Fishless Cycle Question

[NYFishGuy714]

Hi I'm new to the site so I don't know if I'm posting this in the right section. If I did please let me know and I will move it. Ok so my question is in regards to the fishless cycle. I have a 36 gallon bow front that is currently going through a fishless cycle and I have been following the almost complete guide to fishless cycling sticky to do so. I followed all directions and over time had an ammonia spike followed by a spike in nitrites and then had nitrates show up and build up really high. Once the nitrite and nitrate levels were sky high I followed what the sticky said and did a 50-60% water change and added a small pinch of ground up fish food to the tank after the water change. That was done yesterday morning. That night I tested the water and the ammonia was low like it has been. I've been dosing it to 3-4 ppm each time I see it get around 1ppm. The nitrites were high and the nitrates weren't as high as they were before the water change but they were still there. I dosed the ammonia up to 3ppm and went to bed. Today I test the water and the ammonia was low again maybe 1ppm and that's pushing it. Nitrites are still high and the nitrates were a little higher than last night. I know on the fishless cycling guide I'm at the part where I'm just supposed to keep dosing ammonia up to 4ppm, watching the PH for any fluctuations and then it says wait for the magic to happen as in waking up one day to test and the ammonia should be zero along with the nitrites and the nitrates should be built up pretty high by this point. Then it says to do the 24 hour test with the ammonia to see if your cycle is done.. So after a long story here are my questions. Do my readings seem right? If my nitrites keep staying so high can that stall the cycle? and if so should I keep doing water changes when I see the nitrites so high? Once again after I did the 50-60 pwc, a day or so later I'm getting ammonia readings that drop quickly nitrites are staying high and nitrates are building back up again. Does this seem right? From this point as long as I dose the ammonia when needed and the PH levels don't fluctuate should I just wake up one morning and the ammona and nitrites should be gone?? I guess I'm confused as to what happens to the nitrites.. I mean if my ammonia levels drop pretty fast each time after I dose them up and the nitrites stay high and then the nitrates build up high again what happens that just makes the nitrites disappear? Sorry if this is confusing I'm in a huge rush to get out of the house while typing this. Thanks for any help I can get!

 

[Manic Fury]

Hi I'm new to the site so I don't know if I'm posting this in the right section. If I did please let me know and I will move it. Ok so my question is in regards to the fishless cycle. I have a 36 gallon bow front that is currently going through a fishless cycle and I have been following the almost complete guide to fishless cycling sticky to do so. I followed all directions and over time had an ammonia spike followed by a spike in nitrites and then had nitrates show up and build up really high. Once the nitrite and nitrate levels were sky high I followed what the sticky said and did a 50-60% water change and added a small pinch of ground up fish food to the tank after the water change. That was done yesterday morning. That night I tested the water and the ammonia was low like it has been. I've been dosing it to 3-4 ppm each time I see it get around 1ppm. The nitrites were high and the nitrates weren't as high as they were before the water change but they were still there. I dosed the ammonia up to 3ppm and went to bed. Today I test the water and the ammonia was low again maybe 1ppm and that's pushing it. Nitrites are still high and the nitrates were a little higher than last night. I know on the fishless cycling guide I'm at the part where I'm just supposed to keep dosing ammonia up to 4ppm, watching the PH for any fluctuations and then it says wait for the magic to happen as in waking up one day to test and the ammonia should be zero along with the nitrites and the nitrates should be built up pretty high by this point. Then it says to do the 24 hour test with the ammonia to see if your cycle is done.. So after a long story here are my questions. Do my readings seem right? If my nitrites keep staying so high can that stall the cycle? and if so should I keep doing water changes when I see the nitrites so high? Once again after I did the 50-60 pwc, a day or so later I'm getting ammonia readings that drop quickly nitrites are staying high and nitrates are building back up again. Does this seem right? From this point as long as I dose the ammonia when needed and the PH levels don't fluctuate should I just wake up one morning and the ammona and nitrites should be gone?? I guess I'm confused as to what happens to the nitrites.. I mean if my ammonia levels drop pretty fast each time after I dose them up and the nitrites stay high and then the nitrates build up high again what happens that just makes the nitrites disappear? Sorry if this is confusing I'm in a huge rush to get out of the house while typing this. Thanks for any help I can get!

I can't really help with the questions but just a little advice to help the more experienced people here on Aquarium Advice.

Could you space out your posts so that each individual thing you're trying to say/ask is more visible? It would be easier to read rather than a huge block of text.

Just giving a little advice, even if it isn't Aquarium Advice.

 

[Masha]

This sounds fine. It seems your cycle is on track.

Basically, the bacteria that converts ammonia to nitrites multiply faster than the bacteria that converts nitrite to nitrate. So for a while, you will see ammonia level dropping down, and nitrite rising.

I don't know if too high nitrites can stall the cycle- I've read conflicting things- but doing water changes to lower nitrites does no harm and makes it easier for you to see what's going on since nitrites are kept in a readable range.

Does that make sense?

