Fishless Cycle and 120 gallon teardown/setup

The friendliest place on the web for anyone with an interest in aquariums or fish keeping!
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
See posts with no answers
A

Ann7667

Aquarium Advice Activist
Joined
Mar 27, 2011
Messages
165
Location
Eugene, Oregon
Whew! After getting some really bad and incorrect information from the manufacturer of LA Totally Awesome Pure Ammonia from the dollar store saying that it was made of only water an ammonia, I spent from April 27, 2011 to June 7, 2011 patiently dosing my tank and testing daily, waiting for it to cycle. In early June Blaucher24 (I believe) warned me about it so I called the company again and asked them to read the ingredients to me from the MSDS sheet on this product - there were 4 really BAD ingredients before ammonia was even mentioned. Ammonia was the last item on the list. Yikes! So the first person said there was only ammonia and water in it and that she had confirmed that with the "scientists".
Well, I will write to Totally (not) Awesome later, but today I started emptying my tank and cleaning it so that I can set it up correctly with ammonia that has no additives for my fishless cycle.
I just had to find the humor in this. . . so this is what has happened so far.
This morning I drained the water with the syphon hose that I will throw away when this is all finished.
While the water drained out, I started scooping up the sand in a dust pan which was perfect for the job because it had a hollowed out handle through which the water would drain back into the tank while the sand stayed in the pan. But after one scoop into the plastic bag (the girl way) I thought to myself "This is going to take forever!. . . "What would a GUY do to get this sand out of the tank and house?" He probably would not use little plastic bags. And then it came to me . . . He would use a wheelbarrow!!!
So I went out to the patio, wheeled the wheelbarrow into the family room (being careful not to let Bob-the-cat out because he is an indoor cat and loves to escape on a nice day) and started scooping! This was MUCH better and it's definitely the GUY-way! So I just about had all the sand into the wheelbarrow, looking down at the floor; the wheelbarrow was leaking. So I quickly turned it around, dripped it to the door and wheeled it out (being careful to not let Bob-the-cat follow me). I wheeled it out front and emptied the wet polluted sand on top of the patch of weeds I was sure it would kill (the GUY-way).
Going back into the house, the syphon had done its job pulling out all the water it could manage, but there was still some water it there that I thought I could just mop out with some towels. But WAIT! How would a GUY do this????? Not with towels. I thought for a minute and thought - I be he'd use the Shop Wet'n Dry VAC! :dance:
After I get the last bits of sand and water out. I'll drag in the outdoor hose and use that to wash the tank real well. Wash and syphon, wash and syphon until every bit of the tank is clean.
Well that's as far as I've gone, but my goal for today is to finish cleaning the tank and the furniture, the cannister filter and the other appliances - basically everything that was in the tank. I have all new media for the cannister filter. I'll be buying new tubing for everything and tossing the air stone because I don't think that's cleanable. But I'm sure I'll get that finished today.
Then tomorrow I'll purchase the new tubing to refill the tank and set it up again.
I'll keep you posted.
:fish2:
Ann7667
 
I think our tanks are cursed :D

Glad you can see some humor in it though. And good thinking using the "guy" tools! I wouldn't have had access to those so I would have had to do it the "girlie" way.

Good luck on the second time around!
 
It's fantastic to see the commitment you have with this :). It's also entertaining to see a woman actually praising "the guy way" of doing things, haha.
 
ABSOLUTELY . . . for a job like this we have to look for the GUY way of doing it. So I filled the tank to a little less than half full with the garden hose and scrubbed away while it was filling and was ready to put the siphon in and thought I'd just unscrew the garden hose and give it a quick (pardon me, but) suck and let THAT be the siphon. But as soon as I turned off the water and unscrewed it, it automatically began to siphon all by itself . . . another of the "GUY way". . . . love it!!!
LOL
 
Oh, Libraygirl, what is going on with your tank? Are you doing a fishless cycle?
Have to go. I'm foaming at the mouth a little. Some of that stuff must have splashed into my mouth or the hoses are getting to me.:blink:
 
I'm going to finish in the morning since all my fish friends on the East Coast have called it a day. No one is posting now, so I'm doing this all by myself.
Well, I've learned a few things about cleaning hazardous materials out of your aquarium. (The LA Awesome Pure Ammonia)
1. Do not use a garden hose for both putting fresh water in and siphoning the water back out because then you are also putting the last of the water left in the hose back in when you start to refill the tank.
2. Use the garden hose for the fresh water and a python siphon to remove the water and (Guy Way) bungee-cord the python siphon to one of the cross bars on the aquarium so it will stay there. The garden hose on the other hand is more compliant and doesn't seem to want to get out of the tank.
3. Don't try to sop water up with the dog towels. Instead, keep the (Guy Way) Shop Wet'n Dry Vac close by.

