First 55 gallon Stocking

[Rav_Roth]

Let me first say, it is nice to meet everyone! I've always looked to this site for good information, and I finally joined.

So, as the title says, I'll be getting my first 55 gallon tank soon (woot woot!). I've had smaller tanks up until now, so I'm excited to have some bigger fish. Naturally, a search for bigger fish (that also have personalities) brought up cichlids.

So far, I really like Jack Dempseys--even with all their meanness. All I have read says they can live in a 55 and won't have to be moved, which is ideal (please correct me if I'm wrong). Can anyone recommend some nice tank mates for one? Also, any information on their behavior and care would be much appreciated.

I also really like Angelfish, I realize that also limits tank mates quite a bit, but if anyone knows any other good sized fish that can live with them I would love to know.

 

[Rivers2k]

I use to be in love with JD's until I owned one. They are great when they are young but become more reclusive as they get bigger. They can live in a 55 for life if that is really what you want. However there are allot of Central American Cichlids that do better in 55. Some of my favorites are Firemouths, Honduran Redpoints, Convicts, Rainbow Cichlids, and Sajica. Another fish I love are severums some may argue a 75 is better for them though but I think they are fine in a 55.

There are lots of JD owners on here that love them. I just wanted to share my 2 cents.

 

[Rav_Roth]

Aren't dither fish supposed to help them be less reclusive? Or are they just there to break up aggression and be pretty?

I'll look into the fish you mentioned, do any of them really interact with the people outside the tank? I know Oscars are well known for that behavior, but I have read they will definitely outgrow a 55.

 

[Rivers2k]

Yes they are but that doesn't always work. Many CA's are very people interactive. IMO the thoricthys are less people interactive but are great to watch in groups. Convicts and Honduran Red Points act like dogs. Mine is just as interactive as an Oscar.

JD's are definetly not interactive like oscars.

Oscars in a 55 is a huge argument between people on this site. Can they fit in a 55, yes. But they wont be happy for life and you will have to do allot of water changes. You get a Con or an HRP and you get that interaction plus give the fish plenty of swimming room.

 

[Rav_Roth]

I wasn't sure about the dithers, hadn't heard the term until I started looking stuff up about cichlids, so thanks for clearing that up.
I'll definitely do some reading on the Convicts and Red Points, since those are the type of personalities I'd been looking for. Thanks!

 

[Rivers2k]

No problem glad to help. You can see my male HRP in my avatar by far one of the best fish I ever owned.

 

[Rav_Roth]

The online profiles gave a general description of the HRP temperament, but does yours generally get along with other fish (bully, get bullied, ect)?

Also, I must know....are Convicts as mean as they're made out to be?

I want you to know, all this really helps

 

[Mogurako]

Also, I must know....are Convicts as mean as they're made out to be?

Only when spawning but that can really be said for almost all Central American cichlids .


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[Rivers2k]

What mog says is true. But I do find Cons are much more aggressive than HRP's. However Con's aren't so aggressive that you can't have tank mates. They work well with other CA's or dither fish.

My platinum HRP is boss of the tank but doesn't really chase much he just keep others out of his territory. My Blue HRP I had to put in my Thorichtys tank as he was more aggressive and the two males weren't working out together my platinum is in with another platinum male and female and he doesn't pay him any attention. My male female ratio is not ideal but I mail ordered and received a total of 5 males and 1 female that was just my luck.

When breeding occurs most cichlids get much more aggressive. Also I think giving them the most room periods really makes there personalities flourish so try not to overstock.

 

[Rivers2k]

BTW I posted pics of mine on this thread if you are interested.

http://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums/f100/let-me-see-what-ya-got-327605-2.html

 

[Mogurako]

Target fish?! Convicts don't really need dithers.


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[Rivers2k]

I know its not technically correct but I got in the habit of calling smaller, schooling, non centerpiece fish dither fish. Dither as in either here nor there just ads a little something to the tank.

I had a school of lemon tetras that did very well with mine. I referred to them as "dithers" which isn't the case but they weren't really "target fish" either cause they were never bothered with.

