KingKoopa512
Aquarium Advice FINatic
- Joined
- Dec 16, 2015
- Messages
- 776
Hey cali love how the tank is coming it's been awhile lol
Caliban's AquaOpti 85L
- Thread starter Caliban07
- Start date
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Caliban07
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Caliban07
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So thought I’d best update here since I do still have the aqua opti 85 and it’s not so low tech or El natural anymore.
I like to experiment with my tanks as some of you know. Or my tank at least as I only have the one now. If there is a general consensus on something I test it to see if it’s true or false. I’ve certainly debunked a lot of nonsense this way for sure but I’ve also had some of my ‘beliefs’ or more a hope proved wrong. I still remain open minded to everything until I’ve tested or have known it to be tested by others.
The most recent thing that I wanted to be true was lush plants in a minimal input tank. An El natural tank teeming with rich plant life grown in mulm. The compost of the aquarium or humus if you like.
It doesn’t work. Of course there are people probably reading this thinking ‘duh’ right now. And thats fine I deserve it, but I can also say that I know it to be true because I’ve tried it. Not because someone said so and that means more to me.
I was feeding cyclops only in a rainwater top up tank with a inert sand substrate. I maintained the airstone for stable oxygen and degassing of co2. Plants ground to a halt as you might expect. Despite the massive amount of mulm around the base of the plants. Clearly there was something missing. I wonder if the mulm would have worked better in a gravel tank where it could migrate further down in to the lower areas of the substrate instead of building up on the sand. Still yet to try an undergravel filter. But that is their sole purpose. The snails absolutely love the mulm. So to the shrimp. There must be so many microscopic organisms in that fluffy light brown stuff. Certainly something not to be feared.
Now Im back to dosing fertilisers and have been experimenting with dolomite and potassium bicarbonate to help the plants with their carbon needs. If indeed the airstone isn’t providing enough co2. At this point the tank remains stable. Beautifully clear with the internal filter. One of the down sides of the airstone is when shrimp disturb the substrate and kick the mulm up it stays in the water column and looks unsightly. Never causes algae though.
Fish are perfectly happy. I have tons of Malaysian trumpet snails, shrimp etc. And now perform water changes more regularly. Though on water changes I can honestly say the tank does just the same without them. Plants don’t do well but the fish and shrimp and snails do just fine. They honestly do. How long this can go on I’m not sure but I expect indefinitely. I did 12 months but got tired of dull plants. I know of someone who has only done a few water changes on one of his tanks in 25 years. He does use a soil substrate though which could help buffer. But that soil is also 25 years old. Makes you wonder how much buffering capacity his extremely hard tap water had initially. With no water changes nothing comes out and you would imagine it is recycled. Particularly with the soil and its trillions of microorganisms.
I’m still convinced the substrate is one of the most important aspects to tank stability. It’s the substrate that eventually stops algae growing for example. When the ‘balance’ is achieved and you have a full suite of organisms carrying out all the necessary processes. This also helps plants obtain important nutrients.
Right now I’m testing higher light. Over 100 PAR in a tank with no co2 injection. I want to test stability. As my friend Niko says. A stable tank is indestructible. You can throw anything at it and it will always run clean. He means, co2, no co2, increased light. Any method. I’m going to lay off the carbonates. Just the very few carbonates I’m going to get through the weekly water changes. Lets see if their is enough co2 in this tank for the less demanding plants at such a high PAR. Though not nearly as much as sunlight. My plan is to see how things materialise. Then I’m going to add some carbonates and see if the plants pearl as this would suggest a high rate of photosynthesis as seen with carbon injection and high light.
For now I’ll leave a picture. Probably not the best quality but things are going well.
I like to experiment with my tanks as some of you know. Or my tank at least as I only have the one now. If there is a general consensus on something I test it to see if it’s true or false. I’ve certainly debunked a lot of nonsense this way for sure but I’ve also had some of my ‘beliefs’ or more a hope proved wrong. I still remain open minded to everything until I’ve tested or have known it to be tested by others.
The most recent thing that I wanted to be true was lush plants in a minimal input tank. An El natural tank teeming with rich plant life grown in mulm. The compost of the aquarium or humus if you like.
It doesn’t work. Of course there are people probably reading this thinking ‘duh’ right now. And thats fine I deserve it, but I can also say that I know it to be true because I’ve tried it. Not because someone said so and that means more to me.
