(Alot of) Generals questions for my starter tank?

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Alright, attempting to create a list of steps just so I have a relative plan to follow.
Skipping past the points where I purchase the tank and whatnot.
I'd place the tank where I intend and make sure everything is set up. Add the gravel and whatever else is going to be inside of it.
Fill buckets by the gallon and add the cleaning agent, then simply fill the tank with them after letting the buckets sit for several minutes. I'm intending a 35-45-gallon tank, just so I do not have to purchase another one if I get into larger fish later on.
As long as this may take, I can use multiple buckets, I would just like to be precise.
After the tank is filled with clean water, I would begin cycling by adding the approximate amount of ammonia, and simply turn the filter on to start it?
Do you just continually add more ammonia every several days for several weeks to successfully cycle? I'm going to try the fishless cycling technique.
I know I missed something, but I can't remember what exactly.
 
Oh, testing kits, that was it.
What sort do you use? Is there a general cycling kit that measures the levels of ammonia and nitrites/nitrates? I know there's some specific level that each must be at before the tank is actually cycled, but I do not know what it is.

EDIT

So after the water is dechlorinated and is now sitting in the tank, I would add the ammonia.
Apparently the starting equation is 5 drops of ammonia per every 10 gallons of water, effectively putting me at 15-20 drops depending of what size I get. Wait an hour and test, continue this process daily until I get nitrite readings, which will shift the equations to 3 drops for every 10 gallons. Continue this until I receive nitrate readings and perform a 30% water change (also cleaning the water that I put in) to finish cycling completely.
This is what I've gathered from several fishless cycling articles, I highly doubt it is this simple. I also doubt that getting just a small spike in nitrite readings is enough to switch to 3 drops and then to stop completely after I get the first nitrate reading.
What do you guys think?
 
I use the API (a.k.a Aquarium Pharmaceuticals) Master Freshwater Test Kit (be careful, they make a saltwater one too and that wont work at all for a freshwater tank).

It's a liquid titration kit (add tank water to line on vial - add drops - shake - check color) that comes with measures for PH, HighPH, Ammonia, Nitrite, and Nitrate.

The recommended way to start a fishless cycle is like this:

1. Take exactly 1 gallon of water, and treat it like you would for a water change.

2. Add a few drops of ammonia. Stir.

3. Check ammonia levels with test kit.

4. Repeat steps 2 and 3 until the 1 gallon of water gives a reading of 3-5ppm Ammonia.

5. Once your tank water is set up - simply multiply the number of drops it took to take the 1 gallon to 5ppm - and use that many to take the aquarium to 5ppm.

--Remember - when you set up a 45 gallon aquarium - that "45 gallons" is when it's completely empty - your tank will have quite a bit less than 45 gallons of actual water in it once you set up decorations and gravel/sand.--

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

As for testing - here's the general regimen:

(Tank is dosed to 4ppm and filter is started)

(If you have lights for the tank - it's been said that it's better to leave them turned off all day during the cycle)

(If you have a heater, and you can turn it up to 83-85*F, that will accelerate the good bacteria)

1. Test for ammonia only, about once every 2 days.

2. When you notice the ammonia level dropping - do a test for ammonia and nitrite. Also - add enough drops of ammonia to "push it back to 4ppm" - you shouldn't have to test again after, as long as you did the math and added the correct # of drops.

3. Keep doing Step 2 every day, and you'll watch "Nitrites" get extremely high, and then start lowering. Remember to dose ammonia back to 4ppm when you can.

4. When you see "Nitrites" dropping - do tests for Ammo / Nitrite / Nitrate. Eventually you'll see both Ammonia and Nitrite at 0ppm - and Nitrates will be way off the chart.


You'll Know you're cycled when: A full dose of 4ppm of ammonia gets completely changed into "Nitrates" in under 24 hours.

Once that happens - do a huge water change (80% of the tank's water needs dumped) - and you're ready to bring your fish home.

