Log of My Experiment

[GodFan]

That actually sounds like a great idea there, perfect platform for plants! Maybe just rest it on some of those baby food jars to keep it off the substrate, you could pack it with moss or some kind of nutrient nest!

Do they make them that deep?

 

[Brookster123]

Do they make them that deep?

The shampoo holder thing? Oh yah, all shapes and sizes, plastic too!

 

[NDPTAL85]

GodFan,

I have been doing something similar to what you are attempting. I still use my filter though as it provides expanded surface area for nitrifying bacteria.

I have extensively planted my tank to absorb the ammonia and nitrogen produced by the fish. I don't use any special lights, just the standard hood light that came with my 20 gallon aquarium. My tank is what I like to call "double stocked". I have 4 goldfish in a tank that should only have two. Despite that all my plants have reduced the ammonia and nitrogen to undetectable levels.

Here are the plants I use

1. One Lucky Bamboo (Slow growing, mainly for decoration) Make sure leaves are in the air.
2. 3 Micro swords. (moderate growth rates)
3. 5 Unidentified plant that looks like a tree (Moderate growth)
4. 3 Purple plants that are also unidentified and have a very slow growth rate.
5. One slow growing banana plant only recently added and doesn't have leaves currently
Not very helpful huh? Stay tuned.

6. Golden Pothos with only the stems/ roots in the water. This is a fast growing houseplant. Great for absorbing minerals but it hasn't grown much in my tank yet. Needs a few more weeks to start growing faster.

7. Hornwort. This plant alone is probably responsible for the elimination of ammonia and nitrates in my tank. It grows insanely fast and is incredibly easy to propagate (Just cut it in half). In the right conditions it can grow between 1-4 Inches a day. I have 3 bunches of it with at least 4 stalks per bunch. Only been in my tank for 5 days and ammonia and nitrates are gone.

Now for some pics.




I will continue to monitor the water quality and report on how things go. My goal is to reduce water changes to no more than 4 per year.

 

[GodFan]

GodFan,

I have been doing something similar to what you are attempting. I still use my filter though as it provides expanded surface area for nitrifying bacteria.

I have extensively planted my tank to absorb the ammonia and nitrogen produced by the fish. I don't use any special lights, just the standard hood light that came with my 20 gallon aquarium. My tank is what I like to call "double stocked". I have 4 goldfish in a tank that should only have two. Despite that all my plants have reduced the ammonia and nitrogen to undetectable levels.

Here are the plants I use

1. One Lucky Bamboo (Slow growing, mainly for decoration) Make sure leaves are in the air.
2. 3 Micro swords. (moderate growth rates)
3. 5 Unidentified plant that looks like a tree (Moderate growth)
4. 3 Purple plants that are also unidentified and have a very slow growth rate.
5. One slow growing banana plant only recently added and doesn't have leaves currently
Not very helpful huh? Stay tuned.

6. Golden Pothos with only the stems/ roots in the water. This is a fast growing houseplant. Great for absorbing minerals but it hasn't grown much in my tank yet. Needs a few more weeks to start growing faster.

7. Hornwort. This plant alone is probably responsible for the elimination of ammonia and nitrates in my tank. It grows insanely fast and is incredibly easy to propagate (Just cut it in half). In the right conditions it can grow between 1-4 Inches a day. I have 3 bunches of it with at least 4 stalks per bunch. Only been in my tank for 5 days and ammonia and nitrates are gone.

Now for some pics.

I will continue to monitor the water quality and report on how things go. My goal is to reduce water changes to no more than 4 per year.

Very cool. The only problem I see is the goldfish wont be abke to live in that tank very long.
Pothos vine is an excellent nutrient absorber as is hornwort and imo banana plant. I would like to see oics of the "unidentified" plants.
One thing about this theory that I think alot of people miss is that you need multiple species of plants. Different species absorb different nutrients and at different rates.
BTW another cool plant that is a nutrient hog is water wisteria.

 

[GodFan]

Alright hopefully I will be moving the tank windowside today and changing the plant situation! I have bought a giant pothos vine. I will be adding it to the collection soon. I think I am going to go with the hang on back breeder bix as a planter. Probably going with the hydor pico powerhead for circulation. Hage another idea but we will see where it goes.

 

[trickshot3102]

Isn't there a anaerobic bacteria that converts the products of the nitrogen cycle into nitrogen gas? I could be totally wrong, though.

 

[GodFan]

Isn't there a anaerobic bacteria that converts the products of the nitrogen cycle into nitrogen gas? I could be totally wrong, though.

