the oscar debate.

[daveho]

as long as i can remember (which is about a year, short attn span and all that) people have said the you can just squeeze by with a single full grown oscar in a 55g and you can get by with 2 in a 75 if the filtration system is up to it, now however i hear alot of people sayin 90g minimum for a pair. im here to ask why these tank sizes? i have heard that because an oscar can grow over a foot long that they just dont fit in a 55 but fish bend so there isnt alot of merit to that argument. but there is also the argument that people should just give them bigger because its better but thats not always practical. there is also the water quality argument but if the filter system is up to it dose that make it ok?

basicly what im asking is why do YOU make the recomendations you do, is it based in fact if so what are they and if not where did u get the infomation that you pass on to others?
im not advocating bad fish ownership here im acctuly curious. and if your wondering i have a pair of juvies in a 75g

 

[hpiguy]

If you were two feet wide and someone stuck you in a two foot wide room saying "He can turn around" would you be happy?

Same for the fish.

 

[bud29]

I would say you can squeeze one in a 60, but it would be much better to have it in a 75. and in order to have 2 you need a 90. I base this off of research and other people's recommendations. Oscar's are big and incredibly messy.

 

[daveho]

see what i mean there is this automatic agro when it come to this topic.
belive me i have kept adult oscars i know how messy they are but have you? what reasoning do you have to make these recomendations and if u do have evidence id love to look at it.

what im saying is no i wouldnt be happy if a 2ft closet im saying if the water quality is perfect what makes you know that an oscar isnt happy in a 55g or 75g tank?

belive me im all for bigger is better but i belive that at his point people are just regurgitating genneral rules that they hear.

if the filtration system and tank maintanace is up to the job is it an issue??

 

[daveho]

also those that are gonna post "ummm its cause that what they need" thats not an answer proper info with evidence please.
ok better yet lets say you had a 55 with a 55 sump so water quality is not an issue, and you have a pair of female oscars that are fully grown and get along like some girls do what makes everyone know with such conviction that they can not be in a 55 togeather?

 

[bud29]

I did tons of research on keeping oscars and that seemed to be the consensus among sites. Many sites actually say 125 gallons is the minimum for a pair.

For instance, you are put in a small closet to live there for the rest of your life. You are well fed and are healthy while you are in that closet, though. Would you still be happy? No! Even if you are healthy and well-fed you would still want to live in a bigger space than that.

 

[daveho]

im sorry but you cant compair people to fish there are difrent levels of intellegence honestly if you where given the equivilent space that a single oscar gets in a 55 so lets say a 6 foot person gets a box to live in that is 24 foot by 6 foot wide that is the equivelent that is accepted for a single oscar but a person has diffrent needs so it is an irrelevent comparison. besides what some people say on sites is what they have read on another site its not evidence, alot of people used to say that you could not build a bow out of common hard woods, untill everyone started doing it and they are more common place now then the osage or yew bows of yester year the point is that just repeating what you read isnt evidence unless the sourse is reputable.

 

[Convict2161]

Here I'll end it. Oscars are big FACT

They carry a HUGE bio load FACT

If you understand and your all for bigger is better and so on and so on then you've answered your own question FACT

Oscars kept as a pair with thrive, live longer, be able to swim more freely etc etc etc in a 90+ tank FACT

A single Oscar while will fair well in a 55 would thrive much much better in a 75g FACT

What am I basing my responses on? Research and the knowledge of very very knowledgable hobbyist from all over the world. Books and Oscar forums. If that's not enough for then so be it.

 

[Gboy66]

im sorry but you cant compair people to fish there are difrent levels of intellegence honestly if you where given the equivilent space that a single oscar gets in a 55 so lets say a 6 foot person gets a box to live in that is 24 foot by 6 foot wide that is the equivelent that is accepted for a single oscar but a person has diffrent needs so it is an irrelevent comparison. besides what some people say on sites is what they have read on another site its not evidence, alot of people used to say that you could not build a bow out of common hard woods, untill everyone started doing it and they are more common place now then the osage or yew bows of yester year the point is that just repeating what you read isnt evidence unless the sourse is reputable.

This topic is very controversial, so i wouldnt say anyone is close to wrong here. But lets just see. The average 55 gallon tank is 13" right? Now if you have TWO full grown Oscars, lets say 12" a piece, thats no room at all! If you just think about it, there is literally no space! And thats just assuming the tank has 100% perfect water quality!

 

[HUKIT]

if the filtration system and tank maintanace is up to the job is it an issue??

It's not the width of the tank, it's simply boils down to water quality. Even with daily water changes a full grown 14" oscar will create more waste than is being removed.

Oscars kept as a pair with thrive, live longer, be able to swim more freely etc etc etc in a 90+ tank FACT

I disagree with that statement, again a full size pair in a 90g will have the water quality deteriorate rather quickly. When I kept my breeding pair in a 90g to spawn it required daily water changes of 75% running 2 Fluval 405's to keep up with nitrates around 40ppm...it's a tough road.

Everyone of these arguements is silly when it comes down to discussing tank size, when the real issue is water quality.

 

[Convict2161]

It's not the width of the tank, it's simply boils down to water quality. Even with daily water changes a full grown 14" oscar will create more waste than is being removed.

I disagree with that statement, again a full size pair in a 90g will have the water quality deteriorate rather quickly.

Everyone of these arguements is silly when it comes down to discussing tank size, when the real issue is water quality.

Your correct. I was trying to make the point that bigger is better. I should have stated that a pair would thrive better in a 125+ which is what I meant.

 

[bud29]

One of my relatives has an oscar, I believe in a 55 gallon. She has kept lots of fish and she says oscars are by far the messiest. She says she does tons of water changes and the oscar still manages to foul up the water. She said she isn't going to keep another oscar for a while because it is almost impossible to keep the water clean.

 

[severum mama]

Please keep this discussion on topic. Off topic and/or argumentative posts have been deleted. It's fine to disagree with others but per site rules you must do so respectfully and tactfully. Ad hominem attacks add nothing to the discussion and will result in thread closure.

 

[daveho]

hukit thank you for being the only person to give a serious answer, im not here trying to start arguments i just trying to work out what the real deal is here.
you said you had a pair of 405s on your 90g correct how big where the pair did u find they where cramped? obviously water quality was an issue as u said would a large sump be the way to get past it you think?

 

[Brox]

Considering people overstock tanks a ton. I honestly think it would be fine

 

[daveho]

thats what i thought as well

 

[bud29]

Considering people overstock tanks a ton. I honestly think it would be fine

Just because lots of people do it doesn't necessarily make it right.

 

[Nu-Nu the eel]

Considering people overstock tanks a ton. I honestly think it would be fine

That makes no sence. Just because some people do it (its not done ALL the time) does not make it a good reason to put oscars in tanks too small for then to live a good life.

 

[bud29]

The saying "If your friends jumped off a cliff, would you?" comes to mind....

Considering that hukit had to do daily water changes while running two amazing filters, I think that's a sign that it is a little much. JMO.

 

[Kirky88]

Ok so it has been stated that the real issue comes down to water quality and then someone mentioned a sump. I'm very new to the hobby and im keen to get the answer to this as well..... From my understanding adding a sump although doesn't give extra room it gives you an extra body of water to work with. So if you had a 90 gal tank and a 55 sump would that then give you the water volume of 145 which would exceed the minimum 125 recommended?