please help...my flame angel is sick (updated with pic)

[itzafugasi]

my flame has been in qt for 2 weeks. the first week he showed no signs of sickness at all. he was eating, active, and bright. about 1 week ago it looked like he had ick b/c of white spots on his tail. i treated the qt w/ quick cure and the ick was gone in 2 days... now, at about day 13 in qt, he has red spots on his left and right fin (looks like ick but its red) and his eyes are a little puffy and cloudy. what can i do to save him? i have been changing the water in the qt every other day, sometimes everyday (about 20% of 10 gallons). any suggestions on what he may have? please help...thanks in advance.
on a side note, he is still active and still eating.

 

[quarryshark]

What are the water parameters? Are you monitoring the copper level? If so what is the level? Is he eating?

 

[itzafugasi]

the sg is 1.022, which i lowered slowly from 1.025. ammonia and nitrites are at 0, trates are at around 5-10. i treated the ick with quick cure which contains formalin and malachite green. and the fish is eating.

 

[quarryshark]

Ah, have you redosed as per the instructions? Can't monitor that drugs level...makes it tough. Thats the problem when a drug is used that there is no test kit for. Can tell if the treatment level is too low or too high.
Whats the PH? Hard to tell what the red splotches are, low PH and ammonia poisoning are several causes.
Cloudy eyes are a symptom of other ailments. Is he active? Can you snap a pic of him?

 

[itzafugasi]

i will take a pic and post it. ph is at 8.2. i did redose as the instruction said, 1 drop per gallon everyday until ick is gone. but i did 7 drops to be on the safe side. pic will be up soon...

 

[itzafugasi]

ok here is the best pic i could get. it kind of looks like red streaks on his left and right fins. and you can notice the cloudiness of the eyes.

 

[quarryshark]

He may have a secondary infection of some sort. Are you still using quick cure?

 

[itzafugasi]

no, i stopped using quick cure. i only used it for 2 days. i was also thinking that maybe he got a secondary infection. the past 4 days i have been doing 20-30% water changes to keep the water as clean as possible. i also noticed today that some of what i think are its scales on the pvc pipe i have in the tank. i believe he is having trouble eating b/c his eyes are cloudy. but he ate today so i am too concerned about that. any suggestions?

 

[quarryshark]

What worries me is that the parasite is still present. It could also be velvet. A 2 day treatment is not long enough to kill the parasite. A good treatment with a med such as Cupramine you run for 14 days, that way you are sure to get them all. With the lifecycle lasting up to several weeks, there is now way you can kill them all in 2 days. They are only vulnerable in their free swimming state. Not all hatch out of the trophont state at the same time.
Now things are complicated with the possible secondary infection. He may need an antibiotic treatment, but you need to tackle the parasite first. Here is what I suggest.
Find some cupramine and the test kit that goes with it, seachems multitest kit. The test kit is a must. If you can't find one, I will UPS you mine (don't need it right now).
Run the cupramine, it is well tolerated by most fish and is very effective. Also he needs to see. I would put some epsom salts in the qt to lessen the inflammation. 1 Tbs per 10 gallons, redose it every three days.
That along with keeping the water quality high, hopefully will clear him up. With high water quality, he should be able to fight the secondary infection off on his own. If that doesn't happen, you could treat with a broad spectrum antibiotic.
You need to tackle that parasite first.
Let me know, I have plenty of cupramine and I also have the test kit.

 

[steve-s]

Be sure you run some carbon to remove what's left of the old treatment before starting the new one. Even though you have done several water changes is best to be safe and not mix meds. Remove the carbon after about 12 hrs and start the Cupramine.

Cheers
Steve

 

[quarryshark]

Thanks Steve, good point.
One more thing, when you do the water changes, make sure you vacuum the bottom of the tank and the tops of the pvc pieces. This way you can get some of the trophonts.

 

[itzafugasi]

thank you for all the suggestions. I will purchase cupramine tomorrow at my lfs along w/ a copper test kit. i appreciate your offer quarryshark, that was very nice of you. i will take your suggestions and definitely use them. i will keep you posted, and hopefully he'll make it!

 

[itzafugasi]

unfortunately, i think i was too late in treating my flame angel. he died this morning. yesterday i looked at him and his condition worsened by like 100%. it was very strange. one day he was eating and his eyes were a little cloudy, and yesterday he just stopped eating and looked miserable. he had white stuff all over his body, and i couldnt tell if it was ich or a cottony fungus.

i just dont understand where i went wrong, b/c i kept up w/ water changes and monitored it everyday... its very discouraging. but thanks steve and quarryshark for all your help.

 

[quarryshark]

Sorry for your loss... It can be disheartening.
Before you put another fish in that qt tank, make sure you empty it, clean it with bleach and hot water. Rinse well and allow it to dry.
Don't want to infect the next fish.

 

[itzafugasi]

thanks.

one question though. i have a piece of live rock in my qt. can i put it in my main tank after i treated the qt w/ formalin? of course, i would boil the rock first, but i dont know if boiling would get rid of the meds and the possible parasites that were in there.

 

[steve-s]

Heating will not remove the formalin. It only makes it more toxic. The rock is basically a throw away. :?

Cheers
Steve

 

[quarryshark]

Ya, I wouldn't take the chance.

 

[itzafugasi]

ok, thanks. it was a small piece anyway.