Yes! That is actually part of one of my ideas. Most people (to my knowledge) utilize these bacteria via a deep sand bed. I was thinking if I took say a starbucks cup and filled it halfway with sand and put an airstone just above the sand and had holes in the cup like a sponge filter it would work. I could even grow plants out of it! Just an idea so far but I could see potential! I imagine in a creek aenorbic bacteria do at least some of the denitrifying process.

 

[trickshot3102]

Yes! That is actually part of one of my ideas. Most people (to my knowledge) utilize these bacteria via a deep sand bed. I was thinking if I took say a starbucks cup and filled it halfway with sand and put an airstone just above the sand and had holes in the cup like a sponge filter it would work. I could even grow plants out of it! Just an idea so far but I could see potential! I imagine in a creek aenorbic bacteria do at least some of the denitrifying process.

I really like the cup idea!!! I am a little skeptical as if it would work, but it sounds good to me to me, it sounds like it would work, and defiantly help the denitrification process. If you do this, please keep us informed, I am quite curious

 

[GodFan]

I really like the cup idea!!! I am a little skeptical as if it would work, but it sounds good to me to me, it sounds like it would work, and defiantly help the denitrification process. If you do this, please keep us informed, I am quite curious

Will do! I think it would work. I may use a powerhead instead of an airstone but we will see

If this whole thing works my other tanks will be getting new filtration systems. I like natuaral better and I think this system will work much much better than the current filters I use.

 

[trickshot3102]

Will do! I think it would work. I may use a powerhead instead of an airstone but we will see

If this whole thing works my other tanks will be getting new filtration systems. I like natuaral better and I think this system will work much much better than the current filters I use.

I think that if it works, which it might, it will be a more natural filter for the everyday aquarist. It might actually make water changes a thing of the past! Also, and the best part, it is 100% bio filtration! The only thing is, you would need a filter for mechanical filtration

 

[GodFan]

I think that if it works, which it might, it will be a more natural filter for the everyday aquarist. It might actually make water changes a thing of the past! Also, and the best part, it is 100% bio filtration! The only thing is, you would need a filter for mechanical filtration

Ok this is very very hypothetical and I am telling this on the condition of no judgement because I may be wrong ok. However if I am understanding my research correctly mechanical filtration may ne more or less unnecessary except in especially dirty setups. Reason being is that in pure water waste (fish poop plant detritus etc) dissolves faster. Now you may need mech filtration in a small way that is self cleaning or bio. For example java moss with shrimp. Or just java moss that would hold the stuff till it dissolved.

 

[trickshot3102]

Ok this is very very hypothetical and I am telling this on the condition of no judgement because I may be wrong ok. However if I am understanding my research correctly mechanical filtration may ne more or less unnecessary except in especially dirty setups. Reason being is that in pure water waste (fish poop plant detritus etc) dissolves faster. Now you may need mech filtration in a small way that is self cleaning or bio. For example java moss with shrimp. Or just java moss that would hold the stuff till it dissolved.

I think that using shrimp would be a great alternative for mechanical filtration! If you think about it, ghost shrimp have a VERY low bio load, so you can put a lot in your tank, and still maintain a healthy bio load

 

[Mebbid]

Very cool. The only problem I see is the goldfish wont be abke to live in that tank very long.
Pothos vine is an excellent nutrient absorber as is hornwort and imo banana plant. I would like to see oics of the "unidentified" plants.
One thing about this theory that I think alot of people miss is that you need multiple species of plants. Different species absorb different nutrients and at different rates.
BTW another cool plant that is a nutrient hog is water wisteria.

Water wisteria in my experience is a HEAVY root feeder. For months mine did nothing in my very heavily well lighted tank except look like crap. When I finally added a root tab underneath it the growth EXPLODED. I wouldn't expect it to be a good nitrate sponge. Some other plants that would be great however are Mexican oak leaf and Stargrass. Those are both EXTREMELY quickly growing plants.

Yes! That is actually part of one of my ideas. Most people (to my knowledge) utilize these bacteria via a deep sand bed. I was thinking if I took say a starbucks cup and filled it halfway with sand and put an airstone just above the sand and had holes in the cup like a sponge filter it would work. I could even grow plants out of it! Just an idea so far but I could see potential! I imagine in a creek aenorbic bacteria do at least some of the denitrifying process.

I would be seriously surprised if this worked at all. That particular plan just wouldn't offer enough anaerobic area for the water to get to. Instead of this why not just do a deep sand bed like most others do?

Ok this is very very hypothetical and I am telling this on the condition of no judgement because I may be wrong ok. However if I am understanding my research correctly mechanical filtration may ne more or less unnecessary except in especially dirty setups. Reason being is that in pure water waste (fish poop plant detritus etc) dissolves faster. Now you may need mech filtration in a small way that is self cleaning or bio. For example java moss with shrimp. Or just java moss that would hold the stuff till it dissolved.