I was feeding cyclops only in a rainwater top up tank with a inert sand substrate. I maintained the airstone for stable oxygen and degassing of co2. Plants ground to a halt as you might expect. Despite the massive amount of mulm around the base of the plants. Clearly there was something missing. I wonder if the mulm would have worked better in a gravel tank where it could migrate further down in to the lower areas of the substrate instead of building up on the sand. Still yet to try an undergravel filter. But that is their sole purpose. The snails absolutely love the mulm. So to the shrimp. There must be so many microscopic organisms in that fluffy light brown stuff. Certainly something not to be feared.
Now Im back to dosing fertilisers and have been experimenting with dolomite and potassium bicarbonate to help the plants with their carbon needs. If indeed the airstone isn’t providing enough co2. At this point the tank remains stable. Beautifully clear with the internal filter. One of the down sides of the airstone is when shrimp disturb the substrate and kick the mulm up it stays in the water column and looks unsightly. Never causes algae though.
Fish are perfectly happy. I have tons of Malaysian trumpet snails, shrimp etc. And now perform water changes more regularly. Though on water changes I can honestly say the tank does just the same without them. Plants don’t do well but the fish and shrimp and snails do just fine. They honestly do. How long this can go on I’m not sure but I expect indefinitely. I did 12 months but got tired of dull plants. I know of someone who has only done a few water changes on one of his tanks in 25 years. He does use a soil substrate though which could help buffer. But that soil is also 25 years old. Makes you wonder how much buffering capacity his extremely hard tap water had initially. With no water changes nothing comes out and you would imagine it is recycled. Particularly with the soil and its trillions of microorganisms.
I’m still convinced the substrate is one of the most important aspects to tank stability. It’s the substrate that eventually stops algae growing for example. When the ‘balance’ is achieved and you have a full suite of organisms carrying out all the necessary processes. This also helps plants obtain important nutrients.
Right now I’m testing higher light. Over 100 PAR in a tank with no co2 injection. I want to test stability. As my friend Niko says. A stable tank is indestructible. You can throw anything at it and it will always run clean. He means, co2, no co2, increased light. Any method. I’m going to lay off the carbonates. Just the very few carbonates I’m going to get through the weekly water changes. Lets see if their is enough co2 in this tank for the less demanding plants at such a high PAR. Though not nearly as much as sunlight. My plan is to see how things materialise. Then I’m going to add some carbonates and see if the plants pearl as this would suggest a high rate of photosynthesis as seen with carbon injection and high light.
For now I’ll leave a picture. Probably not the best quality but things are going well.
Brookster123
Aquarium Advice Addict
Looks extremely healthy and well balanced. Excellent job sir.
Looks very comfortable in there. As for the mulm experiment in sand. I do think a gravel / granular type substrate would have helped more fertilizing strength with the potential spaces in between to decompose the materiL putting it where the roots get more of what they need.
As for just the water changes helping supply your plants, everyone's water has different levels of minerals.
Stock levels from fish waste also vary.i have a planted jar. Used previously but cleaned Garnet sand dwarf hair grass just run water through each week. Added a couple cuttings, Coleus and a Trident Fern piece which broke off and sometimes a chunk of houseplant.
Over the past couple years that was all just water change each week. Rinse out dead leaves. Everythingbin there thrived! Probably a quart / liter size jar.
As for just the water changes helping supply your plants, everyone's water has different levels of minerals.
Stock levels from fish waste also vary.i have a planted jar. Used previously but cleaned Garnet sand dwarf hair grass just run water through each week. Added a couple cuttings, Coleus and a Trident Fern piece which broke off and sometimes a chunk of houseplant.
Over the past couple years that was all just water change each week. Rinse out dead leaves. Everythingbin there thrived! Probably a quart / liter size jar.
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Caliban07
Aquarium Advice Addict
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Caliban07
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Caliban07
Aquarium Advice Addict
Yes. My mineral levels are really low. Ranges between 30-60ppm from tap and about 30ppm rain. A friend down south has harder rainwater than my tap! 30ppm is roughly 47 microsiemens conductivity which basically means there is hardly any ions of any description in my water.
I’m looking at a couple of things here. Most people who don’t inject co2 will fall in to various categories based on practices.