If you finish cycling but won't get fish for awhile: Keep dosing some ammonia every morning to keep those bacteria rolling - and do another huge water change the day before you go get your fish.
 
Just saw your edit above - so here's some clarification:

The reason I explained the "ammonia in 1gallon before your tank" - is because getting to 4ppm of ammonia will take different amounts of fluid depending on the concentration.

i.e. - it will take 5 times more drops of a 10% ammonia solution (most common in grocery stores) - than it would for a 50% ammonia solution (hard stuff).

By using the 1 gallon of water as a "test solution" - you can tally up the number of drops you're going to need - without accidentally overdosing your aquarium. Once you have that "1 gallon takes this many drops" formula, you can do simple multiplication and addition to maintain that quantity as it gets consumed.
 
Vircomore said:
I use the API (a.k.a Aquarium Pharmaceuticals) Master Freshwater Test Kit (be careful, they make a saltwater one too and that wont work at all for a freshwater tank).

It's a liquid titration kit (add tank water to line on vial - add drops - shake - check color) that comes with measures for PH, HighPH, Ammonia, Nitrite, and Nitrate.

The recommended way to start a fishless cycle is like this:

1. Take exactly 1 gallon of water, and treat it like you would for a water change.

2. Add a few drops of ammonia. Stir.

3. Check ammonia levels with test kit.

4. Repeat steps 2 and 3 until the 1 gallon of water gives a reading of 3-5ppm Ammonia.

5. Once your tank water is set up - simply multiply the number of drops it took to take the 1 gallon to 5ppm - and use that many to take the aquarium to 5ppm.

--Remember - when you set up a 45 gallon aquarium - that "45 gallons" is when it's completely empty - your tank will have quite a bit less than 45 gallons of actual water in it once you set up decorations and gravel/sand.--

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

As for testing - here's the general regimen:

(Tank is dosed to 4ppm and filter is started)

(If you have lights for the tank - it's been said that it's better to leave them turned off all day during the cycle)

(If you have a heater, and you can turn it up to 83-85*F, that will accelerate the good bacteria)

1. Test for ammonia only, about once every 2 days.

2. When you notice the ammonia level dropping - do a test for ammonia and nitrite. Also - add enough drops of ammonia to "push it back to 4ppm" - you shouldn't have to test again after, as long as you did the math and added the correct # of drops.

3. Keep doing Step 2 every day, and you'll watch "Nitrites" get extremely high, and then start lowering. Remember to dose ammonia back to 4ppm when you can.

4. When you see "Nitrites" dropping - do tests for Ammo / Nitrite / Nitrate. Eventually you'll see both Ammonia and Nitrite at 0ppm - and Nitrates will be way off the chart.


You'll Know you're cycled when: A full dose of 4ppm of ammonia gets completely changed into "Nitrates" in under 24 hours.

Once that happens - do a huge water change (80% of the tank's water needs dumped) - and you're ready to bring your fish home.

If you finish cycling but won't get fish for awhile: Keep dosing some ammonia every morning to keep those bacteria rolling - and do another huge water change the day before you go get your fish.
Click to expand...

That sounds like a very good plan, I think I can do that. Making a large instructional sheet and I think that will fill in the space for fishless cycling.
Just several questions I need to fill in.
1. Even though it's probably been said to me already, I just wanted to clarify, ALL things that are going in the tank go in during cycling, correct? Things like gravel, plants or rocks. This would technically help the spread of the good bacteria.
2. Only purchase fish after the tank itself is cycled?
3. Enlighten me on pre-main tank quarantine techniques. In my case, would I purchase several guppies and place them in a smaller 5-10 gallon tank first (for what reason, I don't know)? Or would I just buy a few at a time to see how they fair in the tank, then add more until the school is complete?
4. If pre-main tank quarantine is necessary, is a 5-10 gallon tank filled with dechlorinated water (no filters or anything) fine for the guppies for several days until they are deemed okay for the main tank?
5. Once each fish has made its rounds in the quarantine tank and the tank is cycled, is the tank officially set up?
6. When cleaning the filter, you remove it and swish it around water taken from the tank until the gunk is off, then you simply reattach it. Do you just replace the water taken from the tank with more dechlorinated water? It seems like this could also be used as the weekly 10-15% water change, but I won't clean the filter weekly simply to preserve the good bacteria.
 
