 24 hour light schedule is ok for only growing cheato. I like to grow other algae in addition to cheato like coralline and caulerpa. These algae need a rest period to grow best or to avoid rapid sexual reproduction which kills caulerpa. Even if coralline algae is the only thing I want to grow other than cheato it helps to let it rest for 8 hours. You can then use the coralline in the sump to seed the main tank.

 

[aadair22]

Since you mentioned growing caulerpa, I'll go ahead and ask what it's benefits are.. A little bit of it hitchhiked with my chaeto and I briefly read a little bit about.. Saw a lot of negative things and most people opted for chaeto instead.. I left the piece in there for now till I found out more about it

 

[CorallineAlgae]

It works the same as cheato with a few drawbacks. Some common caulerpa are toxic to herbivorous fish. I've also had at least two types of caulerpa spawn on me which makes the water milky for a day and the entire plant turns transparent and dies. One type, taxfolia, once the most common strain kept in aquariums, was purposefully engineered by the Monaco Aquarium to be resistant to UV and temperatures that kill off the unaltered natural algae. Caulerpa taxfolia became wildly invasive and was banned in some U.S. states and other countries. This lead aquarists to replace it with with cheato. Many types of caulerpa are still fine to use, although they're usually considered a bit less preferable than cheato because of the spawning issue. That's my understanding anyway. I don't always stay as updated about these things as I used to so someone else here may have better info that I do. I sorta have a memory like a rabbit tail... short and fuzzy. lol

Edit: About some benefits, caulerpa actually grows faster for many people than other algae, even cheato (though not for everybody). Also, a very large amount can be grown in a relatively small area and it is crazy easy to manage. This means loads of waste removal from the water column and lots of oxygen production and co2 removal. This is why I always have a variety of algae in my refugiums.

 

[CorallineAlgae]

Since you mentioned growing caulerpa, I'll go ahead and ask what it's benefits are.. A little bit of it hitchhiked with my chaeto and I briefly read a little bit about.. Saw a lot of negative things and most people opted for chaeto instead.. I left the piece in there for now till I found out more about it

Was that what you were wandering about? My previous post, I mean. -_-

 

[Keithhjs]

I fun my light 24/7 on my fuge with chaeto and a non sexual reproducing caulepra.

 

[aadair22]

@corralinealgae yes very helpful, thank you very much!!