Going Tanganyikan -Q&A, Plans

[trustemedia]

It looks good so far! I'd add a little more to each side, and just make sure they are REALLY secure, as shellies are for the most part diggers

A black background will make it really pop too

Ok. The right side is pretty packed. Lots more than it looks like in the picture. Looks pretty cool in person as the rocks I got have such great color in them. And I topped the smaller ones off with the big ones so it looks like a series of ledges and it's all maze-like underneath. I was afraid to go any higher due to the risk of being too high and falling over. They are really tight and secure right now and resting on the bottom. I did a good job of packing them in tight. Hubby even came over to guess me asking if they were secure, tried to move them, and said, OK. I poured all the water on top of them when filling the tank to make sure, too! I'll see what I can do to the other side for sure and I'll try out the right side, but can't promise there. I'll do my best.

Right now I have it in front of a mirror. I'm going to like that for awhile before I decide on a background. It might be fun to see them from behind with the mirror behind the tank for awhile. I do like the black backgrounds to make the colors pop on the fish.

 

[trustemedia]

Are callochromis stapersii sandsifters? I had Xed them off of my community plan for some reason but now I can't remember. They're aggressive with somebody I thought. Was it the shellies? Are they the ones that make huge sandy nests?

Their profile here says they are not. On the sand sifters, the Habitat section says sand. For these guys it says: Shallow Sediment-Rich Habitat. Doesn't say "sand". May have to do some more digging on them. Like I said before, I seen a lot of people saying they had them, but it was actually Callochromis Pluerospirus that they had, according to the pictures I saw of them. I think they are getting mixed up big time in the trade Or they may have been reclassified to a Puerospirus category. Not sure. I see the reclassification a lot.


Scientific Name: Callochromis stappersii

Pronunciation: kl--kr-ms st-prz-

Habitat: Shallow Sediment-Rich Habitat

Diet: Carnivore

Gender Differences: Dimorphic

Breeding: Maternal Mouthbrooder

Temperament: Mildly Aggressive

Conspecific Temperament: Mildly Aggressive

Maximum Size: 4"

Temperature: 77 - 79°F

pH: 8.6

Water Hardness: Very Hard

Difficulty: 2

Comments:
A very pretty fish, that often hovers about six to ten inches off the substrate. This isn't a pairing fish, and it is recommended to keep a single male, to four to six females. In the wild, they dine on insect larvae and small crustaceans, so a diet including flakes, mysis shrimp, daphnia, mosquito larvae, live baby brine shrimp, and cyclops is recommended.

Now the Xenos I wanted I was told were sand and would compete with the shellie so I had to pick one or the other. If I look them up, it says this:

Scientific Name: Xenotilapia sp. "Ochrogenys Ndole"

Pronunciation: z-n-t-l-p- k-r-jn-z

Habitat: Sand

Diet: Carnivore

Gender Differences: Dimorphic

Breeding: Maternal Mouthbrooder

Temperament: Peaceful

Conspecific Temperament: Mildly Aggressive

Maximum Size: 5.5"

Temperature: 77 - 79°F

pH: 8.6

Water Hardness: Very Hard

Difficulty: 4

Definitely says "sand" when it's a sand sifter.

I was assuming the Callochromis Stappersii would be a mid-swimmer for me. Maybe someone who kept them could chime in on that. Or, I can keep reading on the internet what I can find about them.

 

[trustemedia]

Hmm, maybe they are out. I just found this, so don't know - WARNING - LONG -

In 1998 Takahashi & Nakaya made Callochromis stappersii a junior synonym of C. pleurospilus due to overlapping morphometric data between the two (Takahashi & Nakaya 1998), but recent molecular analyses have shown that C. stappersii may in fact be a valid taxa (Koblmüller et al. 2004). This topic will be discussed in a separate paper.

Callochromis pleurospilus in the wild…..

Callochromis pleurospilus are found in the sandy and sediment-rich shallows in the Lake, often located near river outlets or protected bays. Water plants are found in this habitat, the most commonly being Vallisneria spiralis, Ceratophyllum demersum, Myriophyllom spicatum and Hydrilla verticillata (Konings 1998). Out of the breeding season Callochromis pleurospilus form large foraging schools; they feed primarily on crustaceans, small snails, shrimps, insect larvae and other invertebrates and stomach investigations has even revealed remains of fish (Poll 1956); Callochromis pleurospilus can thus be regarded as a generalized carnivore.

