I have never done a fishless cycle before, so I decided it would be a fun experiment for a science project I have to do, but I am a little confused with how it has been going. I started the cycle four weeks ago and every other day have been testing with API freshwater master test kit and adding Dr. Tim's fishless cycling ammonia as needed. It took a little over three weeks for nitrite to show up and when it did it was off the charts, then four days later the nitrites were completely gone and the nitrates were off the charts. I tested the nitrites twice because I was really confused with how fast they had disappeared and both times the test read 0ppm. Is the cycle finished?
Confused about cycling 10g
- Thread starter SushiRoll
- Start date
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kphilly2017
Aquarium Advice Activist
Congratulations, for trying a new method! That is how you learn. It seems to me that you are doing just fine! It took a total of a month? That sounds about the average to me. I have never done anything but fishless, and it was roughly a month. But to be safe, let's double check it. If you will, do about a 50% to 75% water change of your total system's water volume. We want to get those nitrates out of there first. After that, dose your ammonia back up to the level you started with, when you began your cycle. Follow your product's instructions for the proper dosing amount, like you have been. This time though, once you are done dosing let's run a test on the water just to see that we are at the ammonia level we need to be, also if there are any nitrates still left in the system that's okay. I personally, just like to get them back on the chart to where they are measurable. Once you have those measurements, note them. Give the system about 24 hours. Does not need to be on the dot, but we want it in that range. After 24 hours, if your measurements read no ammonia, no nitrite, and the nitrates are back through the roof then congratulations! You're cycled! Just be sure to run another 50% to 75% water change on your system before adding any fish or invertebrates! We do not want to slip up and forget that we still have an extreme amount of nitrates in the water that are very toxic at this level. If your measurements at the end do not match what I have said, come back here and we will regroup! Good luck!
King Fisher
Aquarium Advice Addict
I'll add that if you are planning to add fish then dose your tank at 2 ppm ammonia. Test your ammonia after 24 hours and you should be at 0. I've found that if your tank can convert 2 ppm ammonia in 24 hours you have a good BB colony built up.
Thanks for the replies! I did a 75% water change and brought the ammonia back up to 4ppm, which is where I kept it for the cycle. I'll test everything tomorrow and see where I'm at. I just have two more questions. First, is it the average for nitrites to disappear so quickly? I had read that it takes about 4-6 weeks, but it only took 4 days. Also the ammonia took much longer to disappear than I had expected (3 weeks instead of 1). Again, is this average? Because this is for a science experiment I need to know if this was, or wasn't, an average cycle.
Edit: Just realized kphilly already answered my questions, but if I could get some more input it would be great!
Edit: Just realized kphilly already answered my questions, but if I could get some more input it would be great!
kphilly2017
Aquarium Advice Activist
Not a problem! Asking more questions, only develops further understanding. So, as far as the average goes, that is kind of tough to answer. Like previously mentioned, you can does 2ppm ammonia. I know others who do this, and it works just fine. It is the same concept, except that it just promotes the growth of a smaller colony of bacteria than dosing at 4ppm will, in my opinion. As far as starting from scratch, I am not to sure which would be quicker. The only way to realistically test this would be to have two tanks of the same volume. Does one at 4ppm and the other 2ppm. At the exact moment. Then note their results over a given period time, which could be a month. Everyone does it differently, and gets different results. It has usually been a month for me, because I use the same method and in the same fashion repeatedly. But I find safety in numbers. If I can covert 4ppm, in 24 hours, than I know for sure I can convert whatever my waste is from the intial stock. So, if the initial stock bio-load is less than 4ppm, the colony will adjust by lack of food. Yes, there will be a mass die-off, but I have yet to find evidence that leads to the death of those bacteria will cause an ammonia spike. Also, in your case, you did right to go back to your initial dosing levels. You need a constant in your research, which is the ammonia.
I hope this helps explain more! If you are still curious, just ask specifically what it is that you are curious about! The reason nitrates stay longer is because nitrates will turn to nitrogen gas. There is another group of bacteria that consume nitrates, and I would assume that they take longer to produce nitrogen gas as a by product. The nitrogen gas leaves the water surface and enters the air. Also, plants and algae utilize nitrates as well. This is a small step in the process of how we get oxygen from the ocean, which contrary to popular belief, is where most of the world's oxygen comes from. Not trees!
I hope this helps explain more! If you are still curious, just ask specifically what it is that you are curious about! The reason nitrates stay longer is because nitrates will turn to nitrogen gas. There is another group of bacteria that consume nitrates, and I would assume that they take longer to produce nitrogen gas as a by product. The nitrogen gas leaves the water surface and enters the air. Also, plants and algae utilize nitrates as well. This is a small step in the process of how we get oxygen from the ocean, which contrary to popular belief, is where most of the world's oxygen comes from. Not trees!
King Fisher
Aquarium Advice Addict
Kphilly is correct, you would need to run multiple tanks with different processes to determine what method is faster.
I agree with the bigger BB colony if the ammonia is higher. It all depends on what your plan is for the tank. If you plan on putting a higher number of fish in your newly cycled tank then I would convert 4 ppm. If you plan on quarantining your fish prior to adding them to your tank and you do this is steps then 2 ppm will suffice. As you add fish from quarantine (3-4 week quarantine for each group of fish) it will gradually build your BB colony as you go. If that makes sense.
I agree with the bigger BB colony if the ammonia is higher. It all depends on what your plan is for the tank. If you plan on putting a higher number of fish in your newly cycled tank then I would convert 4 ppm. If you plan on quarantining your fish prior to adding them to your tank and you do this is steps then 2 ppm will suffice. As you add fish from quarantine (3-4 week quarantine for each group of fish) it will gradually build your BB colony as you go. If that makes sense.
These are the test reading from yesterday:
4ppm Ammonia
.25ppm Nitrite
20ppm Nitrate
These are the test readings after 24 hours:
2ppm Ammonia
1ppm Nitrite
40ppm Nitrate
I definitely have some of both types of bacteria, but they can't cycle 4ppm of Ammonia in 24 hours. I am planning to get fish on Tuesday (I had been thinking about a single betta, but I might try a small community), so I'll still be adding ammonia and building up the BB colonies until then. Do you think three days is enough? Or should I wait longer to get fish?
4ppm Ammonia
.25ppm Nitrite
20ppm Nitrate
These are the test readings after 24 hours:
2ppm Ammonia
1ppm Nitrite
40ppm Nitrate
I definitely have some of both types of bacteria, but they can't cycle 4ppm of Ammonia in 24 hours. I am planning to get fish on Tuesday (I had been thinking about a single betta, but I might try a small community), so I'll still be adding ammonia and building up the BB colonies until then. Do you think three days is enough? Or should I wait longer to get fish?
King Fisher
Aquarium Advice Addict
I would wait until you are getting 0 nitrites. With a small amount of fish 2 ppm ammonia converted in 24 hours is fine IMO.
kphilly2017
Aquarium Advice Activist
I agree with above statement. Had nitrites been zero, I wouldn’t be concerned. Also if you would like, I posted a somewhat detailed thread of my own concerning the Nitrogen Cycle. It may prove to be of some use to you!
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