HELP

[billybow]

Introuble

So here we go, this is my 3rd tank but my 1st Cichlid tank, I set it up and let it run for several days before adding fish, got 2 fish to start with, then added several more after those made it. After my 2nd 15% water change a few days my water starting looking like the pictures below.

So far I have not lost any fish but I cannot get the water to get clear, I have since done 2 more 25% water changes with the same results, it will clear up for like a day then go right back to muddy..

Please help!!!

 

[LyndaB]

How did you cycle this tank?

It's most likely a bacterial bloom, almost all new tanks go through this.

What are your readings?

 

[Pckerfreak44]

+1 for bacteria bloom.

 

[RAH]

+2 for bacteria bloom.

 

[billybow]

Nitrate around 60
Ph 7.8


That is all I have been testing

How can I rid the bloom?

 

[FishyBusiness]

How long has the tank been set up?
What's your ammonia and nitrite levels?
Your nitrates are kinda high IMO
What decor, tank size and filter do you have?

 

[FishyBusiness]

Nitrate around 60
Ph 7.8

That is all I have been testing

How can I rid the bloom?

You shouldn't let nitrates get above 40...

 

[billybow]

been set up about 5 weeks now
46 gallon tank
Aqueon Power Filter QuietFlow 55/75
Deco was some I bought at petsmart (washed good, no soap)
I want to say the ammonia is around 0.2 it is in the safe area
all of my chem strips and test kits said everything was in the safe areas

 

[LyndaB]

How did you cycle this tank?

The test strips are in accurate. You can get an API master kit (liquid), which is reliable and lasts for hundreds of tests, for less than $18 at kensfish.com.

You want to check for ammonia, nitrites, nitrates, pH and, of course, you should know your temp.

You need to do water changes immediately with your nitrates that high. That's dangerous for your fish.

 

[billybow]

I cycle the tank with a gravel syphon and measure the water coming out with my bucket, then add salt, then add API Amazon Extract Cichlid Water Conditioner, proper ph, and mix it in my clean water going back in.

Temp of my tank is 76-78

 

[FishyBusiness]

Bacterial blooms generally go away invites own within a week. Water changes don't do any good clearing up the water but are necessary due to your nitrates. The oxygen levels may drop because your bloom is consuming a lot of it so an air stone or lowering the water level in aquarium should help til it clears. Also, don't over feed and keep up with water changes and rinse your filter media in old tank water, these things in an established aquarium can trigger blooms also.

 

[RAH]

I would do a water change with levels that high to lower that level to a safe zone.

 

[LyndaB]

I cycle the tank with a gravel syphon and measure the water coming out with my bucket, then add salt, then add API Amazon Extract Cichlid Water Conditioner, proper ph, and mix it in my clean water going back in.

Do you understand the nitrogen cycle? When you first start up a tank, you "cycle" it? I don't think we're on the same page here. For example, there is fishless cycling, fish-in cycling, cycling using seeded filter media, etc.

 

[billybow]

okay I got home and here is the exact levels...

I went out and bought the Freshwater Master Test Kit so that I can test everything...

I also bought a UV filter that someone suggested, it is helping some...

Temp: 78
Ammonia, NH4: 8.0
Nitrates, NO3: 0
Nitrates, NO2: 0.25
pH:8.2

What else do I need to do, is my Ammonia high?

 

[Wyomingite]

Are yer fish gasping at the surface? 8.0 ammonia is deadly. It should be 0. Do ya have any Prime? It's not a substitute for cycling, but it converts ammonia to the harmless ammonium ion, relieving the immediate danger from ammonia. If you don't have any Prime, ya need to do a large water change immediately.