Callochromis pleurospilus feeds by sifting the upper layer of sand, filtering it for food. In the Lake they leave the bottom strewn with small pits where they have been searching for food, and similar pits can be seen in the aquarium.

C. pleurospilus is a maternal mouthbrooder, where the males construct small sand-scrape nest, often near rocks or water plants; the nests are located in very shallow water, often less than two meters of depth. The small nests have a diameter of app. 15 cm with an elevated rim. Ripe females are often seen huddle together under the cover of the water plants or at the edge of a more rocky section of the habitat. Mouthbrooding females are often found solitary or in small groups and hide in the water plants as well (Konings 1998).

.....and in the aquarium

In the aquarium Callochromis pleurospilus turns out, in spite of its delicate appearance, to be a rather aggressive and rough sand-dweller, which is best kept in small groups consisting of a single male and at least three females. If more then one male is kept together, it nearly always ends up with one male being the strongest and most dominate, controlling more and more of the aquarium as time goes by; the result of this is at best a male hiding in the corner, or worse, a dead one.

A harem-group as the former can be kept in an aquarium with a length of 120 cm (app. 4 feet) if it’s provided with sufficient shelter for the females. Besides a sandy bottom the tank should have several caves built out of rock and some groups of water plants to offer the females some protection.

While the aggressiveness of Callochromis pleurospilus can be a drawback when trying to keep more males in the same aquarium, it can actually be an advantage when keeping them together with other lake Tanganyika cichlids, as they are much more robust and not so delicate as many of the species in the genus Xenotilapia tend to be. Callochromis pleurospilus can without problems be kept with some of the more rough free-swimming species like e.g. Cyprichromis sp. "leptosoma jumbo" and even Ophthalmotilapia ventralis, of course taken into consideration that the aquarium should be bigger than mentioned above. Callochromis pleurospilus will also do well with various small sized cave-dwelling species from the genus Neolamprologus, if the aquarium is decorated to fulfill the needs of all species, i.e. areas of open sand for Callochromis pleurospilus and piles of rock for the cave-dwellers.

The menu should consist of a replica of its natural diet so various forms of frozen food like artemia, cyclops, mysis and mosquito-larvae (not the red ones!) would be good, as well as chopped up krill and shrimps. I have often observed that Callochromis pleurospilus under their hunt for food stops up, swim a little backwards, looks at the sand and then suddenly trust themselves into the sand completely burying the head. To satisfy this feeding behavior I sometimes bury bits of frozen food in the sand; there is no need to worry about the food not getting eaten, the fish will quickly locate it in the sand – very interesting and good fun to watch!

 

[trustemedia]

Yep, build sand nests: Callochromis pleurospilus is like the rest of the three species in the genus Callochromis a lek-breeder. In their natural habitat the nests are placed a couple of meters apart and that is the reason why we cannot normally have more than one male in our tank; the males will constantly fight and the strongest male will try to chase the weaker male out of its territory. In a small tank the subdominant individual(s) cannot escape the wrath of the dominant male, which will get furious because of the never-ending intrusion on his territory; in time the story usually ends as described above, with only one male left in the aquarium.

But the most interesting has yet to come; the spawning. The male tries vigorously to lure the female into the nest and if he succeeds tries to cut her off in order to prevent her from escaping. The male then leads the female to the centre of the nest and shows where she should deposit her eggs; this is done by folding the anal fin so that the orange-red margin resembles an egg in three dimensions, while holding it in the centre of the nest; a very interesting play to watch! The female deposits some eggs in the centre of the nest and then turns around and picks them up. At the same time the male holds his folded anal fin in front of the female’s mouth and releases his semen. The female immediately tries to catch the moving "egg" and snaps at it, resulting in the fertilizing of the eggs inside the females mouth. This scenario is repeated until the females is empty of eggs.

But this is all pleurospilus. Is Stappersii that same is the question.

 

[trustemedia]

I've been watching some video of them on YouTube, even only for a few minutes and it looks like they are higher swimmers and don't keep to the ground, but do some down to the ground to take a bite out of sand.

I have no idea how to embed video so here it goes and if it works, I'll do another.

don't know if I should use Code or HTML

 

[trustemedia]

Well, I see people do it, but it's not working for me. Wish I could just paste the embed code in here.

