roka64
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Yes. That would be best. If you are at 20ppm, maybe do a 50%, to get them to 10ppm.fishman said:
Setting up QT tank
- Thread starter fishman
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Ok so as I was about to take the shrimp out tonight, I decided to test the water. I show I now have .8 or above on ammonia and between 40 and 60 nitrates. So appears I didnt have enough bacteria base in there after all.
So do I leave the shrimp in there now? Or take it out and let the tank do its thing? The shrimp has been in there since this past Sat. 10-28
What else do I need to do?
So do I leave the shrimp in there now? Or take it out and let the tank do its thing? The shrimp has been in there since this past Sat. 10-28
What else do I need to do?
austinsdad
Aquarium Advice Addict
Take the shrimp out. There's is enuf ammonia in there to finish. After the ammonia comes down, the nitrites go up and come back down - then you'll have the bacteria base you're looking for.
But yes, Take the shrimp out. Your ammonia is already at the top of the chart and you're prolonging things unecessarily IMO.
But yes, Take the shrimp out. Your ammonia is already at the top of the chart and you're prolonging things unecessarily IMO.
Kurt_Nelson
Aquarium Advice Addict
austinsdad said:
Ammonia at 0.8 is "top of the chart?" Granted, you normally don't want any in there, but I was thinking this could be considered "a trace" during cycling.
I hear what you're saying though. When I cycled my QT, I left the shrimp in too long and got ammonia levels between 4 and 6ppm. While still not at the top of the chart, it did prolong my cycle. When I finally did a couple water changes to bring it down to about 2ppm, my cycle finally kicked in to high gear. Don't really know if it would've kicked in regardless of the water changes, but it did seem rather coincidental.
Austinsdad - did you misread his ammonia level in the post, or is my sense of "good" ammonia levels during a cycle just totally off base? You've got way more experience than me, and I'm always looking to learn!
austinsdad
Aquarium Advice Addict
You're right. I did misread - or just mis-assumed that a 3" shrimp would stink it up enuf in there to drive it to the top (8.0). Keep forgetting about the bio-media in the tank.
If it is .8 indeed, I'd still take the shrimp out and watch the nitrites now. If they are at zero also, then I'd guess the tank is cycled. Then, we gotta get the water changes together to get that nitrate down (and remove the shirmp - did I say that already??)
Hey, 8) we may be talking cleaning crew and a (that's one) fish in a few days.
Hmmm. Got a test to show amounts that small? Assuming .8. Or maybe, like I do - "well it's between .50 and 1.0".
If it is .8 indeed, I'd still take the shrimp out and watch the nitrites now. If they are at zero also, then I'd guess the tank is cycled. Then, we gotta get the water changes together to get that nitrate down (and remove the shirmp - did I say that already??)
Hey, 8) we may be talking cleaning crew and a (that's one) fish in a few days.
Hmmm. Got a test to show amounts that small? Assuming .8. Or maybe, like I do - "well it's between .50 and 1.0".
roka64
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psst....I believe it's a QT....no cleaning crew needed....LOL!austinsdad said:
austinsdad
Aquarium Advice Addict
That's it!! I've had it. I always knew I had this "lazy about reading previous post" disorder. Now, everyone knows it!!!!
I'm gonna see the veteranarian about it ASAP. Oops, I meant physician!
I'll get better someday.
I'm gonna see the veteranarian about it ASAP. Oops, I meant physician!
I'll get better someday.
roka64
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LOL!austinsdad said:
The .8 is the highest level on my ammonia chart so Im maxed out.
So I took the shrimp out, and I assume I will wait a day or so and test again?
Also where does the bacteria build? On the media I assume but since I only have 2 biowheels, some LS and some PVC, I guess it builds on there? I have heard conflicting stories that the bacteria builds in the water, on the media and tank, etc. I would think if the bacteria were in the water, then why would my tank need to cycle at all since the water came from the main?
So how long do I need to wait to add a fish? Guess it depends?
So I took the shrimp out, and I assume I will wait a day or so and test again?
Also where does the bacteria build? On the media I assume but since I only have 2 biowheels, some LS and some PVC, I guess it builds on there? I have heard conflicting stories that the bacteria builds in the water, on the media and tank, etc. I would think if the bacteria were in the water, then why would my tank need to cycle at all since the water came from the main?
So how long do I need to wait to add a fish? Guess it depends?
Kurt_Nelson
Aquarium Advice Addict
What brand ammonia test you got there? 0.8ppm should not be maxed out. Are you sure that's not 8.0 ppm? Like Austinsdad said, 0.8 is not normally listed on the charts - but a lot of us kind of estimate when the color is between colors on the chart. "Well... it's higher than 0.5, but lower than 1.0... but it's closer in color to 1.0, so let's call it 0.8"... that kind of thing.
