can't even get anachris to grow!!!

[hbeth82]

I have a 55gal tank that, though not intended to be a planted tank, has a bunch of plants in it with hopes of the little fishies feeling secure. In addition to the anachris I also have amazon swords, anubias nana, ambulia, a few bunches of dwarf chain sword, pennywort, and hygro (mostly thanks to kaiofcanada). However, I'm having trouble getting a weed like anachris to grow. The stems typically break apart, usually just above the gravel, then float at the top, same thing with the pennywort and hygro. When the anachris does grow, it's rather thin and scraggly. I've wondered if part of the problem might be my corries digging in the area or else my mondo-mystery snail climbing on the stem plants, weakening them. Also the center leaves of the amazon sword are sometimes turning yellow (no root tabs). Only thing that seems to be doing well is the anubias.

I don't add salt to the water, temp is about 77-79, 0 ammonia & nitrite, nitrate < 10. I know the lighting is very weak, 2x15W fluorescent bulbs, but had much better luck than this in my 20gal tank with only 1 15W bulb - have lower Wpg now but still surprised. I also add Flourish to the tank, about 1 capful with every change.

So, thoughts? Things seemed to do a bit better when the nitrate levels were higher but I think that may have been what killed one of my rams, so I need something else. Does the tank just have insufficient lighting or should I be adding something else?

Thanks!

 

[mfdrookie516]

15w of light in a 20g tank is way more than 30w in a 55g. When stems break off like that, its usually a sign of too little light. You might try a shop light over your 55g, that would help alot, and get you up above the 1wpg mark, even thought that really means nothing

 

[OhNo5000Bees!]

Agree with the lighting because of the general plant problems you described. But if the Flourish you are adding is Excel it is well known to melt anachris. I don't have a speck of the Egeria Densa left in my tank after dosing with Excel.

 

[hbeth82]

Yeah, kinda figured it was the lighting, since it's barely more than .5W/pg. I avoided the Flourish with Excel for just that reason (whole reason I started the 20gal was to grow anachris for my turtle, then the addiction began). I'll start looking into getting shop lights, though may try to persuade my boyfriend to let me use his lighting, about 2WPG and most of what's growing in his 50gal is java fern & algae. For shop lights, just the 4' ones sold at Home Depot?

Thanks!

 

[BigJim]

+2 on the better lighting. I think I'd look at a basic T5 shoplight. A 55g is rather deep, which limits the light penetration more than you'd think. I had trouble with my myrio losing all its needles that were more than 6" down in my 29g. Switching to bigger CFL bulbs cured the problem.

 

[hbeth82]

Awesome, thanks. The hoods I have now are the more traditional (I think, at least), the front half is a black lid that lifts up and the back-half is the framed plastic/glass section. Would these hoods work or would I need to get the plain glass? Also, this may sound really vain but is there any reason that I couldn't spray-paint the shop light fixture, as long as I let it dry/cure for several days before use?

Thanks!

 

[mfdrookie516]

i would leave the hoods off. i dont run one on any of my tanks. and yes, you could paint the shop light. i got mine at walmart for $8 and spent another $8 on phillips daylight bulbs. the plants in my 10g's took off big time

 

[Sonomakid]

http://www.fishneedit.com/t5ho-4ft--2lamp-aquarium-light.html great light and pretty cheap have 1 myself on my 55g

 

[hbeth82]

i would leave the hoods off. i dont run one on any of my tanks.

You mean you don't have any hoods on the tanks? Will definitely be checking out WalMart though, didn't think about them carrying something like that. TGI-tax return time!!!

If I just went with the plain 4', T8 shop lights, with 2x32W bulbs, would that be enough or should I try for 2Wpg?

Thanks!

 

[mfdrookie516]

well its personal opinion. with the shop light, you should be able to support anachris, but the light from where sonoma listed would be better. and no, i dont have a lid, hood, canopy, glass top, anything on any of my tanks

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

This is the biggest help I found in figuring out lighting requirements:

http://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums/f24/survey-for-updating-the-wpg-rule-theory-70271.html

http://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums/f24/updating-the-wpg-rule-theory-69964.html

The second one, first post is all you really need to know. My tank:

Which has been running for about a year, most of that using a T8 striplight I got at Menards (I got custom glass cut for the tops at True Value for $16, sanded the edges and good to go) and originally used some cheap home depot bulbs that were the wrong spectrum and burned the plants. I got Zoo Med Max Plant Growth bulbs (32W each, I think) and I fert with Excel 5 ml daily + 30 ml after large PWC, Comp 2x 5ml weekly, K 2x 10ml weekly and my plants absolutely exploded.