 

[trustemedia]

Callochromis stappersii - YouTube

 

[trustemedia]

Okay, guess just pasting the link works.

callochromis stappersii ikola 2 - YouTube

Callochromis stappersii - YouTube

callochromis stappersii ikola - YouTube

Need someone experienced to weight in on this one now.

 

[trustemedia]

Do I just need to take up more floor space with the rocks. Just thought you might have meant that instead of taller. Wasn't thinking. Let me know.

Also, do you have any experience with these and would they work (yep, back at it)

Triglachromis Otostigma - these parents take turn housing the fry in their mouths!

Ectodus Descampsii (Ndole Bay) - there's a small discussion on them here Ectodus Descampsii (Ndole Bay) - Cyphos.com with photos and saying they mostly keep to themselves at mid level, but again looking like they entice females in sand.

 

[howmanyds]

I think taller is better so you don't waste too much of your sand space. But you have to be very careful to make it super stable. I got a bunch of flat pieces from a local builder supply and stacked them in a way to leave lots of caves and tunnels on multiple levels. Anywhere the rocks were wobbly I used that aquarium grade epoxy stuff to bind them together. I might have even over done it with my rocks as there isn't much sand space left, especially after arranging a whole bunch of shells from a NZ and Aussie adventure. I'll probably end up taking some out, especially if I decide on one of the callochromis species.

Don't mean to hijack your thread, but I thought I'd share my planned community to since its similar to yours with fewer shellies and a few lake jumpers:
10 cyps (preferably tricolor)
Pair of julies (probably marlieri, maybe dickfeldi)
Single goby - whatever is available
Single alto comp (probably kipili but can't decide - they're all so cool!)
4 pearly ocellatus
3 synos
And the exchange students, 5 male peacocks, varied
Thinking about getting an eel too and possibly snails.

 

[trustemedia]

Glad you shared your stock. I have been wanting to ask you what you were planning. I keep overposting so never get a chance. Anyway, glad you shared!

 

[trustemedia]

Added more rock:

 

[howmanyds]

Rocks and glass walls do not make good friends. You should get the rocks off the glass so they don't scratch the surface permanently.

Otherwise, looks good!

 

[trustemedia]

Forgot to mention was told in beginning that couldn't have Callochromis Pleurospilus (just remembered):

"c.) callochromis pleurospilus: require too much open space for a 4 ft tank with all of your other stocking. These are another sand sifter species. They'll compete with the Shellies for space too much unfortunately"

The more I research Stappersii, the more I seen that it is less aggressive than Pleurospilus and even read people in other forums saying they consider it a mid-level swimmer since it is barely ever in the sand. When it does build a nest, according to one person's experience, it is very small and was hidden in a corner behind a rock. So, I am thinking they can be a possibility for me, but I would have to make sure to get the Stappersii for sure and not Pleurospilus which is more aggressive, a more bottom fish, and I heard builds a huge sand nest and you should add another inch of substrate to your tank. Although I did seen one person say the nest was small, so who knows - but more people say they are pretty big, I guess, from what I read.

Rocks weren't actually touching glass in that photo. I was hard to get a picture with all the glare, but I did end up rearranging them again, LOL and I did find one touching in the back that I moved. That was my biggest concern going higher, was touching the glass. It helps hold them more secure, but I really don't like it too much if I can help it. Thanks for your tip. I'll have to try and get another pic of the redo later today. I basically just leveled them all out straight the best I could, just the new additions 1/2 way up.

 

[trustemedia]

Oh, I also read that Pleurospilus may be too much for a goby. I can't remember why - aggression, room? You may want to ask about that if you consider Pleurospilus. Otherwise, might just want to consider Stappersii Raspberry like I am. I am liking Stappersii because I'd like to see as much swimming as possible and not so much hiding or bottom sitting stock.

 

[trustemedia]

Sorry, for all the posts, I just remembered another question: Is Eretmodus cyanostictus an herbivore and will that create a problem in the tank with it possibly eating food it's not supposed to eat, getting sick, etc.?

 

[Paxlerod]

Sorry, for all the posts, I just remembered another question: Is Eretmodus cyanostictus an herbivore and will that create a problem in the tank with it possibly eating food it's not supposed to eat, getting sick, etc.?

Keep it up you are elevating the quality of knowledge here. I have kept a lake tang tank now for 3 years and had one about two decades ago and I am no where near to your level of knowledge. Thank you.