1. Yes. You should make sure you follow proper procedure for preparing each item before you put it in (i.e. gravel should be rinsed to remove dust, all decorations should be rinsed, plants should be rinsed - and if they're live plants, do an extra close inspection for snail eggs - or you may end up with a bopping population of snails in your tank before you even finish cycling)

-- There are other threads and lots of research out there on how to pre-treat live plants to avoid snails and other baddies from coming in with them. Fake plants just need rinsed. --

2. Yes. Best time to get fish is right after you've done the huge "nitrate-clearing" 80% water change.

3. If this is your first aquarium and your first fish - then there's no need to quarantine. Quarantine comes in when you already have old fish and you want to add additional fish. You quarantine the new fish from the old until you're sure the new fish don't have any illnesses. This keeps the old fish from catching anything.

--If your first fish have anything - well then it's just gonna happen in the main tank anyways. --

4. A quarantine tank can be small... but it will still likely need a heater (and a filter unless you wanna change it's water every 3-4 days)... specifically because most quarantines should last several weeks. Just like they say with human beings - "the flu is most contagious right BEFORE the person feels anything".

-- If you have a good idea of what kind of fish you want as your "final stock" of your tank - you can actually do this:

1. (You've finished your fishless cycle)

2. Dose the tank up to 5ppm (half and half, half the dose in the AM, the other half at night.

3. When the tank can handle 5ppm in 24h, do 6ppm (half-and-half)

This process "buffs up" your cycle, so that you could technically go to the store and buy almost all the fish you want - and load up the tank in 1 day. (Being careful not to overcrowd, of course)
--------------------------------------------------------------------

5. If you do invest in a QT tank, it's best to fishless cycle that tank as well before you buy any fish that need quarantined.

6. Yes. Just sync up your filter change day with a water change day, and when you take out that last bucket of old water, use that to rinse your filter stuff off.

EDIT: You may eventually have to replace pieces of the filter (because everything breaks down) - the key is to replace as little as possible, and stagger the replacement pieces over time. If you're using a small "hang on back" (HOB) filter that uses those little prefabricated "cartridges" - when you replace the cartridge, try and leave the old cartridge inside the filter "behind" (water flow) the new one - so that the water transfers at least some bacteria to the new cartridge.
 
This is great, thank you.
I'm making instructions specific for my tank, attempting to cover the entire process from beginning to end.
I'm aiming for a 40 gallon tank or something close, with a single school of 5-8 guppiess.
I will post what I have so far, hoping to have you guys critique it after I am done.
 
Sounds excellent. First thing that came to mind when you said "40 gallons" and "school of guppies" is that - if you keep your aquarium in good condition - you may find yourself with a whole lot more than 5-8 guppies after awhile.

if you know what I mean.

*wink wink* *nudge nudge*

;)
 
1. Check out Aquarium Solutions (store I am purchasing from). Their selection, equipment, availability, quality of tanks and employee knowledge. Bring equipment list and write in price ranges for all items.
2. Purchase the tank along with whatever equipment and hardware you need.
3. Set up the tank area, including gravel and ANYTHING else going inside the tank after rinsing it off.
4. Fill a bucket will one gallon of water, dechlorinize it.
5. Add the approximate number of ammonia drops necessary for 1 gallon of water. This will vary depending on the concentration of ammonia in the agent you are using.
6. Stir.
7. Check the ammonia level for the bucket of water.
8. Repeat steps 5,6 and 7 until the single gallon reads 3-5ppm ammonia
9. Dechlorinize more water and fill the tank with it. Record how many gallons are used.
10. Multiply the number of drops it took to take 1 gallon of water to 5ppm, use this to take the entire aquarium to 5ppm.
I am going to assume that step 11 would be to activate the filter and place the approximate number of ammonia drops needed for the whole tank in. I would also turn off whatever lights that were attached to the aquarium and bump the heater up. Would I let this ammonia sit in the tank for about an hour and then test? Would the process than follow suit as the same number of drops every day, but testing for ammonia every 2 days until the ammonia level starts dropping?
 