Mechanical filtration does more to remove the debris in the water that causes cloudiness. It isn't 100% necessary but it will help clear up water.

I think that using shrimp would be a great alternative for mechanical filtration! If you think about it, ghost shrimp have a VERY low bio load, so you can put a lot in your tank, and still maintain a healthy bio load

No shrimp or snail will eat poo.

 

[Mebbid]

Something I have been looking at is making my own live rock for my upcoming 90g reef tank. You might use something similar in your project tank. It would even help buffer the alkalinity and pH in the water as well as providing a place for anaerobic bacteria to grow.

The mix: I would adjust this recipe so that there isn't soo much crushed coral.

http://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums/f12/your-guide-to-ammonia-toxicity-159994.html

Porousity of the rock:

Aragocrete made Scott's way is Porous - YouTube

 

[trickshot3102]

Water wisteria in my experience is a HEAVY root feeder. For months mine did nothing in my very heavily well lighted tank except look like crap. When I finally added a root tab underneath it the growth EXPLODED. I wouldn't expect it to be a good nitrate sponge. Some other plants that would be great however are Mexican oak leaf and Stargrass. Those are both EXTREMELY quickly growing plants.



I would be seriously surprised if this worked at all. That particular plan just wouldn't offer enough anaerobic area for the water to get to. Instead of this why not just do a deep sand bed like most others do?



Mechanical filtration does more to remove the debris in the water that causes cloudiness. It isn't 100% necessary but it will help clear up water.



No shrimp or snail will eat poo.

About the shrimp, it wouldn't eat poo, but it would eat excess food while not making a huge dent in the bio load

 

[GodFan]

Something I have been looking at is making my own live rock for my upcoming 90g reef tank. You might use something similar in your project tank. It would even help buffer the alkalinity and pH in the water as well as providing a place for anaerobic bacteria to grow.

The mix: I would adjust this recipe so that there isn't soo much crushed coral.

http://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums/f12/your-guide-to-ammonia-toxicity-159994.html

Porousity of the rock:

Aragocrete made Scott's way is Porous - YouTube

I have considered this. My LFS sells dry live rock which is a white pourous rock. I do t want to make the water to high ph for the plants. Or else I would do shellies how would I balance this?

Water wisteria in my experience is a HEAVY root feeder. For months mine did nothing in my very heavily well lighted tank except look like crap. When I finally added a root tab underneath it the growth EXPLODED. I wouldn't expect it to be a good nitrate sponge. Some other plants that would be great however are Mexican oak leaf and Stargrass. Those are both EXTREMELY quickly growing plants.


Water sprite or water wisteria is a nitrate sponge. I cant remember which. I have had it. I think it does root and leaf feeding but you can float it. I works well.




I would be seriously surprised if this worked at all. That particular plan just wouldn't offer enough anaerobic area for the water to get to. Instead of this why not just do a deep sand bed like most others do?



DSB filters are generally slender tubes. I dont know that it would be super effective but it would help in a miniscule amount. However I may just do the DSB and use the cup for planting and sponge filter style filtration.




Mechanical filtration does more to remove the debris in the water that causes cloudiness. It isn't 100% necessary but it will help clear up water.



Again theoretic but those debris should dissolve in a low nitrate envoronment.


No shrimp or snail will eat poo.

Replies above. As far as he shrimp or snail thing you are correct. However the java moss (and other plants) would break down the poo.

 

[Mebbid]

I have considered this. My LFS sells dry live rock which is a white pourous rock. I do t want to make the water to high ph for the plants. Or else I would do shellies how would I balance this?

Replies above. As far as he shrimp or snail thing you are correct. However the java moss (and other plants) would break down the poo.

I wouldn't use true live / dry rock to do this. It will break down faster the lower the ph goes and it will push the ph up to about 8.2 ish. However if you make your own and use a small amount of crushed coral it will limit the amount this happens.

 

[GodFan]

I wouldn't use true live / dry rock to do this. It will break down faster the lower the ph goes and it will push the ph up to about 8.2 ish. However if you make your own and use a small amount of crushed coral it will limit the amount this happens.

Any kind of porous rock would work right?

 

[Mebbid]

Any kind of porous rock would work right?

That's debateable. If its too fine of pores then it will clog and become useless. If its too big of pores then it will let water flow right through.

Seachem de nitrate is nothing but pumice for example.

 

[GodFan]

That's debateable. If its too fine of pores then it will clog and become useless. If its too big of pores then it will let water flow right through.

Seachem de nitrate is nothing but pumice for example.

Ok maybe just a pile of seachem pond matrix... lol Ill figure somethin out.