Confused with cycling in 5g hex...

[new2betas]

I have been cycling my 5g hex the last 2-3 weeks. I used some seeded filter media in this tank first. I had my six albino cories in there to begin with then I noticed that it WAS too many fish for that tank, as I was having to do daily pwc's so I moved them over to my 29g. After moving them over I decided to finish cycling with ammonia, which is what I have been doing for the last two weeks. I have had nitrites and ammonia. I didn't have to dose ammonia every day as it seemed dosing it to 3-4ppm lasted a couple of days. Yesterday morning (around 7 am) I was still showing high nitrites and moderate ammonia. Last night around 7 pm I showed NO nitrites, but still .25-.50 ammonia. Same thing this morning.....no nitrites, but .25-.50 ammonia. What gives? If there are still nitrites in there shouldn't there be 0 ammonia if it has cycled?
I am really wanting to get my daughter's male betta in this tank as he has been in his hospital tank for two weeks now and is ready to be moved to something bigger.
BTW - I have no ammonia in my tap water naturally...I have tested it a few times in the past.

 

[marchmaxima]

Heya Dottie

If you have seeded using material from another tank, it is possible you're almost at the end of the cycle period. Lots of tanks (including mine) went totally haywire for a day or two. All the readings went bizzare, totally freaking me out at the time. Around 48 hours later ammonia and nitrite went to 0ppm and nitrates spiked.

what's your nitrate reading like at the moment?

 

[new2betas]

Sharon,
Thanks for replying.....this is the first day of school for my kids and as you know the nitrate test takes a few more minutes to do than the nitrite....once I get my kiddos settled this morning, I will test nitrates. It just really confused me getting 0 reading on nitrites and .25-.50ppm for ammonia. I will test nitrates in a few minutes. I need to do it for my 26g also, as I am having some weird algae in there and it was suggested I test my nitrates....just been busy the last couple of days with kiddos and school preparation. Thanks again!! Will post nitrates in a bit.

 

[marchmaxima]

good luck with the little-ones! First day of school is always madness....

 

[new2betas]

Nitrates are 10-20ppm.....

 

[SpeedEuphoria]

I've seen this a couple times in a couple threads here about fishless cycling or cycling in general.

The only thing that makes since to me is that although the nitrite to nitrate bacteria seem to grow slower than the ammonia to nitrite bacteria. It seems that they are faster at consuming nitrite into nitrate then the other bacteria can convert ammonia into nitrite. Hence the nitrite reading dropping to 0 while you still have an ammonia reading. Or it could be that the ammonia to nitrite bacteria show up quicker but multiply slower then the other.

I also think you should be able to dose less ammonia after it gets going or do every other day dosing.

 

[new2betas]

So, should I be able (after a pwc) to go ahead and add the betta today or tomorrow, or should I wait until absolutely no ammonia is showing up??

 

[SpeedEuphoria]

Well if you already dosed ammonia today, then I would skip tomorrow or just add a little bit. Then recheck to make sure it has gone down to 0. ou prob want to do this for a couple days, like just 1/2 the amount you have been using and make sure it goes down to 0.

 

[new2betas]

That's just it....I haven't dosed ammonia since yesterday or the day before. That is why I was confused at why I was getting an ammonia reading with a 0 nitrite reading.

 

[new2betas]

Now I am really confused....I just tested the 5g again and my ammonia is climbing. It is now between .5-1ppm and my nitrites are still 0. I don't get it....

 

[new2betas]

Nitrites 0, ammonia still 1.....would a major water change remedy this? The only thing in the tank is a ramshorn snail and three low light plants.

 

[neilanh]

Wow, that is a good one.

Are you sure something isn't rotting in your tank causing the ammonia to continue to rise? Excess food, something off of the seed material you got?

Also, have you tested another tank to see if you're getting ammonia readings there too? Could be a test kit problem I suppose.

When was the last time you dosed? I wouldn't go more than 48 hours, as right now I'm not convinced you have any ammonia and youcould be starving your colonies.

 

[new2betas]

I had slight ammonia(like 0.5 or less) yesterday in my 29g (which is where some of the seed material I squeezing into the tank today - came from a sponge filter), but I did a pwc on that tank yesterday....so it shouldn't have made my 5g ammonia rise. There is nothing in the tank rotting....plants are fine, snail is fine...no food that I know of unless there was something in there from when the cories were in there, but I didn't want to vacuum as that could hurt the bacteria also. My test kit is fine as I use it on other tanks in the house. I am gonna go really inspect the tank and make sure I don't see anything rotting, but I don't think it could be that as all fish are out and nothing died in there.

 

[new2betas]

I don't see anything in there that could be the cause of the ammonia. I tested it again and it is still around .50. Also, how could they die off if there is obvious ammonia in the tank?

 

[neilanh]

Just because something is triggering a response in the ammonia test, doesn't mean it's ammonia.

My only point is that until we figure out for sure, since theres nothing in the tank it won't hurt and is a safeguard against starving the bacteria.

Chloramines trigger the ammonia test to read that there's ammonia inthe water, even though there isn't. Not saying that's necessarily what's going on here, just identifying that other sources can trigger that test to be positive.

 

[new2betas]

What could cause chloramines to show up...as in what could be in my tank that is making chloramines? I did, when I first got the tank and put plants in, fertilize with seachems fert tablets in the gravel....could that be it? Is there anything I can do to make them go away, as in pwc. I have just not had this ever happen on the other tanks when I cycled them....I cycled with ammonia, got nitrites, fed them, then both went to 0 and didn't rise back up...I am just confused on what to do. If I keep putting in ammonia it will feed the nitrites, but how will I get an accurate reading on my ammonia? See what I am saying? I am just scratching my head over this....lol.

 

[JohnPaul]

Hmm...very odd.

One thing you didn't mention (unless I missed it) is whether you are seeing nitrates. Are you getting any of those? I think if you are seeing nitrates then it tells us you have the whole variety of bacteria in place (though maybe not quite as many as you need).

As for chloramines, those aren't produced by the tank, the only way to get those in your tank is if your tap water has chloramines in it. The best way to test for that is to take some tap water, treat it with whatever dechlorinator you use, and then run an ammonia test on it and see if you get any result.

Otherwise, I'm just as perplexed as anyone.

 

[new2betas]

Nitrates are 10-20ppm.....

it was on the first page...lol..

 

[new2betas]

When I test my tap water with dechlorinator I get a 0 for ammonia

 

[JohnPaul]

it was on the first page...lol..

doh!

Okay, here's my take on it. You've seen nitrites, and you've seen nitrates. That tells me you have the basics of a full cycle in place. I would do a major water change (50%) and then do one last test for ammonia and nitrites; hopefully you'll get zero nitrites and close to zero ammonia.

I think you're close to the end of the cycle, but you don't quite yet have enough of the ammonia-eating bacteria to process (quickly) 3-4 ppm ammonia. However, ONE betta in there by himself is not going to be producing ammonia at that sort of rate, so you almost certainly have enough of the bacteria in place right now to process whatever ammonia your betta produces.

That's my best guess right now.