From there, there are a coupla options. Since you've already added fish, it's too late to cycle the tank properly. So first, ya can do daily or twice daily water changes to keep the ammonia and nitrite levels down until the tank is cycled. Second, ya can get a commercial nitrifying bacteria supplement and dose the tank accordingly. This will give the bacteria colonies a jump start. At aquarium temps, Nitrosomonas typically split every 12 hrs +/- and Nitrobacter every 16 hrs +/-. Your best bet is a combo of the two: do a 50% water change, then dose the bacteria supplement. Most bacteria supplements call for doses over two or three days, so allow 24 hrs for the bacteria to settle onto a substrate, then do another water change and dose again.

Good luck,

WYite

 

[Beehpee]

I often think when I read replies to questions that most people just immediately jump on tank readings for amm nitrate and nitrite as being the be all and end all of every problem with every tank, whatever the problem be it fish dying, cloudy water, algae, fin rot, bullying, losing fry......I could go on, there seems to be immediately umpteen replies one after another asking what size is the tank and if using strips or API master kit and what are the readings, being a newbie when If I asked a question about a problem I was having and I received such a barrage of replies it would maybe put me on the defensive to the point of probably not being totally truthful, a bit like if I was a smoker who coughed his guts up in the morning when asked how many cigs he smoked in a day would say "oh only about 10 a day but the reality would be nearer 20" when I was asked by post after post what are your readings if it was .05 amm, a bit of nitrite and maybe 40+ nitrate I would probably reply ".025 amm no nitrite and 20 tO 40 nitrate, human nature being what it is means that none of us like to be looked at as being stupid or just simply doing things wrong so it's human nature that were gonna ( what's the opposite of exaggerate?) understate? what our readings are, how many fish we have, how big the actual tank is, ( how many people can say hand on heart when asked how many fish they have in what size tank and how often they feed them will say 10 fish in a squillion gallon tank that they feed every 3rd Saturday in the month when what they really should be saying is 25 fish in a 20 gallon tank that they feed every time the fish look hungry ( which we all know is every time you go anywhere near the tank) I've only been keeping fish for maybe 3 to 4 months, I'm on my 2nd tank due to buying one too small, with current tank ( already too small at 36 us gals) and I've made **** loads of mistakes from overstocking, incompatible fish, wrong food, I could go on and on, but probably nothing that most people haven't done in the early days, so my point in writing this is to say come on peeps let's give the OP some advice not just keep asking for readings time after time, ok strips might not be the best way to take readings but not everyone can afford a master test kit so strips are better than no readings at all surely and it only needs a couple of people to say strips are not the best rather than keep repeating it over and over and better get a liquid test kit, after a few posts it gets to be more of a nag than advice, so.... Back to the OP in my opinion or as I have as a newbie worked out IMO means, 60 nitrate is high, maybe very high but it's only life threatening to the fish if it stays at that high level for a prolonged period, so proper advice as to how to lower the nitrate to more acceptable levels would be far more beneficial than multiple people telling him/her it's too high, I will just finish off my lengthy diatribe by saying I love this forum and value above anything else I've managed to find on the Internet the advice I find on here but in the few months I've been reading stuff on here I've felt sorry for more than one poster on here for asking for advice who to me rather than being given advice has been shot down in flames and made to feel for want of a better expression a bit of a dick head, sorry if I've offended anyone by saying what I think but I say it as I see it and I never think I'm always right.

BP or as I prefer I'm actually Bryan.

 

[Andrew McFadden]

It's the API Amazon Extract Cichlid Water Conditioner that's causing the water to look like that it has tannins in it. Stop using it and get another type of conditioner and see after a few water changes if it goes away.

 

[Convict2161]