As for the WPG, 64W of T8 = 100 W effective, or just under 2 WPG.

If you're running 30W of T12, you're 0.5 WPG. If they're T8s, 0.85 WPG. Either way you cut it, it's too low. I did the exact same thing you did when I set up this tank 1/1/9, and my plants all withered away too.

 

[DragonFish71]

Not to hog the thread but I want to understand this too


See I don't get that WPG thing.

I hear 2 WPG so I think 80g Xs 2+ 160w. I think my fish would get sunburned right? On our 80 I have 2 CF 6700k 55w bulbs and the plants are doing fantastic. No algae growth, our tiger lotus has leaves larger than my hands.

On our 10g I have 2 screw in CF 6500k 15w which equals 60w incandescent and again excellent growth.

I'm slowly trying to get the right lighting on our other tanks and I'm not sure where to go.

So seriously, how does the WPG add up?

As for the anachris, I only ever had good luck when I let it float

 

[mfdrookie516]

here is my anachris in my 10g tank, along with some other plants (guppy grass, hm, and a few others i forgot the names of, needless to say about 3/4 needs to be tossed out to look decent) but all i had was a 15w light over them for a while. upgraded to a shop light over both 10g's and they took off big time (please excuse the algae scraper on the sand... my wife was "playing" with it and it fell off lol)

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

Not to hog the thread but I want to understand this too


See I don't get that WPG thing.

I hear 2 WPG so I think 80g Xs 2+ 160w. I think my fish would get sunburned right? On our 80 I have 2 CF 6700k 55w bulbs and the plants are doing fantastic. No algae growth, our tiger lotus has leaves larger than my hands.

On our 10g I have 2 screw in CF 6500k 15w which equals 60w incandescent and again excellent growth.

I'm slowly trying to get the right lighting on our other tanks and I'm not sure where to go.

So seriously, how does the WPG add up?

As for the anachris, I only ever had good luck when I let it float

If you read through both of those threads, you'll have a migrane, but it would be clearer. Here's the important point:

1 W CF bulb = 1.75W towards the WPG rule
1 W T8 bulb = 1.58W towards the WPG rule
1 W T12 bulb = 1W towards the WPG rule

So if you are running 2x 55w CF, then you have 110 x 1.75 = 192.75 W. In your 80g tank, you effectively have 2.4 WPG. However, the standard for this calculation is the 55g tank. Depth is the only real factor. If your tank is deeper than 18", then you lose a little effectiveness in the light. Either way, you're well over 2 WPG.

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

On our 10g I have 2 screw in CF 6500k 15w which equals 60w incandescent and again excellent growth.

On this one, 15W CF x 1.75 = 26.25, but a 10g is significantly shallower, so you could maybe multiply this by 1.5 or even 2.0, to 40 or 50 W total, so you're probably somewhere between 3 and 4.5 WPG in the 10.

 

[DragonFish71]

Ok, got the migraine

So on our 55g, I have the same type of light strip as the 80g, they're both 48 inches long. I was going to get the same 6700k bulbs but at 45w, the thought being 55w is way too much for the 55g because of the depth difference. Mind you, I'm going with easy plants: more jungle val, anubias, javas, and swords. Am I on the right track?

 

[DragonFish71]

Err make that 6500k. Not sure where I got 6700 from

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

Well, 2.4 WPG is based on a 55, so no, I'd say that's not too much. On the first post of the second link (not the 'survey') there's this link

New Lights?

This breaks it down into lumens/sq in and the corresponding light level.

 

[hbeth82]

Wow, missed checking my email 12 or so hours and most of my questions have been asked & answered for me! Thanks everybody, will be taking a field trips to Home Depot & Walmart this weekend (the formula for converting T8W to T12W helped a lot). Would the fluorescent 'Plant & Aquarium' bulbs be okay? Also, should I start working on a CO2 set-up (getting Sprite in 2liter bottles instead of cans)?

no, i dont have a lid, hood, canopy, glass top, anything on any of my tanks

So is it just paranoid then to worry about inhabitants escaping or other stuff falling in? Does your light take up most of the top of the tank? Guess if the shop light is more than 4-5" wide, a regular hood would just a pain cuz you probably couldn't open it. . . Also, you may call the 10gal tank a mess with plants but sure my fish would love a jungle!

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

IMO, you want to use bulbs made specifically for an aquarium. I tried T12s from Menards that were full spectrum tri-chromatic and listed for plants and aquariums, I tried Home Depot Natural Daylight T8s, etc. They're just not the right wavelength mix for aquarium plants. Zoo Med Max Plant Growth was my final choice, and my only one from now on.