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Old 10-21-2003, 03:06 AM   #1
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New tank, deciding on inhabitants, please comment

My 37 gal FOWLR tank has finally cycled, and I'm ready to add fish.

Here is what I am thinking about:

1 false percula clown
1 longnose hawkfish
1 yellow longnose or auriga butterfly

I'd like to know if

1. These fish will get along with each other, and with my hermit crabs.
2. I am overstocking the tank.

Any comments would be appreciated.
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Old 10-21-2003, 03:55 AM   #2
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I would say that you are definetly overstocking the tank and that would cause problems.. As far as compatibility they should all coexist however fish all have their own personallities so caution should always be used with any fish.... I would seriously rethink about the stocking levels of the tank.. Me personally would suggest not getting the Butterfly for sure...


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Old 10-21-2003, 04:06 AM   #3
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i don't know if you completly overstocking the tank. it depends on your filtration and your clean up crew. kind of explain your setup and we can help you a little more. personally i have a 65 g with a purple tang, yellow tang, 2 tomato clowns, goby and a bi colored psuedo. i'm sure almost everyone would tell me i'm overstocked but i've had the tank running for just over a year and a half and so far no major problems.
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Old 10-21-2003, 04:09 AM   #4
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But overstocking also Means that For a Healthy and Happy Fish it needs a Fair amount of room for swimming.. having those tangs in a tank the filtration may be able handle it but so could we if we were locked in a closet and fed.. however would we like it.. No!!! That along with the handling of the wastes in a tank all play a factor on overstocking a tank.. Thats just MHO..


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Old 10-21-2003, 04:20 AM   #5
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understood, but at the same time who is to say what is to small and what is to large. my fish are all entirely healthy and seem happy. i think that any fish is going to feel like it has been jammed in a closet when you compare it to the ocean. however the way i look at it is that most fish have a memory span of just less then a few seconds, so by the time they make a complete circle around the tank they have almost completely forgot where they just came from. so they do it again and again without ever knowing that they where in the same spot twice. thats how i look at it.
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Old 10-21-2003, 04:29 AM   #6
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Well I can say that for memory span my fish sure have alot more than just a sec or 2.. My fish know exactly when I will feed them and show it by all going to the FEEDING spot of the tank and waiting for me.. Yes I feed them at the same times every day.. They also know who I am And If they want Petted.. Yes one of my perculas likes to be petted like a dog he will rise to the top of the tank when I am near it... My fish sleep in the same spot everyday.. So fish do have quite a memory... I am not trying to argue as to what is right and what is wrong as there are many ways of keeping fish.. I have just stated my opinion and that is that its too many fish for such a small tank.. They may all live for a long time and all but are more suceptable to diseases due to stress... I have stated my opinion as I am sure others will too. What you do is solely up to you... I am sure however that most others would feel as though you are overstocking the tank as well... Its all about morality and your best judgement... General Rule of thumb would allow you to have approx 8" of Adult size fish total in your tank not including the tail.. I hope that I did not sound rude and I am not trying to Flame anyone I am just solely stating my personal opinion..

With that said I am outta here,
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Old 10-21-2003, 10:37 AM   #7
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The butterflies get to big for a 37g tank. Consider a dwarf angel instead.
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Old 10-21-2003, 10:48 AM   #8
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I think the butterfly as a juvenile would be ok. Like most of us, you are probobly gonna want another, bigger tank in the future. So if the plan includes and upgrade later, if you got a baby butterfly, I think you would be ok. Otherwise, I agree with reefrunner, try maybe a dwarf angel. Gives great color and doesn't get as big.

(Just don't try shrimp with a hawk )

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Old 10-21-2003, 10:59 AM   #9
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IMO, the long nose is not too bad with decorative shrimp, they will put a hurting on some grass shrimp, but most decorative shrimp get too large for the longnose hawk to eat. Very cool fish, I had one many years ago, I'm planning a larger tank next year and you can bet a longnose and a flame hawk will be on the stocking list
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Old 10-21-2003, 12:51 PM   #10
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Thanks for the comments everyone.

As for my setup, I started with 12 lbs of LR, and added 31 lbs of base rock. Substrate is 40 lbs of aragonite sand. I have a Bak-Pak 2R skimmer, with an Aquaclear 402 and a Maxi-Jet 600 PH on opposite sides of the tank.

I have no plans to get a larger tank in the immediate future, so the 37 gallon tank is it until I get further along the learning curve.