1) Most people won’t use something that breaks the surface. How does this affect no co2 tanks? Does this increase co2 or reduce it? It may increase by forming an equilibrium with air and stabilising at a 24 hour very low supply of co2. If gas transfer works on gradients, the steeper that gradient the more co2 will enter the water. With high light the demand for co2 goes up and will be used rapidly creating a steep gradient where co2 is replenished from the atmosphere faster. Or does breaking the surface reduce co2 by driving it off to negligible amounts and you would actually be better using some laminar flow without disturbing the surface?
2) Following on from this most people DO NOT have a mature tank or they are constantly disturbing the stability through certain practices/acts i.e changing substrates, moving plants, low oxygen etc. I do believe unstable tanks are naturally prone to poor plant growth and algae outbreaks and so perhaps we are wrongly correlating high light and low co2 with tank related issues. My tank is a good place to test this since it is a good few years mature.
3) Most people have lots of minerals in their water and will most likely never run in to issues once the tank is mature perhaps due to the alkalinity which plants can easily draw on. My water is a good test for this as I provide all minerals through fertilisation but at present I am omitting carbonates.
If my plants don’t respond to the 130 PAR of light with just ambient co2 levels then I can begin to add carbonates and watch growth carefully. The response should be easily noticeable and unmistakable at 130 PAR. If they carry on growing now without carbonate hardness and ambient co2 we can look at airstones or surface agitation as a means for co2 and question whether you really do need to use low light without co2 injection and ask whether issues with plant growth and algae outbreaks are more to do with tank maturity and microbial stability. I am yet to come across a tank that didn’t have some form of algae outbreak in the early weeks/months. I have experienced it and see it regularly in other peoples journals, despite them providing everything the plants need and cleaning vigorously/changing water.
I often wonder if the ‘easy plants’ or less demanding plants are noted as such simply because they have an exceptional ability to draw on carbonate hardness and most people a) have hard water and b) replenish water once a week.
Of course we may end up back at the already known which is high light = co2 injection. Low light for non co2 tanks. Do water changes to remove organic wastes and high organic wastes = more algae outbreaks.
I’d be really curious to get some of your water quality reports Brookster, Shelly, Autumn or any one following [emoji4]
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Caliban07
Aquarium Advice Addict
I’m going to be testing the high light ambient co2 with additional necessary fertilisers for a month. Bear in mind my tank is stable. Then I will see what happens with the plants. If I start to get algae then it will most likely be due to dissolved organic compounds. It is well documented that plants are quite leaky structures and it is said that they will release organic compounds when growing poorly.
The other thing is plants grow and no algae. I will need to check the speed of growth.
If plants begin to die off (I’m expecting shedding of older leaves) then I will add the potassium bicarbonate and check speed of growth. If they respond then we can aways recommend that people who don’t provide additional co2 increase their alkalinity. You have to bear in mind that nearly all popular chemical fertiliser compounds will not increase carbonate hardness.
If someone has algae and poor plant growth despite having high tap water carbonate hardness we can then question the stability of the tank and call for patience or advise more water changes to remove organic wastes and increase oxygen levels.
The other thing is plants grow and no algae. I will need to check the speed of growth.
If plants begin to die off (I’m expecting shedding of older leaves) then I will add the potassium bicarbonate and check speed of growth. If they respond then we can aways recommend that people who don’t provide additional co2 increase their alkalinity. You have to bear in mind that nearly all popular chemical fertiliser compounds will not increase carbonate hardness.
If someone has algae and poor plant growth despite having high tap water carbonate hardness we can then question the stability of the tank and call for patience or advise more water changes to remove organic wastes and increase oxygen levels.
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Caliban07
Aquarium Advice Addict
View from the ole settee
You wouldn’t know there was 130 PAR due to the almost complete cover of duckweed. Kind of throwing my experiment off somewhat.
You wouldn’t know there was 130 PAR due to the almost complete cover of duckweed. Kind of throwing my experiment off somewhat.
Brookster123
Aquarium Advice Addict
High five
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Caliban07
Aquarium Advice Addict
When I look back through this thread I realise three things.
1) I never ever let this tank fully mature until these last couple of years.
2) Fish were generally always happy despite what they were being bombarded with.
3) I am the worst aquascaper ever.
One day I will go back to co2 but for now I’m playing around with crypts and swords.
That is all
1) I never ever let this tank fully mature until these last couple of years.
2) Fish were generally always happy despite what they were being bombarded with.
3) I am the worst aquascaper ever.