The first 10 look good.

As for the ammonia dosing - once you add the "drops for 5ppm in the aquarium" - yea, you can wait an hour and test to make sure you got it right.

After that - you shouldn't need to add any more ammonia for awhile - just keep testing ammonia every 2 days.

Once you start seeing ammonia drop - you do 2 steps every 2 days:

1. Add "Nitrate" to the tests you do.

2. "Dose up" the tank. Basically, you want to try and "recover the difference" - so if the Ammonia test reads 3ppm instead of 5ppm - you only wanna add "2ppm dose" instead of the full 5ppm.
------------------------------------------------------------------
2 days later - Next Ammonia test might read "2ppm" - you add "3ppm" of drops.

2 days later - Next ammonia test might read "1ppm" - you add "4ppm" of drops.

Sign #1 of cycle finishing: Ammonia test reads 0ppm. You dose full 5ppm of drops. Test again same time tomorrow. Ammonia completely gone - 0ppm.
------------------------------------------------------------------

Once you start seeing "Nitrite" begin to lower - you start doing 3 steps every 2 days:

1. Test Ammonia and Nitrite
2. Test Nitrate
3. "Dose up" Ammonia - (same way as above)

Sign #2 of cycle finishing: Ammonia test reads 0ppm. You dose full 5ppm of drops. Test again same time tomorrow. Ammonia at 0ppm, Nitrite at 0ppm, Nitrates high.


Here's the best visual example I can give of how this "cycle" works:

* Imagine there is a conveyor belt, that is moving super-slow, but it is moving.

* This conveyor belt is powered by having boxes on it.

* You put 5 boxes on the front end of the conveyor. (5ppm ammonia)

* As the conveyor gains power from the boxes, it starts speeding up and moving them to the other end. (Ammonia --> Nitrite)

* In order to keep the conveyor belt speeding up - you have to keep adding boxes onto the front end, so that there are always 5 boxes on the belt. ("Dosing up")

* As the boxes reach the end of the conveyor, they fall off and pile up. (Nitrate)

* Your "conveyor belt" is "cycled" when you can throw a full 5 boxes on the front end, and all 5 fall off the other end in less than 24 hours.

* Before you add your "box-droppers" (fish) - you have to sweep up all the boxes that fell off the end. (huge water change)

* Once the "box-droppers" are in place, your job is just to sweep up the boxes off the floor every so often (regular water changes).
 
Getting all of this down in instructions, however, one thing caught my eye.
Would you add nitrite instead of nitrate with the ammonia tests first, or just do a one-time-only test of nitrites after sign 1 of the cycle finishing.
"1. Add "Nitrate" to the tests you do."
"Once you start seeing "Nitrite" begin to lower - you start doing 3 steps every 2 days:
1. Test Ammonia and Nitrite
2. Test Nitrate
3. "Dose up" Ammonia - (same way as above)"
 
Alright, here's a continuation of the steps, sorry for the delay.
Step 20 would be placing the guppies in the tank, if I've done all the other steps correctly. Again, please critique. I think running the aquarium for a single day would be necessary simply to check for any flaws, or is it dangerous for the process?
11. Introduce calculated amount of ammonia to the tank.
12. Take an ammonia reading one hour later.
13. Take readings for ammonia once every two days, record the ppm.
14. Once the ammonia levels begin to drop, add nitrate to the testings and ‘dose up’ the tanks on the same every two day schedule. Essentially, if the readings come to 3ppm, make up the difference by adding 2ppm of ammonia to get back to the 5ppm. Again, dosage will vary with concentration.
15. When an ammonia test reads 0ppm, dose a full 5ppm. Test again at the same time the next day. If there is a reading of 0ppm again then advance to step 16.
16. Every 2 days, Test ammonia, nitrite and nitrate. Also, dose up ammonia with the same method used in step 14.
17. When another ammonia test reads 0ppm, dose a full 5ppm. Test again at the same time the next day. If there is a reading of 0ppm then cycling is done.
18. Perform an 80% water change.
19. Run the aquarium for one day.
 
