Interesting article saying QT not necessary

[sallyjano]

Has anyone seen this article before? Quarantine Causes More Harm than it Prevents

It's interesting. It says that QT as a means of introducing new fish is usually not necessary as it's not the presence of a pathogen that causes disease, it's when the fish are stressed that they become susceptible. He says the display tank will be less stressful than the QT tank so they are better off in the display tank where they won't be as stressed.

Anyone got thoughts on this article? I have a newly set up QT but it's cycled because I had a media on the main tank.

Curious to see what others think.

 

[bribo12]

No offense but that articles stupid. That guy is comparing a stupid idea (bad quarantine) to just basically setting up another display (good quarantine). If I have a tank full of nice fish that have been doing great, I'm not gonna add a fish that is ich prone into the system.
If the quarantine is setup properly then it will save you in the long run. Are there some fish I wouldn't quarantine, yes but for the majority of fishes quarantining isn't gonna hurt anything. The guy who wrote that article basically makes 0 valid points. He is just saying a bad quarantine is gonna do more harm than good and he's right but anyone that is serious about fish will not quarantine like that.

 

[sallyjano]

No offense but that articles stupid. That guy is comparing a stupid idea (bad quarantine) to just basically setting up another display (good quarantine). If I have a tank full of nice fish that have been doing great, I'm not gonna add a fish that is ich prone into the system.
If the quarantine is setup properly then it will save you in the long run. Are there some fish I wouldn't quarantine, yes but for the majority of fishes quarantining isn't gonna hurt anything. The guy who wrote that article basically makes 0 valid points. He is just saying a bad quarantine is gonna do more harm than good and he's right but anyone that is serious about fish will not quarantine like that.

I guess the part I was considering as maybe having a point was that my QT is 10g and I am soon going to buy some fish that can't live in a 10g long term so would it be stressful to be in a 10g QT?

You said you wouldn't QT some fish - which and for what reason?

 

[bribo12]

I guess the part I was considering as maybe having a point was that my QT is 10g and I am soon going to buy some fish that can't live in a 10g long term so would it be stressful to be in a 10g QT?

You said you wouldn't QT some fish - which and for what reason?

You'd be buying the fish small right? In the time you'd be quarantining them they won't outgrow the tank so no I don't think it would be overly stressful.
Well I'm a sw person more than a fresh and fish like mandarins, sand sleeping wrasses, basically fish that would require a specific quarantine setup. For fw I probably wouldn't quarantine scaleless fish like plecos, eels, bichirs. Just due to the fact that they're more sensitive to meds and don't seem to come down with stuff as easily. I suffered big time from not quarantining 2 years ago when a couple tetras brought a fungus that wiped my tank out of everything but an angel and Raphael cat so I just don't agree with not quarantining. It may be less stressful but parasites and fungus aren't always visible. Although you should quarantine all fish if your lfs sucks lol

 

[sallyjano]

You'd be buying the fish small right? In the time you'd be quarantining them they won't outgrow the tank so no I don't think it would be overly stressful.
Well I'm a sw person more than a fresh and fish like mandarins, sand sleeping wrasses, basically fish that would require a specific quarantine setup. For fw I probably wouldn't quarantine scaleless fish like plecos, eels, bichirs. Just due to the fact that they're more sensitive to meds and don't seem to come down with stuff as easily. I suffered big time from not quarantining 2 years ago when a couple tetras brought a fungus that wiped my tank out of everything but an angel and Raphael cat so I just don't agree with not quarantining. It may be less stressful but parasites and fungus aren't always visible. Although you should quarantine all fish if your lfs sucks lol

Ok thanks. That makes sense. Yes the fish I will be buying will need more than a 10g but yes they'll be smaller when I get them.

I see some sites recommend treating for parasites routinely in a QT even if you see no sign of disease. Thoughts? Wouldn't you see a sign of disease during the 3-4 weeks if there was anything going on?

 

[threnjen]

I don't have time to read the article so I'll just share my own quick anecdote,
I had a perfect 90g tank with happy healthy fish. I bought 7 dwarf cories and added directly. Turned out (confirmed later with lfs) the cories had columnaris. It infected my whole tank and I lost 50% of the fish and minimum $200 on meds (big tank) and replacing fish and plants killed by meds.