 

[Mogurako]

I know its not technically correct but I got in the habit of calling smaller, schooling, non centerpiece fish dither fish. Dither as in either here nor there just ads a little something to the tank.

I had a school of lemon tetras that did very well with mine. I referred to them as "dithers" which isn't the case but they weren't really "target fish" either cause they were never bothered with.

If they act as neither target of dither doesn't it just make more sense to say " add a school of X or Group of X" ? I'm just curious because calling it dither of target is misleading. I do agree though that a group of tetra, swords, ect add allot to a tank.


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[Rivers2k]

If they act as neither target of dither doesn't it just make more sense to say " add a school of X or Group of X" ? I'm just curious because calling it dither of target is misleading. I do agree though that a group of tetra, swords, ect add allot to a tank.


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years ago when I was first learning Dither was used how I used the term. Target fish wasn't used, at least in the north east where I was from and this was before internet so I am sure just different areas. I already admitted its just an old habit. But were getting off topic I think OP gets the point.

 

[mikem691]

In my experience the more aggressive the fish the more interactive it will be.

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[Rav_Roth]

I know its not technically correct but I got in the habit of calling smaller, schooling, non centerpiece fish dither fish. Dither as in either here nor there just ads a little something to the tank.

I'm a little confused about the term dither fish now, I know I said they're used to make fish less shy, but I thought that you could also use the term in the way Rivers2k did?

Also, please bear with me as I learn how to post and quote things here, I appreciate it

 

[Rivers2k]

I'm a little confused about the term dither fish now, I know I said they're used to make fish less shy, but I thought that you could also use the term in the way Rivers2k did?

Also, please bear with me as I learn how to post and quote things here, I appreciate it

Technically Mog is right the term "dither fish" is apparently reserved for fish to help other fish be less afraid. This is new to me since being on fish forums. If you use fish to spread out aggression they are called "target fish".

I always heard "dither" used as fish that are either to help fish be less afraid or just little fish that aren't a centerpiece and you don't care much about they just add a little something. The whole target fish thing I don't agree with at all but that is just my opinion. I think there are better ways to deal with aggression.

 

[Mogurako]

I always heard "dither" used as fish that are either to help fish be less afraid or just little fish that aren't a centerpiece and you don't care much about they just add a little something. The whole target fish thing I don't agree with at all but that is just my opinion. I think there are better ways to deal with aggression.

Dead $1 tetra is better than losing half your Cichlid stock in a particular tank, a little barbaric I know but it works. My Vieja argentea went through 20 Buenos Aries tetra in pretty short order when I was growing them out.

Keep in mind I'm only really talking about Centrals, like river said there are better ways to curb aggression in other types of cichlids. Keeping mixed Centrals or groups of the same species is always a mixed bag and normally someone gets the short end of the stick.


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[Rav_Roth]

Ohhh, ok. I hadn't heard of target fish before either, I kinda thought dithers were supposed to do both.

I heard of someone using Tiger Barbs as dither fish, would they really work out? I always thought that they were a bit too mean for that. Other than that, do most people just use tropical tetras?

 

[Rivers2k]

Dead $1 tetra is better than losing half your Cichlid stock in a particular tank, a little barbaric I know but it works. My Vieja argentea went through 20 Buenos Aries tetra in pretty short order when I was growing them out.

Keep in mind I'm only really talking about Centrals, like river said there are better ways to curb aggression in other types of cichlids. Keeping mixed Centrals or groups of the same species is always a mixed bag and normally someone gets the short end of the stick.


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Centrals are trial and error getting the right balance. For me instead of letting the tetras get beat on I move fish around. I start by making sure the dominant fish have there own territories. If that doesn't work I take one out for a while (few days sometimes weeks) and adding back later. I also try to make sure I have the right m/f ratio (my tank is off in that respect but it is working because of individual temperament). Some nasty individuals have to be rehomed because they have to be the boss and wont let anyone else in their tank. I have a good mix of CA in two tanks with no aggression issues. Just takes time finding the right individuals, gender, species, and right mix I never use target fish. If I had dithers being targeted I would rehome.

Other people do it that's fine just not my preference I feel bad for fish getting beat on because they have no escape. I know I sound like a bleeding heart but I am far from it which makes it so funny.