Noob - questions - hard water, alkaline

[grahamo83]

Hi All,

For the last couple of weeks I've been obsessively reading this great forum (and other materials) about setting up a tropical freshwater aquarium and I am excited to get going for real. I just want to have some questions answered definitively (mostly so I can get some sleep).

I'm about the acquire this tank EVO - 135litres equates to roughly 35 of your US gallons. I already think this is too small but I have little space to increase.I want everything and know that I can barely have anything.

Anyway... I popped to the local generic pet store and picked up a test kit - Tetra 6 in 1 Tests £10.99 - Buy Test kits Accessories . It's not the most accurate piece of technology but it seems to suggest that my PH is between 8.0 and 8.4, my gH around 16oD and kH that doesn't even register on the scale (it's purple - I assume that means it's very high).

1. how much should I take from a cheap test kit like this using water straight from the tap?
I've read that the hardness drops after cycling, if it does - is the amount significant?

2. I know that the wrong pH and hardness is detrimental to the health of the fish, but am I significantly shortening its life /happiness by keeping it at undesired levels (e.g. a quite hardy fish with suggested conditions are 7-7.5ph (I will avoid fish that are softwater-acidic)).

3. Is it worth getting an RO unit to compensate for the hardness - £60-£70 ($100ish) would be acceptable at the moment..Is there anything suitable?

4. What fish do you recommend for my tank with these conditions? I seem to change my mind about what I want every other day - In an ideal world I would like some dwarf ciclids (apistogramma, kribs, rams) or something as a centrepice with some tetra, I also like gourami (i'll finish there before I get carried away). I know my suggestions are not sensible but some suggestions would go a long way.

Thanks for all your help
Graham

 

[The_Desacrator]

Hi All,

For the last couple of weeks I've been obsessively reading this great forum (and other materials) about setting up a tropical freshwater aquarium and I am excited to get going for real. I just want to have some questions answered definitively (mostly so I can get some sleep).

I'm about the acquire this tank EVO - 135litres equates to roughly 35 of your US gallons. I already think this is too small but I have little space to increase.I want everything and know that I can barely have anything.

Anyway... I popped to the local generic pet store and picked up a test kit - Tetra 6 in 1 Tests £10.99 - Buy Test kits Accessories . It's not the most accurate piece of technology but it seems to suggest that my PH is between 8.0 and 8.4, my gH around 16oD and kH that doesn't even register on the scale (it's purple - I assume that means it's very high).

1. how much should I take from a cheap test kit like this using water straight from the tap?
I've read that the hardness drops after cycling, if it does - is the amount significant?

1. You should condition your water before doing any of these tests. The store should have something called water conditioner by various brands. They all do the same.

2. I know that the wrong pH and hardness is detrimental to the health of the fish, but am I significantly shortening its life /happiness by keeping it at undesired levels (e.g. a quite hardy fish with suggested conditions are 7-7.5ph (I will avoid fish that are softwater-acidic)).

2. There is a Ph lower/softener you can buy to drop the Ph down

3. Is it worth getting an RO unit to compensate for the hardness - £60-£70 ($100ish) would be acceptable at the moment..Is there anything suitable?

3. I don't know how this would help/what it would do. And you can lower the hardness in other ways.

4. What fish do you recommend for my tank with these conditions? I seem to change my mind about what I want every other day - In an ideal world I would like some dwarf ciclids (apistogramma, kribs, rams) or something as a centrepice with some tetra, I also like gourami (i'll finish there before I get carried away). I know my suggestions are not sensible but some suggestions would go a long way.

4. Assuming you get your tank cycled and conditioned and the ph balanced, you could get almost anything. Be careful with angelfish as thy can be picky on who they are with, even with fish of the same temperament

Thanks for all your help
Graham

Welcome to the forums.

 

[Crepe]

First I would suggest getting a Liquid reagent test kit, either LaMotte or API, with API being cheaper and already sufficient for the job. Also you need to let any water out of the faucet sit for awhile before you test it. kH is carbonate hardness, meaning that it measures both calcium carbonate and CO3ions from a CO2 + H2O reaction. Thus, allowing it to out gas will give you a more accurate kH measurement. (I have a 13dKH and I'm still doing fine)

There are RO units available for about 130USD, 109Euros and would be a good investment if you felt that your water is just not good enough for your fish or if you feel you may go into SW some time in the future.
If you think your water is bad; mine reads 1ppm ammonia, 8.2ph, and ridiculously high gH right out of the faucet.
I would NOT use any chemicals to affect pH. They require a lot of accurate measuring (I use graduated cylinders and pipettes to do all my dosing [I never use pH buffers though]) and when you get it wrong it can seriously stress your fish.
If you must, you could prefilter all your water through peat moss OUTSIDE of the tank and then add it, making sure to measure the pH of the new water each time you do so.

In the end your water sounds fine as is, especially for Kirbensis Cichlids, they have a higher tolerance for hard water.

In a 35 gal, a pair of kribs and a school of Congo Tetras would work for a Continental Africa theme.

My ph is about 7.8-8, gH (insanely high, about 320? I stopped caring about gH really.), dKH is 13 and I keep otocinclus and neon tetras without any problems. Both are south american river fish. I've kept other odd species like Red Tailed Catfish as well without incident in the past in these water conditions.

 

[The_Desacrator]

What did you do with the catfish? those guys get big!

 

[Crepe]

Kept him in the pond for a spring/summer and then took him back to the LFS, that is, when he got too big.

 

[grahamo83]

Thanks for your info. Feel abit more optimistic about it all now.

from what i've read - pH stability seems to be the key - the pH is not so important - and a high kH is related to a stable pH. This means the fish face less stress.

I will get an API testing kit for more accurate results - I should have got it instead of the test kit I did buy, but thought the added cost was probably unjustified

For clarification - I did leave the faucet (tap) open for a couple of minutes before taking a sample and I tried it with and without water conditioner to see what the difference was (there was little choosing on pH and hardness indicator as far as I could see). I also left it overnight - pH and kH seem a little lower today.

I will resist buying a RO unit if I can - I would like it if I did not get carried away with throwing money at problems that are not really there. Regarding RO units, are there (decent) versions which don't require being hooked up to the mains water supply? I don't want to be making big alteration to my rented appartment that could jeapordise my contract.

...I like the Congo tetras.

 

[Crepe]

My RO unit just fits under the sink and it bypasses the pipe the runs into the faucet, from there I have another spigot that lets out RO water. I have however since uninstalled it because I didn't have a need for it after we moved and got rid of the SW tank.

 

[Sum22]

Unless you are trying to breed the fish, hardness and pH will not matter that much. I've kept glass catfish for years in 8+ pH and off the charts hardness. They like soft water and a neutral pH. Still, the first batch lived for 6 years.