So really? DON'T quarantine?? I laugh.
A juvenile fish can handle a10g for a few weeks.

Sent from my SGH-M919 using Aquarium Advice mobile app

 

[sallyjano]

I don't have time to read the article so I'll just share my own quick anecdote,
I had a perfect 90g tank with happy healthy fish. I bought 7 dwarf cories and added directly. Turned out (confirmed later with lfs) the cories had columnaris. It infected my whole tank and I lost 50% of the fish and minimum $200 on meds (big tank) and replacing fish and plants killed by meds.

So really? DON'T quarantine?? I laugh.
A juvenile fish can handle a10g for a few weeks.

Sent from my SGH-M919 using Aquarium Advice mobile app

Makes sense. I shall thoroughly ignore this article, other than to take from it that you need a fully cycled QT with good water quality and hiding spots which of course I knew anyway.

Thanks!

 

[ArtistGardener]

Not only will I always quarantine, but I have increased the time from two weeks to four. I lost 8 pristella tetras, a couple of neons and a gorgeous dwarf gourami when I added six harlequin rasboras that had something--never did figure it out (either neon tetra disease or false neon tetra disease--leaning towards that). They all died so quickly that I barely had time to start treating the tank before the devastation was over. The harlequins didn't show any real signs of disease while in QT but they were the first to die in the big tank (at about week three after purchase from one of the big chains--also something I am never doing again!), followed by the others in rapid succession. Can't imagine anyone wanting to take a chance with their established display tank by skipping quarantine.

 

[ScotJudd]

Totally agree with the above. My QT is a mini version of my main tank (exactly the same water parameters). I use my main tank water to WC my QT so there is no stress on transfer. My QT is also in a 'quiet' area with little people movement and my quarantined fish respond well to feeding. I too have suffered the unfortunate results of introducing un-quarantined fish straight into the main tank. After the stress of transport and the LFS I think a bit of TLC in the QT is just what the fish need.
The author of the article totally misses the point of a good QT.

 

[Andy Sager]

There's another aspect that needs to be considered. With fish, some diseases or pathogens are found internally and if not treated, can remain inside the fish with no ill effects to the fish until the fish becomes stressed. So you take the fish from a 4 week quarantine and don't acclimate them to the new tank and all of a sudden, you have a sick fish coming from QT. There's your "doing more harm than good."
Unfortunately, in today's box store/ multi-tank systems generation, you no longer are dealing with only the fish in the tank you are purchasing from, you are dealing with every fish within that system. There's your reason to QT everything you buy. You just don;t know what they may be carrying. You don't need to medicate necessarily, but you should isolate to prevent widespread disaster to an established display tank. If that means a bigger QT tank, isn't that a bit cheaper than a total wipeout? Your choice of course.

No, I didn't read the article so I will not comment on the author's expertice. I don't feel I need to as I spent over 40 years in the tropical fish business so I know the ins and outs of keeping these fish. It's a different world out there now so all the things we used to do don't always apply to today. Possibly the author was trying to get the point across that using the WRONG SIZED QT tank would be more harmful? That, I would agree with but it is all situational. No, I would not keep a small Oscar in a 10 gal tank for it's lifetime but for a QT period, I have no problems. Neither will the fish.

Hope this helps

 

[sallyjano]

There's another aspect that needs to be considered. With fish, some diseases or pathogens are found internally and if not treated, can remain inside the fish with no ill effects to the fish until the fish becomes stressed. So you take the fish from a 4 week quarantine and don't acclimate them to the new tank and all of a sudden, you have a sick fish coming from QT. There's your "doing more harm than good."
Unfortunately, in today's box store/ multi-tank systems generation, you no longer are dealing with only the fish in the tank you are purchasing from, you are dealing with every fish within that system. There's your reason to QT everything you buy. You just don;t know what they may be carrying. You don't need to medicate necessarily, but you should isolate to prevent widespread disaster to an established display tank. If that means a bigger QT tank, isn't that a bit cheaper than a total wipeout? Your choice of course.

No, I didn't read the article so I will not comment on the author's expertice. I don't feel I need to as I spent over 40 years in the tropical fish business so I know the ins and outs of keeping these fish. It's a different world out there now so all the things we used to do don't always apply to today. Possibly the author was trying to get the point across that using the WRONG SIZED QT tank would be more harmful? That, I would agree with but it is all situational. No, I would not keep a small Oscar in a 10 gal tank for it's lifetime but for a QT period, I have no problems. Neither will the fish.