And even for a moment if you are going to do this task the "girl way", pause and just THINK . . . How would a GUY do it! It won't be intuitive. For instance I started putting the sand in small plastic grocery store bags, because that's all I can carry at one time. Wet sand is heavy. But when I stopped to think about what a GUY would do . . . a GUY would bring the wheel barrow in the family room and load ALL the sand in the wheel barrow and roll it all outside . . .. ONE TRIP.

My husband is on his way back now from his cycling trip and I wanted to have this finished before he returned, but when I told him about it on the phone tonight, he said when he gets home, we'll get it all cleaned up and put back together again. How sweet! That's what a guy does, too! They help us. Wait until I tell him about the wheel barrow! He'll be so proud of me! :dance: :)
Cheers,
Ann7667
 
Great job and so entertaining to read :) (I'm on the East Coast, an insomniac and apparently don't have too exciting of a social life, lol). This is a story of bad things happening to good people, but the way you're dealing with the situation in such a positive way should be an inspiration to all of us here on the site. :)
 
Oh, an insomniac! Great!
Well, I AM going to write a letter to LA Totally Awesome. . .Ammonia when this is all done. Lots of time and money down the drain. I've decided to not keep the furniture because it would be impossible to clean it . . . too many little crevices and it's probably been absorbed by the soft ceramic (doesn't have a glaze over it). The residue was slimy and all over everything; I used a squeegee to take it off the walls of the aquarium.
But I am just sooooooo glad that I was warned about the ammonia I was using and that I called the company again to double check. I would not have taken this well at all if my fish had suffered and died.
So, although this is not fun, I can definitely see humor in it. And that's the only way to go.
Thanks for your support!:fish2:
 
Ann7667 said:
Okay . . . what are "rep" points and how do you give them?:huh:
Click to expand...

Are you on the app? You actually can't give rep on the app. If you're on an actual browser, there's a little white scale looking thing next to the persons post. If you click on that you can add to rep and leave a comment for that person. When someone's rep adds up it gives those little green squares you see next to people's names.

If you're interested in checking yours, there's a button that says User CP, it will show you the rep and messages people have left for you recently. There are some people who are obsessed with rep points and ask for them, (very tasteless and pathetic...just IMO), but the way I see it, giving good advice is what matters...little green squares only make you look fancy, Haha.
 
Hello eco23,
I now have my 120 tank completely 100% cleaned and all the awful "LA Absolutely (not) Awesome Pure Ammonia" Is out of the tank. It took a while! But I'm sure I've removed all the gunk left by that stuff which had very little ammonia in it but lots of other really bad stuff.
The glass cover is cleaned.
Ian power washed the Rena Cannister Filter, took apart the motor and cleaned that. I purchased two more 50 pound bags of sand, new filter media and hooked up the Rena and started setting the tank up again.
It was not physically possible for me to lift the two 50 pound bags of sand up over and into the tank, so I did it the Girl Way . . . I asked my husband and HE did it. :)
I filled the tank with 120 gallons of 86 degree treated water.
Put in a piece of furniture for the clown loaches to hide in and on which the beneficial bacteria can set up housekeeping.
Cleaned and put the heaters back in.
Put a new stone bubbler in.
And I dosed it with my NEW ammonia (after I called the manufacturer and asked them to read the ingredients off the MSDS sheets and it only has ammonia and water in it). Since it took 4 cups of the other ammonia to get to 4ppm, I put in only half that amount of the new ammonia and it is unreadable - off the charts.
So do I HAVE to do a water change to bring it down, or is there any possibility that there is something in the tank to eat that ammonia?
I'll wait until the morning and take another reading. But would be interested in hearing what you think I should do.
Probably another water change.
Earlier today my husband asked me if I was going to put the fish in the new tank before I left town (this Wed) and I said, NO! LOL and he said "GOOD!" :) He doesn't want to be stuck here with unhappy fish. . . but I don't know what he was thinking, bless his heart!
Let me know what you think about the high Ammonia reading.
 
