Aggressive Oranda?

[ExperimentLain]

Okay, I have had goldfish before and have always had luck. I never had one that was aggressive before. I am not sure if it's a size thing or if the other fish was showing weakness.

Here are the tank specs- 30 gallon, 65 Degrees F, 1 goldfish (now) no other tank mates.

I cycled my tank for 10 weeks until the tests came out clear and all the levels where good for goldens.

I bought 2 goldfish, the same size, one Oranda and one Black Moore. I planned on stopping there as I want them to have enough space. They where both fine, seemed happy and both where very outgoing. The Moore was perhaps a bit more shy during the first few days. There where no other indications of illness from there that I noticed.

On Sunday I found my Oranda plowing into the Moore and pushing it into the gravel over and over when I got up. I was able to separate them (I have a breeding net I secluded the moore in) but it was clear the damage had been done and the moore died.

I am not sure what brought this on. I know Moores are generally peaceful, and I was sure Orandas where as well. The Oranda is now looking pretty lonely, but very outgoing still- no clamped fins no floating, and it is still eating well...

I hate to keep the fish alone but if he is just a bully I will. I do want to add a loach for algae, I figured if I got a weather loach it would be quick enough to get away from the goldy. For now, I want to take care of this problem before venturing further.

 

[jlk]

How large were both fish? Does the oranda have breeding tubercles?

It could have been simply aggression on the oranda's part or breeding behavior. Breeding behaviors do not require a female be present as an aggressive male will dominate and bully other weaker and/or sick males as well. I do not know if your oranda simply has a bad attitude (like some people) or is an overly hormonal male. Breeding behaviors can result in the injury or even demise of a female so just keep this in mind. If you wish to add another goldie, I would seek another large male oranda in hopes of preventing this from reoccurring. No guarantees though as you just may have an oranda with a bad attitude.

 

[ExperimentLain]

Hi JLK! It's been a long time! How have you been?

I have not noticed any breeding turbicles- though it's cap has a few new white parts to it- is that normal? I never really had orandas especially one this guys size. I have had them under 2 inches. I will check closer when I get home though to be sure. Now that I know what I am looking for, haha

The Oranda is about 4 inches not including his hail and the Moore was about 3.5, I suppose that fraction of and inch could make a difference? The Moore was pretty shy though too, maybe he was sickly?

If the breeding conditions are not right, how can I be sure I am getting another male? I am sure the one I have is a male with what has happened? If it would happen again I will just leave him in his own tank with a loach or cory or two to help keep it clean.

I will check on the turbicles when I get home and post then. I know I need more decor in the tank, maybe I will slip in some terracotta pots I am not using anymore for plants?

Update:
I am not seeing any turbicles at all on the fish. Though no he is swimming around less, he is not eating very readily though he is neither on the top or bottom of the tank, just in the middle towards the back- he seems afraid of me suddenly too. So looking too closely at his scales is difficult. I am seeing a few damaged ones- I wonder if there was a fight between the two?

 

[jlk]

I am well! Thank you for asking!


My best guess is he is a male based on his behavior. I honestly have never encountered a female that has ever displayed aggression except for helping people that put too many fish in too small of a tank and the lack of space/unhealthy water put everyone in a bad mood.

Take a close look at his pectoral fins. Sometimes males will show tubercles on the top of their pectoral fins before displaying them on their gill plates. They appear as tiny little bubbles or bumps on the top of the fins and may not be apparent at a glance or on a white fish. As he is also new, he may also be in need of a quality diet before displaying them.

As I can not guarantee 'he' is a male and I am only taking a guess based on the behavior, its going to be up to you if you wish to add another goldie. I would suggest adding lots 'soft' décor (real or silk plants) to give everyone a place to chill. This may be all you need to create peace in the tank.

All of this said, I would give him a bit to settle and keep a close eye on him. Not readily eating is a concerning when it comes to a goldfish and may indicate something else is amiss. Make sure the water quality is very good, too, but I am sure your checking it! Keep us posted and do not hesitate to ask questions!

 

[ExperimentLain]

The thick ridges of his pectorial fins almost look fuzzy? maybe they are the turbacles and just hard for me to see in his current new state. I dont see anything on his gill plates or any other part of him.

I am going to keep an eye on him (Assuming its a him) for a bit before deciding to add another goldy. The two of them ate all the plants I had in there. (My 20 tetra tank is still planted and I transplanted a few of them) so I am going to silk plants! haha. Except when the 20 gets overrun and I can put more in for food for him

He did end up eating when I was out of the room for a few minutes. It is just strange as he is usually very quick to feed. He seems more lively now as well- swimming around like he normally does. Maybe he was napping I am sure fish do that sometimes!

I am keeping him on a diet of Omega One Goldfish pellets and some bloodworms and such for treats. Along with Omega One flakes sometimes. Any pointers there?

 

[jlk]

If they devoured all the plants you added, they really need their veggies! Once you are able to get him eating his veggies daily, you should be able to add plants back without as much destruction. My main tanks are all planted and I have very little problem with plant munching as everyone prefers their veggies over the plants. They still do nibble them on occasion and when I have been away, I have come home to a plant massacre (lol!). For the most part though, the plant nibbling can be controlled to a degree but its also fine to toss plants in just for feeding purposes.