I often think when I read replies to questions that most people just immediately jump on tank readings for amm nitrate and nitrite as being the be all and end all of every problem with every tank, whatever the problem be it fish dying, cloudy water, algae, fin rot, bullying, losing fry......I could go on, there seems to be immediately umpteen replies one after another asking what size is the tank and if using strips or API master kit and what are the readings, being a newbie when If I asked a question about a problem I was having and I received such a barrage of replies it would maybe put me on the defensive to the point of probably not being totally truthful, a bit like if I was a smoker who coughed his guts up in the morning when asked how many cigs he smoked in a day would say "oh only about 10 a day but the reality would be nearer 20" when I was asked by post after post what are your readings if it was .05 amm, a bit of nitrite and maybe 40+ nitrate I would probably reply ".025 amm no nitrite and 20 tO 40 nitrate, human nature being what it is means that none of us like to be looked at as being stupid or just simply doing things wrong so it's human nature that were gonna ( what's the opposite of exaggerate?) understate? what our readings are, how many fish we have, how big the actual tank is, ( how many people can say hand on heart when asked how many fish they have in what size tank and how often they feed them will say 10 fish in a squillion gallon tank that they feed every 3rd Saturday in the month when what they really should be saying is 25 fish in a 20 gallon tank that they feed every time the fish look hungry ( which we all know is every time you go anywhere near the tank) I've only been keeping fish for maybe 3 to 4 months, I'm on my 2nd tank due to buying one too small, with current tank ( already too small at 36 us gals) and I've made **** loads of mistakes from overstocking, incompatible fish, wrong food, I could go on and on, but probably nothing that most people haven't done in the early days, so my point in writing this is to say come on peeps let's give the OP some advice not just keep asking for readings time after time, ok strips might not be the best way to take readings but not everyone can afford a master test kit so strips are better than no readings at all surely and it only needs a couple of people to say strips are not the best rather than keep repeating it over and over and better get a liquid test kit, after a few posts it gets to be more of a nag than advice, so.... Back to the OP in my opinion or as I have as a newbie worked out IMO means, 60 nitrate is high, maybe very high but it's only life threatening to the fish if it stays at that high level for a prolonged period, so proper advice as to how to lower the nitrate to more acceptable levels would be far more beneficial than multiple people telling him/her it's too high, I will just finish off my lengthy diatribe by saying I love this forum and value above anything else I've managed to find on the Internet the advice I find on here but in the few months I've been reading stuff on here I've felt sorry for more than one poster on here for asking for advice who to me rather than being given advice has been shot down in flames and made to feel for want of a better expression a bit of a dick head, sorry if I've offended anyone by saying what I think but I say it as I see it and I never think I'm always right.

BP or as I prefer I'm actually Bryan.

Your entitle to your opinion but I don't see the OP being shot down in "flames"

Test strips are very inaccurate and in time due the stripes being exposed to air will render them useless. If you can't get yourself a good full test kit like API (17 bucks) online maybe some should rethink fish keeping.

Your post struck a nerve with me. Your dead wrong, the members posting in this thread most friends, some good friends and all very knowledgable, were offering help and making sure the OP understand what cycling a tank actually meant ONLY after the OP's response about how he cycled it.

Proper advice? The OP was given numerous avenues to check (proper advice)

Also... When a member has a problem with a fish or fishes or a tank. The questions of the norm are always going to be... What size tank? What's your stock? What are your water parameters, and so on an so on...

Questions need to be asked. Very specific questions in order to give the member proper advice which is being given. Without asking the questions that seem to annoy you we as members will be limited with our responses.

I hope you continue to enjoy the site and know that all walks of live are here and we always don't see eye to eye but your lengthy rant just needed a response, and you didn't offer a solution to the OP's problem anyway.

Nobody was bashing the OP. I also say it as I see it and I think your wrong.

Dino



To the OP to lower your levels several water changes will be needed. You can do them back to back if needed. Water changes won't hurt your fish but those levels will. Your using the API freshwater test kit correct? That's a step in the right direction, good for you!

Also what type of filtration are you using and like others asked... A valid questions to figure out what's going on. How did you cycle the tank?

In the meantime water changes will be your best friend and a good water conditioner like Prime will go along way.

You'll get through this just be religious with your water changes and keep testing.