 

[Rivercats]

Yes, too high nitrites can stall a cycle. If they are very high do a WC or 2 and get them down to readable levels. Any time they get very high you need to bring them down into a readable level to keep the cycle moving.

 

[NYFishGuy714]

I can't really help with the questions but just a little advice to help the more experienced people here on Aquarium Advice.

Could you space out your posts so that each individual thing you're trying to say/ask is more visible? It would be easier to read rather than a huge block of text.

Just giving a little advice, even if it isn't Aquarium Advice.

Thanks for the suggestion!

 

[NYFishGuy714]

This sounds fine. It seems your cycle is on track.

Basically, the bacteria that converts ammonia to nitrites multiply faster than the bacteria that converts nitrite to nitrate. So for a while, you will see ammonia level dropping down, and nitrite rising.

I don't know if too high nitrites can stall the cycle- I've read conflicting things- but doing water changes to lower nitrites does no harm and makes it easier for you to see what's going on since nitrites are kept in a readable range.

Does that make sense?

Yes it does, thank you for responding.

 

[NYFishGuy714]

Yes, too high nitrites can stall a cycle. If they are very high do a WC or 2 and get them down to readable levels. Any time they get very high you need to bring them down into a readable level to keep the cycle moving.

Thanks for the info!

 

[NYFishGuy714]

I actually have one more question. So say I do a pwc and bring the nitrites down to more readable levels, do I keep dosing the ammonia up to 3-4ppm each day when it drops?

I know that will make the nitrites go up which I don't want to be too high but I was told the bacteria need some ammonia in the water to feed off so I'm a little confused on that.

 

[Masha]

I actually have one more question. So say I do a pwc and bring the nitrites down to more readable levels, do I keep dosing the ammonia up to 3-4ppm each day when it drops?

I know that will make the nitrites go up which I don't want to be too high but I was told the bacteria need some ammonia in the water to feed off so I'm a little confused on that.

That is correct. The amonia-eating bacteria needs to be fed, so you cant leave it at 0.
Consider lowering the ammonia dose. The 4ppm thing is not a rule, and many people find lower doses a bit easier to handle at this stage.

You can always increase the ammo dose once the nitrite eating bacteria has more of a hold.

 

[NYFishGuy714]

That is correct. The amonia-eating bacteria needs to be fed, so you cant leave it at 0.
Consider lowering the ammonia dose. The 4ppm thing is not a rule, and many people find lower doses a bit easier to handle at this stage.

You can always increase the ammo dose once the nitrite eating bacteria has more of a hold.

Once again thank you for taking the time to respond. It's very much appreciated.

 

[Masha]

That's a pleasure. Good luck!

 

[NYFishGuy714]

Ok well I did a huge water change I'm talking like 80-85% and let the tank run for about 15 mins. I then tested the nitrites and they were still 5ppm maybe more as that is as high as the api test kit goes. How is that possible?

 

[Rivercats]

Ok well I did a huge water change I'm talking like 80-85% and let the tank run for about 15 mins. I then tested the nitrites and they were still 5ppm maybe more as that is as high as the api test kit goes. How is that possible?

It's possible because they were most likely sky high and you still haven't gotten them down to readable levels.

 

[pip walters]

Hi
I have just posted a thread about cycling a tank. Not sure how long it takes to appear, but have a look and let me know your thoughts.

 

[pip walters]

Yes, too high nitrites can stall a cycle. If they are very high do a WC or 2 and get them down to readable levels. Any time they get very high you need to bring them down into a readable level to keep the cycle moving.

How will it stall the cycle?
If he does a water change at this stage, surely he is reducing the food for the very bacteria he wants to develop in his tank, which will stall the cycle.

 

[Rivercats]

A really high nitrite level can affect the bacteria that should be processing them. Too much nitrites just as too much/high ammonia will make it very hard if not impossible for the bacteria to be able to build up to a high enough level to process it.

When nitrites are off the charts you lower it to a "readable" level which means there is still enough "food", nitrites in this case, left in the water for Nitrobacter bacteria to develop and convert nitrites to nitrates but not so much food/nitrites to overwhelm the cycle and stall it.

 

[NYFishGuy714]

It's possible because they were most likely sky high and you still haven't gotten them down to readable levels.

So on my next water change should I do even more than I did before? Like maybe 90-95 % of the water? I just don't want to mess this up, it's my first Fishless cycle.

 

[NYFishGuy714]

I was also able to obtain my friends fathers filter cartridge he was just finished using to seed his new cartridge he bought. He said his tank has been established for about two years and he hasn't had any problems in the last year. I hope this can help with my cycle.

 

[Rivercats]

So on my next water change should I do even more than I did before? Like maybe 90-95 % of the water? I just don't want to mess this up, it's my first Fishless cycle.

Honestly I'd just do 50% WC's until you get nitrites down to readable levels. You do want some nitrites, just not massive amounts of them.

Then if you can add some seeded media that should really speed things up for you.

 

[NYFishGuy714]

Honestly I'd just do 50% WC's until you get nitrites down to readable levels. You do want some nitrites, just not massive amounts of them.

Then if you can add some seeded media that should really speed things up for you.

Ok I will definitely do that.