 

[Freakgecko91]

Sorry, for all the posts, I just remembered another question: Is Eretmodus cyanostictus an herbivore and will that create a problem in the tank with it possibly eating food it's not supposed to eat, getting sick, etc.?

If you're feeding a high quality pellet like NLS, there shouldn't be a problem

 

[trustemedia]

Well, things have took a crazy turn. After research, and research and success stories and non-success stories, I decided to try my dream stock. (with a plan B if things so different when they get older - another tank! LOL)

Anyway, I only have 3 real rock dwellers - 2 julis and 1 goby (which I almost didn't get, but glad I did as I love him. His companion passed 24 hours after the trip and had a hard time the whole time - sad) 1 down. They are F1 Eretmodus Cyanostictus congo orange, well he is. I plan on getting a replacement partner down the road. I hope. She was much smaller and just had a rough time at it.

The Julis are Julidochromis Marlieri - unknown collection point already paired up. He hides on her and she bites him alot. Most of the time he likes it and goes nuts doing his mating dance which is really crazy to watch him shake. The rest of time he hides and she hunts him down. She's bigger, so she's bossy.

Therefore, I took down the huge rock pile I had as it took up almost half the tank and was just nuts for 3 rock dwellers. I now have a thin rock pile on the right side perfect for the 2 julis and the goby and still hiding spots available for others in there. I opened up all the sand. I placed a rock in the center to break a line of sight in the sand. They like those rocks, too and recently placed a crypt in there so hope it stays and does well. The male juli has taking a liking to the plant as soon as I put it in there and rarely leaves it. The goby places everywhere.

The shellies I moved all together at the left end. I bought a bag of shells in the craft section at walmart, ordered some online - which ended up too small, and found a couple around the house. There is a pile about 3 inches deep on the left side for them with a rock wall creating a border and more hiding spots for fish. I have 6 ocellatus gold there. They all stick together, cutely have claimed there own shells, feed together at feeding time, hide from the juli and don't care about anyone else. I placed a plant on their end as well. They stick together and stick to their side unless it's feeding time, then they venture out and swim around and hold their own. Cute little buggers. I now know why people put them in tanks of their own which is a thought I have already. I've already seen some tail wagging in them.

I have 3 Callochromis Stappersii Raspberry Head. 1 male/2 female, which I read elsewhere was best and is working out fine. The male however got popeye soon after being added to the tank. Not sure if stress or injury or what, but he now has a very tiny eye on that side, but is doing fine again. They startled easy when I first got them as I knew they would, and it looked like injury to me. He's beautiful anyway and they get along with all great. I watched the male try to court a female already with his dance and sand digging which was an extremely small area about 2x2 and fun to watch. A female entered, but nothing happened.

I have 5 F1 Xenotilapia Ochrogenys. Can't believe I found some. After reading success stories of keep them with shellies, I went for it. I'm glad I did because they are my favorite.

I have 4 young Enantopius Melanogenys that I couldn't pass up because offered at great price and last minute decision. Only about 5 months old.

The weird thing about all of them is that they all "kiss" sometimes. I have watched the Xenos touch lips with the julis and the Melanos touch lips with the stappersii, etc. Especially at feeding time like they swap gum or give each other high 5s. What is that about. I want them to like each other, but not that much! LOL jk It's cute.

I ordered 14 Cyprichromis Leptosoma Kerenge Island from aquabid. All arrived dead, but 5. 4 barely hanging on and 1 looked like it might make it, but all died within the hour or so. But there were 7 in each bag and it stunk, not much air - it didn't look like - bags leaked all over the newspaper that didn't seem packed tight enough so probably had a rough ride of it, too. That was on the 7th. I was supposed to receive replacements with extras, but haven't seen them yet. Still waiting and hoping that comes through next week. Was told waiting to go to breeders, then sick. It was too hot to ship here this week and I let them know, but didn't hear anything back from that email. Hope something is here by the end of the week next week so I don't have to make a fuss and take action.

That made it 15 down. (14 cyps and 1 goby).

Got new light which really brightens it up and they swim so much more and so much higher now with the new light. Much more active. Just love it. I am enjoying this tank very, very much. Can't wait to get my top swimmers and then it's perfect.

 

[mikem691]

That looks great. I love the way you broke up the territories. Nice and clean.