Ann7667 said:
Hello eco23,
I now have my 120 tank completely 100% cleaned and all the awful "LA Absolutely (not) Awesome Pure Ammonia" Is out of the tank. It took a while! But I'm sure I've removed all the gunk left by that stuff which had very little ammonia in it but lots of other really bad stuff.
The glass cover is cleaned.
Ian power washed the Rena Cannister Filter, took apart the motor and cleaned that. I purchased two more 50 pound bags of sand, new filter media and hooked up the Rena and started setting the tank up again.
It was not physically possible for me to lift the two 50 pound bags of sand up over and into the tank, so I did it the Girl Way . . . I asked my husband and HE did it. :)
I filled the tank with 120 gallons of 86 degree treated water.
Put in a piece of furniture for the clown loaches to hide in and on which the beneficial bacteria can set up housekeeping.
Cleaned and put the heaters back in.
Put a new stone bubbler in.
And I dosed it with my NEW ammonia (after I called the manufacturer and asked them to read the ingredients off the MSDS sheets and it only has ammonia and water in it). Since it took 4 cups of the other ammonia to get to 4ppm, I put in only half that amount of the new ammonia and it is unreadable - off the charts.
So do I HAVE to do a water change to bring it down, or is there any possibility that there is something in the tank to eat that ammonia?
I'll wait until the morning and take another reading. But would be interested in hearing what you think I should do.
Probably another water change.
Earlier today my husband asked me if I was going to put the fish in the new tank before I left town (this Wed) and I said, NO! LOL and he said "GOOD!" :) He doesn't want to be stuck here with unhappy fish. . . but I don't know what he was thinking, bless his heart!
Let me know what you think about the high Ammonia reading.
Click to expand...

Hi Ann :) First, I'd just like to say again that your commitment, work ethic and humor in this situation is very impressive and admirable. However...I've got a bit more work for you, lol. We've really got to get the ammonia to ~4ppm :-(. If you can get it fairly close you'll be okay, but an off the charts reading will definitely cause some problems and may prevent things from getting started.

I'm just about to head off to bed, so I'll be happy to check back in with you tomorrow...but I do think you're gonna have to add a few more dollars to your water bill, lol.

Whether you're doing it the guy way or the girl way...you've been doing everything the RIGHT way, and your fish are very lucky to have such a committed care taker :)
 
Oh, thank you for the compliment about being so committed. But I feel like if I don't get this underway, soon, I might need to be committed! JUST kidding!
How much water should I remove . . . Can I just do 30 gallons? Think I'll take out 30 with the garden hose; that thing works FAST then I'll add 15 buckets (2 gallons per bucket) from another hot water heater because the big one is out of hot water! Okay I'm off to do that now. One more hour!
 
Ann7667 said:
Oh, thank you for the compliment about being so committed. But I feel like if I don't get this underway, soon, I might need to be committed! JUST kidding!
How much water should I remove . . . Can I just do 30 gallons? Think I'll take out 30 with the garden hose; that thing works FAST then I'll add 15 buckets (2 gallons per bucket) from another hot water heater because the big one is out of hot water! Okay I'm off to do that now. One more hour!
Click to expand...

A 50% pwc will reduce levels by half, 25% will reduce by a quarter, etc... When you say add water from a water heater, you don't mean blazing hot water directly out of the thing, right?
 
No, I mean hot water mixed with cold water to the temperature of 86 degrees.
Well, I guess I better do a 60% change, maybe 70% change then dose it up a little to get to 4ppm.
After I do that, then do I keep dosing it every 24 hours to reach 4ppm? Because beginning Thursday Ian will have to do that until I'm back.
:fish2:
 
Hi Ann! Nice to see you starting over, I think this time will be successful for you. If I'm right (and maybe wait for someone like Eco to confirm this) you would just keep it at 4 and keep checking every couple of days until it goes down to about 1 or 0 and then redose, not redose every day otherwise it will go off chart again and you'll have to do pwc to get it down. Until the bacteria start establishing it could take a bit for the first drop to happen. I tested mine today (set it up last Sunday and dosed it to about 2 ppm) and it's about 1 or 1.5 (hard to tell exactly) so I''m going to leave it for another couple of days and see if it drops more, not sure if that drop means anything or if it's just evaporation, so I'll leave it for now. I didn't test anything else (NitrItes, etc) yet but probably will start testing everything in another day or two. Good luck!
 
