First tank - 20 gal, few questions!! New to the forum

[andrea_]

Decided to take the plunge into this new hobby. I visited our local tropical fish store and got set up with a 20gal tank, everything I need for it, gravel, fake plants and some rocks. The man helping me said I could use 4-5 hardy fish to start so I got some tetras, guorami, a molly and a Platy. He also said to wait about a month before doing the first 20% water change. Now, after doing a LOT of online research I am reading water changes should start immediately, and that I should have ran a fish less cycle. I don't have any water testing strips and he did not mention having to check water chemistry, just to wait a month before adding more fish. I'm a little concerned, my fish seem happy right now, it's been about 3 days since I've had the tank, also my molly happened to be pregnant so I have 5 baby fry swimming around now, lmao, of course!!

So my question is I guess, was this guys advice not correct?? When should I be doing water changes and should I get some water testing strips?

 

[evil Nick]

I just finished mine with a molly and platy.
They are pretty hardy fish and honestly didn't seem to care to much about anything. I also had 2 snails (one did die) and 2 ghost shrimp, still hardy and bigger than ever.

I did have real plants, driftwood and starting chemicals though.

Might want to look into safe start or a similar style treatment.

http://www.amazon.com/Tetra-77962-S...d=1415118388&sr=1-1&keywords=tetra+safe+start

I did minor water changes after some suggestions from others but in the end I dont think it made a ton of difference over using the starter chemical.

My spikes happened and Im still at just above zero ppm in nitrates but all my fish seem good and happy now.

I would def get the test kit. Do your tests every couple of days. In my eyes you have to be willing to expect a fish to kick. It may be related to the cycle, they may just be stressed or who knows what else. I had 2 fish die on me from the store. I never returned them unfortunately since the gas would have been more expensive and they only offer a 24 hour return and my time is way busy right now.

Amazon.com : API Freshwater Master Test Kit : Aquarium Test Kits : Pet Supplies


Amazon is a WEALTH of good priced products.
Im looking to upgrade my filter pretty soon (shhhhhhh dont tell my GF though)

Im new to actually cycling as well so hopefully you will experience some of the things I did and vice versa.

As for the babies they wont live, the other fish will eat them either way. It is what is it really.

 

[andrea_]

Thanks for the advice! I went back to the store I went to and told them about the babies. I had no idea what to do! He said a few babies would possibly make it through natural selection and more plants/places for them to hide out in the tank. He said don't "dumb down the species" by trying to save them all. I think we lost at least one fry so far, but they are pretty good at hiding. My fruit tetra though keeps trying to get them and chases them around the tank =\ I know it's the circle of life however.


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[Wy Renegade]

You need to invest in a test kit as quickly as possible. As soon as ammonia begins reaching toxic levels, you need to start doing water changes. Failing to do so will result in lost/stressed fish with a shortened life span. It is perfectly safe to do a fish-in cycle, you just need to follow the guidelines. The link below will take you to an excellent article on fish-in cycling. Personally, I don't put much faith in bacterial additives. If you actually test water quality while using them, you will find they don't actually do much.

http://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums/f12/fish-in-cycling-step-over-into-the-dark-side-176446.html

 

[andrea_]

Thank you. I will go get a test kit today. My molly mom isn't doing well at all, she's laying on the gravel and not swimming. I understand losing fish is apart of getting started but I want to avoid it!


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[evil Nick]

Thank you. I will go get a test kit today. My molly mom isn't doing well at all, she's laying on the gravel and not swimming. I understand losing fish is apart of getting started but I want to avoid it!


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Using the safe start should help.

My Amoonia hit 8ppm for a while and I have all my fish healthy and happy. Probably much happier now then before but still there swimming like champs. the only two fish I lost were right from the store.
One snail death was root tab assisted suicide I believe.

Again Im new to cycling. Ive always had tanks and been lucky with them (mostly Oscars tho) so with this listen to others, Im only telling you what I was doing. I did like 2 small water changes over the time, on the suggestion of others, but they never helped my readings and then I Had to go on vaca so in the end I just had to keep my fingers crossed and wait it out. I kept up on the solution treatment though. When I returned from New Orleans after one more week my tank seemed to be complete and my levels good. Dont get me wrong I was a wreck thinking about the poor fish but really what could I do but wait.
Im trying to slowly add fish now so I dont spike. Patience is a virtue, but unfortunately was never one of mine

some plants may help you too. I had them all through my cycle as well.

 

[Wy Renegade]

Using the safe start should help.

My Amoonia hit 8ppm for a while and I have all my fish healthy and happy. Probably much happier now then before but still there swimming like champs. the only two fish I lost were right from the store.
One snail death was root tab assisted suicide I believe.