One day I will go back to co2 but for now I’m playing around with crypts and swords.
That is all
KingKoopa512
Aquarium Advice FINatic
- Joined
- Dec 16, 2015
- Messages
- 776
Very nice view
Haha, not the worst aquascaper!!!
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Caliban07
Aquarium Advice Addict
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Caliban07
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Caliban07
Aquarium Advice Addict
When you have a mature substrate it will begin to form natural layers. How long this takes will depend on the type of the substrate. Each layer will measure a certain redox potential. The results of this measurement basically describes how much oxygen is available within each layer and each layer will cater to various microbes depending on oxygen availability. As oxygen is reduced, microbes begin to look at other elements as their energy source.
The picture above is a column of sand with some elements added to it. Over time you can see various colours depicting actions that are being performed by different microbes. This is how things like hydrogen sulphide is produced, how denitrification occurs and how the reduction of iron enables plants to obtain it when it would otherwise be unavailable.
Below is a picture of my substrate at the glass
You can see the substrate layers which have formed and are constantly forming. In an active substrate where there are plant roots. Oxygen availability will fluctuate as plants send oxygen to their roots and oxygenate the rhizosphere. This enables the growth of microbes around the roots which would otherwise not have been able to grow in such low oxygen environments. The plants rely on these microbes to extract nutrients from the substrate.
Be careful when uprooting long submerged plants as disruption to these substrate layers can release ammonia and a number of reactions that reduce available oxygen in the upper portions of the aquarium.
The picture above is a column of sand with some elements added to it. Over time you can see various colours depicting actions that are being performed by different microbes. This is how things like hydrogen sulphide is produced, how denitrification occurs and how the reduction of iron enables plants to obtain it when it would otherwise be unavailable.
Below is a picture of my substrate at the glass
You can see the substrate layers which have formed and are constantly forming. In an active substrate where there are plant roots. Oxygen availability will fluctuate as plants send oxygen to their roots and oxygenate the rhizosphere. This enables the growth of microbes around the roots which would otherwise not have been able to grow in such low oxygen environments. The plants rely on these microbes to extract nutrients from the substrate.
Be careful when uprooting long submerged plants as disruption to these substrate layers can release ammonia and a number of reactions that reduce available oxygen in the upper portions of the aquarium.
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Caliban07
Aquarium Advice Addict
Tonight I dosed potassium bicarbonate (KHCO3). 1tsp to raise the dKH by 2 degrees. Adds quite a lot of K+.
I didn’t need to run this experiment any longer. I’ve seen how fast plants can grow with injected co2 and it’s pretty obvious the plants are not growing all that fast.
Now lets see if there is any improvement after adding the bicarbonate.
Note: I am using potassium bicarbonate and not sodium bicarbonate. Some plant’s don’t tolerate a lot of sodium and neither do some fish.
I didn’t need to run this experiment any longer. I’ve seen how fast plants can grow with injected co2 and it’s pretty obvious the plants are not growing all that fast.
Now lets see if there is any improvement after adding the bicarbonate.
Note: I am using potassium bicarbonate and not sodium bicarbonate. Some plant’s don’t tolerate a lot of sodium and neither do some fish.
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Caliban07
Aquarium Advice Addict
This was a bad idea. The fish, snails and shrimp did not respond well to the additional of potassium bicarbonate at all. With ALL snails closing shut, fish slim coat peeling off with rapid breathing and 1 amano shrimp death and other acting very strange.
The list of reasons for this are endless but my suspicion is osmotic imbalances due to ion ratios. All my crypts melted as a result and ammonia spiked. Then plants started growing very quickly due to elevated ammonia levels. This experiment was repeatable so don’t try this. The affects in my opinion would be more pronounced in soft waters lacking calcium, magnesium and sulphates.
After this I’ve been running more experiments going back to knowns. I’ve gone with an all in one fertiliser and daily water changes of around 10%. Plants are responding well and everyone seems happy.
The list of reasons for this are endless but my suspicion is osmotic imbalances due to ion ratios. All my crypts melted as a result and ammonia spiked. Then plants started growing very quickly due to elevated ammonia levels. This experiment was repeatable so don’t try this. The affects in my opinion would be more pronounced in soft waters lacking calcium, magnesium and sulphates.
After this I’ve been running more experiments going back to knowns. I’ve gone with an all in one fertiliser and daily water changes of around 10%. Plants are responding well and everyone seems happy.