Yes, I think.

When you're just starting, there's only going to be ammonia in the tank - so you only do ammonia tests every 2 days.

When the ammonia tests start showing a drop - NitrItes are being formed - so you do ammonia and nitrite every 2 days.

When the NitrIte test starts to drop - NitrAtes are being formed - so that's when you start doing all 3 tests each day.

All 3 tests (in the API liquid test kit) are separate. Here's how each test works:

Ammonia:
1. Fill a vial to the white line with tank water.
2. Add 8 drops from "Ammonia test bottle 1"
3. Add 8 drops from "Ammonia test bottle 2"
4. Cap vial.
5. Shake 5 seconds.
6. Wait 5 minutes - compare final color.

Nitrite:
1. Fill a vial to the white line with tank water.
2. Add 5 drops from "Nitrite test bottle 1"
4. Cap vial.
5. Shake 5 seconds.
6. Wait 5 minutes - compare final color.

NitrAte:
1. Fill a vial to the white line with tank water.
2. Add 10 drops from "Nitrate test bottle 1" (Be careful, this stuff smells like skunk spray, and will ruin your belongings like skunk spray too).
3. Cap vial
4. Shake 5 seconds.
5. Shake "Nitrate test bottle 2" for 30 seconds.
6. Add 10 drops of "Nitrate test bottle 2".
7. Cap vial.
8. Shake 60 seconds.
9. Wait 5 minutes - compare final color.
 
All those steps look good, except for #19.

If you leave your aquarium run for any length of time without adding more ammonia (either from the new fish, or more from your bottle) - the bacteria will start to starve and your "conveyor" will start to slow down. This can be bad for the fish because there will be more of a "jolt" as the cycle tries to pick up speed with the fish's output.

Ideally you want to add your new fish immediately after you do your 80% water change.

If you can't -- then keep dosing your 5ppm ammonia each day - and do another 80% water change right before you go to buy your fish.
 
Alright, thanks. Edited that and added your note.
Here is the complete list of instructions for my tank, along with the list of items I need. Again, take a stab at anything that looks out of place. I figure I will get a quarantine tank just to have around incase anything occurs. The question marks show that the selection may vary on availibility of the item. People keep mentioning conditioners for water, I don't know what they are. I figured dechlorinzer is good enough. . . ?

Guppies, school of 5-8 ?
35-45 gallon tank ?
5-10 gallon quarantine tank
Heater/Chiller (Hydor Theo heater) ?
Plant, foilage
LED for plant life (unless you incorporate a fake plant)
Gravel
Proper stock for feeding fish
Reliable power strip
API Master FRESHWATER Test Kit
Ammonia 50% concentrate
Dechlorinator agent
Whole aquarium is not 45 gallons with gravel and whatnot included