Again Im new to cycling. Ive always had tanks and been lucky with them (mostly Oscars tho) so with this listen to others, Im only telling you what I was doing. I did like 2 small water changes over the time, on the suggestion of others, but they never helped my readings and then I Had to go on vaca so in the end I just had to keep my fingers crossed and wait it out. I kept up on the solution treatment though. When I returned from New Orleans after one more week my tank seemed to be complete and my levels good. Dont get me wrong I was a wreck thinking about the poor fish but really what could I do but wait.
Im trying to slowly add fish now so I dont spike. Patience is a virtue, but unfortunately was never one of mine

some plants may help you too. I had them all through my cycle as well.

Plants are definitely helpful when cycling as many types of aquatic plants are able to directly uptake ammonia and keep it from harming fish.

Having survived the cycle at toxic levels and being "happy and healthy" are two very different things. Many fish exposed to toxic levels of ammonia will survive the the initial cycle and appear to be happy and healthy. However, they have suffered from what is known as ammonia burn and will generally have a significantly shortened life cycle as a result. The overall effect is long term not short term, and is not measured by who did and didn't survive the cycle. Many people aren't even aware of this shortened life cycle, because they don't keep their fish over the long run long enough to notice if they have a shortened or normal life cycle.

 

[trennamw]

Congrats on the new tank and welcome!

The pet store guy absolutely advised you incorrectly.

The link above is invaluable. It's ok to do a fish in cycle but it takes specific fish, tests, and water changes.

Losing fish shouldn't be part of getting started, if you're given good advice.

Mollies are often the top of the lists of fish that aren't really for beginners.

Can you return the fish except the platies?

All due respect Evil Nick, having read and tried to help you during the process ... your fish went through a pretty extreme cycle. It's great that you're trying to help and you did note you're new, but I think it's important to add "it's only been a few weeks" to the claim your fish are fine after 8ppm ammonia levels. You were skeptical about a lot of the advice, and this place could use skeptics to keep everyone thinking, but the implication 8ppm ammonia is fine if you're not a snail is a little extreme.

To the OP, well done for doing research right away.

Do get that test kit immediately. Some Seachem Prime may help. Something that is bottled bacteria, like Cycle or Safe Start, may or may not help. A 50% water change right away wouldn't hurt either.

The fish store guy also didn't advise you well on the stock ... If you want the fish to thrive, Platies mollies and tetras need a few of the same fish to school with to prevent stress. If you already have 3 or more of each of those, plus a gourami, you're probably way overstocked for cycling.

I have a 29 gallon and after the fishless cycle I only started with 6 rasboras and 6 glowlight tetras.

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[FWFishTanks]

Try to buy some used filter media as this will hold beneficial bacteria and help in the cycle process.

 

[andrea_]

Congrats on the new tank and welcome!

The pet store guy absolutely advised you incorrectly.

The link above is invaluable. It's ok to do a fish in cycle but it takes specific fish, tests, and water changes.

Losing fish shouldn't be part of getting started, if you're given good advice.

Mollies are often the top of the lists of fish that aren't really for beginners.

Can you return the fish except the platies?

All due respect Evil Nick, having read and tried to help you during the process ... your fish went through a pretty extreme cycle. It's great that you're trying to help and you did note you're new, but I think it's important to add "it's only been a few weeks" to the claim your fish are fine after 8ppm ammonia levels. You were skeptical about a lot of the advice, and this place could use skeptics to keep everyone thinking, but the implication 8ppm ammonia is fine if you're not a snail is a little extreme.

To the OP, well done for doing research right away.

Do get that test kit immediately. Some Seachem Prime may help. Something that is bottled bacteria, like Cycle or Safe Start, may or may not help. A 50% water change right away wouldn't hurt either.

The fish store guy also didn't advise you well on the stock ... If you want the fish to thrive, Platies mollies and tetras need a few of the same fish to school with to prevent stress. If you already have 3 or more of each of those, plus a gourami, you're probably way overstocked for cycling.

I have a 29 gallon and after the fishless cycle I only started with 6 rasboras and 6 glowlight tetras.

Sent from my iPhone with three hands tied behind my back.

I have one female Molly, one male Platy, two female tetras and a gourami I can't tell the sex. This store is the best and only tropical fish store in my area.... He didn't say the fish needed to go in pairs or not, he recommended the hearty fish and I picked some out. Ugh. All of the fish are actually doing really well, very active and eating. I bought test strips and everything is a little high but still in the safe zone.

 

[andrea_]

Try to buy some used filter media as this will hold beneficial bacteria and help in the cycle process.

I went back in and was recommended some aqua bac-t. Added that into the tank yesterday

 

[giantstx]

You don't have to run a fish less cycle, but only have the aquarium at about 20% fish capacity for a little while


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