 

[oscarchic11]

it looks like uve been given very solid advise, but just so you will understand what they mean by cycling... cycling a tank is the process of introducing, and allowing to build to a sufficient level, beneficial bacteria (bb) that turn ur fish's waste from the toxic ammonia to the less so but still toxic nitrite and finally from nitrite to nitrate which is safe for fish up to 80 ppm when it becomes hazardous. the levels for these chemicals in the water after a proper cycle and in a well established tank should be ammonia-0 nitrite-0 and nitrate 0-25, 30 @ most is reccomended by most aquarists... i was new a year ago and had never heard of cycling. this is the short, normal people version...

 

[Andy Sager]

okay I got home and here is the exact levels...

I went out and bought the Freshwater Master Test Kit so that I can test everything...

I also bought a UV filter that someone suggested, it is helping some...

Temp: 78
Ammonia, NH4: 8.0
Nitrates, NO3: 0
Nitrates, NO2: 0.25
pH:8.2

What else do I need to do, is my Ammonia high?

Are you sure you are testing Ammonia NH4 and not NH3? NH4 (Ammonium) is usually present when the PH is below 7.0 and is not toxic to the fish. The higher PH suggests NH3 Ammonia which is toxic. There is a difference here as to whether to panic or not panic based on which one you are testing.

To address a number of the posters on this thread, for years, DECADES actually, tanks have been cycled with fish in them so the severity of this situation is not catastrophic and can be managed without panic.
Drastic water changes will do almost as much damage to the fish as the readings will. Daily partial water changes of about 15%-20% of volume will get the tank back into shape much more safely. Use of any chemicals besides dechlorinator or chloramine remover is not advised. The product "Prime" is a good product to use to help keep the ammonia in NH4 form. Adding more oxygen via airstones or live plants will help provide the fish more breathable oxygen should their gills be effected with ammonia burns.

The fastest way to finish cycling your tank, now that the fish are in it, is to add from an established tank, either some filter media or gravel. This will contain the nitrifying bacteria needed to "cycle" the aquarium. At this point, the Nitrites are not toxic (but will climb to toxic levels quickly if left unchecked) and the simple fact that nitrites are present means that the ammonia level is starting to go down even if you do no water changes (which at this point is NOT recommended. Do them!!!)

As for the UV sterilizer, I would not advise using it until you have an established biological filter in your tank and your levels are at 0. Until the nitrifying bacteria get established, it is possible for them to be "floating" in the water and being killed off by the sterilizer. In an established aquarium, blooms like yours usually end in a day or 2. (The chemical you are using might be adding to this bloom so I would stop using it for now.) If you do get some established media, Definitely turn off the UV.

The best thing you can do now is observe your fish. If you see them having problems (after doing daily water changes)and you don't have another tank to put them in, you'd be best to get a bucket of new water and an airstone, using the same PH and Temp of their tank and acclimate the fish into this bucket. This way the fish are in clean water and out of danger. This water will need to be changed every other day and feeding should be extremely cut back or even eliminated to prevent any ammonia creation other than from normal respiration. Once the fish are removed from their tank, you can either let the tank finish cycling ( which it will do faster now with no new ammonia being produced) or do a 90%-100% water change to reduce the ammonia and nitrite levels. If you do the water change, daily ammonia readings will need to be taken once the fish are put back into the tank to prevent the level from getting toxic. Partial water changes will be needed to do this and the results will be a longer cycling period.

To simplify the "cycling" process, when your ammonia and nitrite levels go from 0 to up then back down to 0, there is enough nitrifying bacteria present to handle the bioload in the tank at the time of the second 0 reading. Since you don't have 0 readings and your bioload (fish) hasn't shrunk, when you put the fish back into the tank after doing the 100% water change, you are starting back at the first 0. By letting the tank finish cycling on it's own, you are creating a stronger bacteria bed that can handle your present load. Both ways can be done so the choice is yours.

To address BeehPee's concerns, I have to agree that some of the posts on this thread were not really necessary or of consequence. Tank size and bioload are not really as important at this point as the ammonia and nitrite readings. An overstocked tank will still cycle. It will just take longer. Talk about the overstoking AFTER this situation has resolved. (IMO)

Hope some of this helps...