I knew about longnose hawkfish eating shrimp (none planned for my tank), I also read in Fenner's book about an Arc-Eye hawkfish eating 25 hermits in 24 hours. So I just wanted to make sure a longnose hawkfish would generally leave hermit crabs alone.
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Old 10-21-2003, 01:24 PM   #11
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My longnose never bothered anything that was in the tank before it, added after, it was fair game, but I never saw it mess with hermits one way or the other.
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Old 10-21-2003, 02:05 PM   #12
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hey don't worry man i don't think your flaming anyone and i'm not trying to flame anyone either i'm just stating what has worked for me thats all. but as i was reading this i can't help but notice this:
Quote:
My fish know exactly when I will feed them and show it by all going to the FEEDING spot of the tank and waiting for me.. Yes I feed them at the same times every day..My fish sleep in the same spot everyday
isn't that kind of the same thing as those pshycology experiments where you feed the make the dog ring a bell and they get to eat. if you feed your fish the same time every day in the same part of your tank eventually it is not memory it is just action=reaction. kind of like if i don't breath i won't live so without thinking my body has decided to take a breath. now is it really my memory or is it just a reaction?

Quote:
They also know who I am And If they want Petted.. Yes one of my perculas likes to be petted like a dog he will rise to the top of the tank when I am near it.
i have a clownfish in my ten gallon i literally got no more than 3 days ago that comes to the top of the water whenever i'm in the room and lets me pet him too. it is really weird. but i don't think it is memory. i'm sorry i don't mean to flame anyone. i am just pointing out something that has worked for me
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Old 10-21-2003, 02:14 PM   #13
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i cant remember where i read it but there was an article that said fish have a memory of only 3 seconds. Their brain is too small to remember more than that.
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Old 10-22-2003, 01:59 AM   #14
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I guess my tank is too small for the yellow longnose butterfly.

But I am puzzled as to why my tank is too small for the auriga/threadfin butterfly. According to liveaquaria.com, the yellow longnose grows to 9 in, but the auriga only grows to 5 in. That's the same size as a longnose hawkfish. So why is my large enough for one 5 in fish, but not another?

Is this merely an issue of butterflies needing more swimming space, like a tang?
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Old 10-22-2003, 03:59 AM   #15
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u guys are thinking of goldfish... goldfish are not only the dirtiest fish there are but studies somewhere.. proved they are the dumbest too... I mean all these stories of fish pulling at thermometers.. banging heaters against the glass.. splashing around the top of the water to get attention.. U have to give the fish a little more credit than only 3 seconds.. have u guys ever seen a new fish in your tank not be afraid of a net.. then when u either have to take it out.. or accidentally catch it in the net.. ****.. from then on it runs and hides at the sight of a net..

Personally i believe fish can remember stuff for more than 3 seconds.. anyways.. off topic..

I have a 29 gal tank..
w/25 lbs live rock in it..
30 lbs aragonite sugar fine sand
13 red legged hermit crabs..
5 astrea snails (i'll never get anymore cause they commit suicide too much.. hehe... but seriously i find them on their backs at least once every week or so..)
5 cerith snails (best snails i've seen)
2 "false" percula clowns
1 bicolor blenny
1 dwarf flame angel..
2 hawaiian feather dusters
and a CB shrimp..

Filter on it is a refugium i made of a 10 gal tank.. (3 nassurius snails/3 cerith snails... grape caulpera.. 2" sand (w/2 lbs of live sand).. and 3lbs or so of tonga branch..)
also a tronic 100 watt heater .. oh and a cheap little coralife skimmer(need to get a way better one soon...)

I also hooked up a gravity fed auto top off system on the fuge. (under the tank)

The tank has been running for 7 months now.. (just added the dwarf flame a week ago.. and everything seems fine)...

I am soon going to be making this tank a mini reef.. but many of people have told me that i have overstocked my tank and i say.. well it looks good.. fish are healthy.. and all seem happy... and most importantly my water parameters are constant and safe.. w/a water change every 2 weeks

So I say overstocked is when your fish fight too much and are not happy with their surroundings.. there is no general rule of thumb when it comes to fish in the aquarium.. because ideally you'd only want to keep one fish per 60 gals.. but that is not cost effective nor pretty at all..

Just my 2 cents :P
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Old 10-22-2003, 06:15 AM   #16
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Quote:
That's the same size as a longnose hawkfish.
No it's the same length, the body mass is tremendously different. FWIW, I have seen many Auriga Butterflies, larger than 5".

http://www.wetwebmedia.com/auriga.htm
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