1. Check out Aquarium Solutions. Their selection, equipment, availability, quality of tanks and employee knowledge. Bring equipment list and write in price ranges for all items.
2. Purchase the tank along with whatever equipment and hardware you need.
3. Set up the tank area, including gravel and ANYTHING else going inside the tank after rinsing it off.
4. Fill a bucket will one gallon of water, dechlorinize it.
5. Add the approximate number of ammonia drops necessary for 1 gallon of water. This will vary depending on the concentration of ammonia in the agent you are using.
6. Stir.
7. Check the ammonia level for the bucket of water.
8. Repeat steps 5,6 and 7 until the single gallon reads 3-5ppm ammonia
9. Dechlorinize more water and fill the tank with it. Record how many gallons are used.
10. Multiply the number of drops it took to take 1 gallon of water to 5ppm, use this to take the entire aquarium to 5ppm.
11. Introduce calculated amount of ammonia to the tank.
12. Take an ammonia reading one hour later.
13. Take readings for ammonia once every two days, record the ppm.
14. Once the ammonia levels begin to drop, add nitrate to the testings and ‘dose up’ the tanks on the same every two day schedule. Essentially, if the readings come to 3ppm, make up the difference by adding 2ppm of ammonia to get back to the 5ppm. Again, dosage will vary with concentration.
15. When an ammonia test reads 0ppm, dose a full 5ppm. Test again at the same time the next day. If there is a reading of 0ppm again then advance to step 16.
16. Every 2 days, Test ammonia, nitrite and nitrate. Also, dose up ammonia with the same method used in step 14.
17. When another ammonia test reads 0ppm, dose a full 5ppm. Test again at the same time the next day. If there is a reading of 0ppm then cycling is done.
18. Perform an 80% water change with dechlorinated water.
19. Set the filter and heating to their appropriate levels before adding fish.
If you leave your aquarium run for any length of time without adding more ammonia (either from the new fish, or more from your bottle) - the bacteria will start to starve and your "conveyor" will start to slow down. This can be bad for the fish because there will be more of a "jolt" as the cycle tries to pick up speed with the fish's output.
Ideally you want to add your new fish immediately after you do your 80% water change.
If you can't -- then keep dosing your 5ppm ammonia each day - and do another 80% water change right before you go to buy your fish.
20. Introduce fish to tank and let adjust.
 
Looking good. Just a few closing points:

* I highly doubt that you're going to find Ammonia being sold at 50% concentration. The most common household ammonia that is sold in grocery stores is between 5% and 15%. Even still, at 10% concentration, it only took me about 40 drops to reach the 5ppm measure for my tank (26 gallons).

* When you're buying ammonia, check for two things (very important):

1. Perfumes. The ammonia should NOT be specially scented in any way (lemon, etc.)

2. Soaps. Some companies mix other cleaning agents in with their ammonia - you DONT want that. Fastest way to tell if your ammonia is pure - take it off the shelf and give it a good shake. If it makes foam inside the bottle - it's BAD. It should make a few big bubbles but then flatten out.

* General rule of thumb for buying a heater for an aquarium:

50 watts : 10 gallons.

So for a 45 gallon tank (about 38-40 actual water gallons) - you will probably want either:

1. One 200w heater, centrally located or put near the intake pipe of your filter.

2. Two 100w heaters, put at opposite ends of the tank.
 
I think you're right, seems like that kind of thing would be watered down. The soap issue I knew about, but not the scent thing, thanks.
I think I'll go with a single 200 watt heater, but I remembered something from my original list of questions. The room where the tank will be kept gets hotter than any other room and summer, and colder than any other room in winter. I'm pretty sure a heater is the better choice over a chiller, being as how I can always put a fan over the tank. What average setting should I be looking at for the guppies? Or do you only use heaters when necessary and it remains off at all other times?
Do filters generally run or are there power settings to them?
 
Edit: Your answers.

1. Most tropicals like their water in the 76 - 79*F range. (Speaking of that - an aquarium thermometer is another good investment to have. Even if it's just one of those black stick-on ones.)

2. Most modern aquarium heaters have thermostats built into them - so they automatically turn themselves on and off to keep the tank temperature at whatever you set it to.

3. You should only think about an actual aquarium chiller if the room in question gets extremely hot (88*F+) - usually a few good fans will get the job done to keep the tank cool. The trade-off there is that you should expect your aquarium to evaporate more than usual, which means you'll have to do "water additions" more often to keep it topped off.

4. Most all aquarium filters are on-or-off systems. Therefore, the general rule for buying an aquarium filter is to look at the boxes where they say "this filter rated for up to XX gallons" - and then go with the filter that is 1 step up from the minimum for your tank. Extra filtration on a tank = comfier fish or = more fish you can keep.
 
Sorry about that post- i was trying to draw something and failed miserably. The answers you seek are posted in the edit.
 
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