Hope this helps

Thanks Andy! Makes sense. A Q tho. You said that it could be a problem if you don't acclimate the fish to the display tank. I have used the drip method before but also read somewhere that it's actually not required as long as the temperature is no more than 2 degrees different and the ph is no more than I think it was .2 different. Do you agree with that? Or would you drip acclimate regardless?

 

[Alan26]

after some rookie/ignorant/naive...and multiple mistakes...i always quarantine

 

[threnjen]

Thanks Andy! Makes sense. A Q tho. You said that it could be a problem if you don't acclimate the fish to the display tank. I have used the drip method before but also read somewhere that it's actually not required as long as the temperature is no more than 2 degrees different and the ph is no more than I think it was .2 different. Do you agree with that? Or would you drip acclimate regardless?

Actually the most important difference between two different tank waters is the amount of total dissolved solids (TDS). Moving a fish to water with a much higher or lower TDS has a good chance of killing them and this is usually the actual reason for what people perceive as "pH shock". In scientific studies the pH was much less important.
TDS meters are cheap: http://www.amazon.com/HM-Digital-TD...UTF8&qid=1394058680&sr=8-1&keywords=tds+meter

 

[Andy Sager]

Thanks Andy! Makes sense. A Q tho. You said that it could be a problem if you don't acclimate the fish to the display tank. I have used the drip method before but also read somewhere that it's actually not required as long as the temperature is no more than 2 degrees different and the ph is no more than I think it was .2 different. Do you agree with that? Or would you drip acclimate regardless?

It really depends on the fish I am moving. Fish that are known to be more fragile and susceptible to change, I will drip acclimate, the others I will bag acclimate. Again, it's all situational. I am working in a more controlled environment with my water being well water and stored for later use. I try to match, as best as possible, the qt water to the water on my tanks but never assume they are identical after the fish have been on there so I always acclimate in some fashion. I just don't like to tempt fate It's no skin off my nose to be a little extra cautious. It's just cheaper than having to replace the fish

 

[martintanks91]

I introduces 5 rummy nose tetras into my display tank without quarantine and a few days later they had ich an im still fighting it. Im deff making my 10 gallón into a QT

 

[Cynic]

No rational fish keeper would add a fish from a LFS to a established tank without quarantining in my opinion.

I haven't spent hundreds of hours and dollars on my tank to then go and risk it all to an outbreak such as ich.

 

[Kushgodrex]

Ya when some fish cost 30$ or more why risk killing them all, why even risk it, and most lfs stores offer a 30 day guarantee

 

[martintanks91]

Should i Make the QT tank with or without gravel? Because i now have a 10 gallón tank and i want to Make ir a QT and it already has gravel, can i leave it like it is?

 

[ArtistGardener]

A lot of folks say just use a bare bottom tank with minimal decorations (just so the fish feel secure with some places to hide). My QT tank does have gravel, as well as a clay pot on its side, some plastic plants and live floating plants. I keep fish in there for a good month of quarantine and want them to be calm and unstressed. The few times I've had to do serious medicating, I just take out the gravel afterwards and rinse it or do a super deep gravel vacuuming. I have started pre-emtively treating for flukes and other parasites in quarantine so am not concerned there is any kind of build up of nasty stuff.

 

[Andy Sager]

Should i Make the QT tank with or without gravel? Because i now have a 10 gallón tank and i want to Make ir a QT and it already has gravel, can i leave it like it is?

People tend to confuse a QT tank with a hospital tank. For QT, It is okay to use a fully set up tank with gravel, decor, etc. as you are just making sure the fish has no conditions or diseases that will infiltrate your main tank(s). However, should the fish get sick during the period, they should be removed from the QT tank and medicated in a separate, bare bottomed tank. The reason for this is so that you have an accurate measure of water to use the correct amount of medication.Too weak or too strong a dose can create even bigger problems and even death. Also, some organisms use the gravel as an incubating area during their life cycles. Many parasites do this. Medicating the QT tank will not always rid the tank of these stages. Should a fish in a decorated QT tank come down with a parasitic disease, it would be best to sterilize the QT tank while medicating the fish in another tank.

Hope I didn't confuse anyone