Hi LibrayGirl, Hi eco23,
Finished! I did a huge water change and after I'd taken 50% out, I filled up a vial to the 5mm line, then tossed 50% and replaced with tap water and tested that and it came down to about 8ppm. So I figured I'd need to take out another 50% of the remaining water. So I did that, filled another vial with the tank water, tossed 50% and replaced it with tap water and that vial tested at 4ppm. etc. So I figured I needed to remove 50% of the remaining water and when I refilled the tank with 86degree treated water and tested the full tank it was at 4ppm. Yea. I had turned on the heaters when the water was at the right level and they were on for a minute then turned off since the water was at 86 degrees. I restarted the Rena filter and that was tricky because I have too much hose and there were bubbles in both the incoming and outgoing hoses but I finally fixed that and got it running.
So since I'm leaving on Wed. 6/23, Ian will have to redose it.
What should he do, to keep it simple, just test it and not let it get below 1ppm? Then I'm trying to figure out how much he should dose . . . definitely starting off small - maybe 1/8th cup then test.
Hopefully I will need to do some adding before I leave on Wed and can figure that out. But if you have any ideas for him, I'd appreciate it.
Thanks!
 
This is on another forum and not sure how accurate it is, but it's a fishless cycle ammonia calculator: Calculator (on the bottom it says "Fishless Cycling Ammonia Required). I put it 20 US gals and 5 PPM of ammonia and it says to add 23.91 ml of ammonia to get it there. Not sure if that helps, but it might be a guideline to follow when adding. I need to measure mine also b/c right now I've been putting in few drops at a time and then testing but I need a better method of measuring especially since I don't currently have a siphon to use if I overdose lol
 
libraygirl said:
Hi Ann! Nice to see you starting over, I think this time will be successful for you. If I'm right (and maybe wait for someone like Eco to confirm this) you would just keep it at 4 and keep checking every couple of days until it goes down to about 1 or 0 and then redose, not redose every day otherwise it will go off chart again and you'll have to do pwc to get it down. Until the bacteria start establishing it could take a bit for the first drop to happen. I tested mine today (set it up last Sunday and dosed it to about 2 ppm) and it's about 1 or 1.5 (hard to tell exactly) so I''m going to leave it for another couple of days and see if it drops more, not sure if that drop means anything or if it's just evaporation, so I'll leave it for now. I didn't test anything else (NitrItes, etc) yet but probably will start testing everything in another day or two. Good luck!
Click to expand...

If it's dropping...there's beneficial bacteria in there. Unless the tank is heavily planted, there's nowhere else for it to go. Ammo won't evaporate. You will hopefully see some purple showing up in the no2 bottle pretty soon :). Don't let the ammo drop to 0...just dose it up to 3-4ppm every 24 hours when it drops :)
 
libraygirl said:
This is on another forum and not sure how accurate it is, but it's a fishless cycle ammonia calculator: Calculator (on the bottom it says "Fishless Cycling Ammonia Required). I put it 20 US gals and 5 PPM of ammonia and it says to add 23.91 ml of ammonia to get it there. Not sure if that helps, but it might be a guideline to follow when adding. I need to measure mine also b/c right now I've been putting in few drops at a time and then testing but I need a better method of measuring especially since I don't currently have a siphon to use if I overdose lol
Click to expand...

All ammo is different strengths...even the same brand can differ. The Ace brand is super potent...what I used took over 250 drops to get to 4ppm!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

Aiken Drum
Fishless Cycle Guide using Ammonia
Replies
2
Views
415
Aiken Drum
Aiken Drum
J
Fishless cycle help
2
Replies
39
Views
2K
Andy Sager
Andy Sager
M
Strange Nitrate problem in fishless cycle
Replies
8
Views
870
Andy Sager
Andy Sager
L
pH unstable at end of fishless cycle
Replies
2
Views
708
Aiken Drum
Aiken Drum
M
Fishless Cycle Question
Replies
8
Views
634
Andy Sager
Andy Sager

Latest posts

Back
Top Bottom