In your case, the bacteria will build on the biowheel and in the sand. That's it. Granted... it's probably in the water, but not in the quantities you need to convert the ammonia to nitrates.
Don't add fish until both your ammonia AND nitrites drop to zero. Ammonia will spike first, then come down. As ammonia is coming down, nitrites will spike, then come down. Eventually they'll both be at zero, and you'll have a bunch of nitrates. Judging by your previous nitrate readings you'll have a BUNCH of nitrates! Do 50% water changes, one a day, until you get down somewhere below 10 (even lower if you want to be kind to your new fish!) and you're good to go.
In your case, the bacteria will build on the biowheel and in the sand. That's it. Granted... it's probably in the water, but not in the quantities you need to convert the ammonia to nitrates.
Don't add fish until both your ammonia AND nitrites drop to zero. Ammonia will spike first, then come down. As ammonia is coming down, nitrites will spike, then come down. Eventually they'll both be at zero, and you'll have a bunch of nitrates. Judging by your previous nitrate readings you'll have a BUNCH of nitrates! Do 50% water changes, one a day, until you get down somewhere below 10 (even lower if you want to be kind to your new fish!) and you're good to go.
Kurt_Nelson
Aquarium Advice Addict
Well... I guess I learned something new today. Didn't know that brand had such low sensitivity. I suppose that's good in a way since you can detect really small traces. That will be good for a cycled tank.
If you're really curious what the true ammonia level is, you could pick up a different test kit with a lower sensitivity. I use Aquarium Pharmceuticals brand and it maxes out - I think - at 8.0. Really easy to use.
If you're really curious what the true ammonia level is, you could pick up a different test kit with a lower sensitivity. I use Aquarium Pharmceuticals brand and it maxes out - I think - at 8.0. Really easy to use.
austinsdad
Aquarium Advice Addict
I checked this site out. Looks like Fishman is right. Look at the attached. It speaks about .25 being a serious stress level, and 0 to 0.8 being the range. My kit is 8.0 max. Hmmm.... 
http://www.aquarium-supply.biz/ordering/ov_test_kits.html
Guess I always thought that big a shrimp in for that time, you'de be at the top of whatever scale.
Anyway fishman, dark green seems to be the universal fit here, so you are at the top of the chart. I don't know much about bio wheels, but you'll have the bacteria grow there (and the bag of sand if I remember).
Like said, the ammonia will creep down as the nitrites will creep up. Both at zero and you're ready to add fish. After you do, whatch the ammonia again.
http://www.aquarium-supply.biz/ordering/ov_test_kits.html
Guess I always thought that big a shrimp in for that time, you'de be at the top of whatever scale.
Anyway fishman, dark green seems to be the universal fit here, so you are at the top of the chart. I don't know much about bio wheels, but you'll have the bacteria grow there (and the bag of sand if I remember).
Like said, the ammonia will creep down as the nitrites will creep up. Both at zero and you're ready to add fish. After you do, whatch the ammonia again.
Also one of the reasons I bought this particular test kit is its powder form instead of drops. I have found that the powder really gives a good reading...maybe its just me.
I figure since the ammonia was at the top of the scale this would be good enough??
Yes I do have 2 biowheels and a bag of LS in my QT tank. I have the sand in a baggie so it wont fog up the tank. Im also going to drop a small peice of LR from my main in there right before the fish goes in. I want to make sure its good.
I figure since the ammonia was at the top of the scale this would be good enough??
Yes I do have 2 biowheels and a bag of LS in my QT tank. I have the sand in a baggie so it wont fog up the tank. Im also going to drop a small peice of LR from my main in there right before the fish goes in. I want to make sure its good.
austinsdad
Aquarium Advice Addict
What kinda live rock. From where. I'd consider dropping it in now so the bacteria you're looking for will settle there too. I got LR in my QT tank too. It's just that I've been lucky enuf not to have to use meds yet in it.
If the LR you put in before the fish isn't cured or seeded already, you won't get the result you're looking for.
P.S. - I never liked the powder tests. The drops are much easier IMO. And I doubt because it's powder that you are getting more accurate either.
If the LR you put in before the fish isn't cured or seeded already, you won't get the result you're looking for.
P.S. - I never liked the powder tests. The drops are much easier IMO. And I doubt because it's powder that you are getting more accurate either.
Kurt_Nelson
Aquarium Advice Addict
austinsdad said:
Not to digress too much, but I noticed these directions for the Aquarium Systems ammonia test when I was looking into it this morning:
Ammonia test:
Rinse test chamber with water to be tested. Fill to line.
Empty test packet #1 foil into test chamber.
Cap and shake for 3 minute.
Empty test packet #2 foil into test chamber.
Cap and shake to dissolve.
Wait 15-20 mintues.
Compare prepared sample to ammonia color chip (green).
Clean cap and sample tester with fresh water.
This is from http://www.thatpetplace.com/Product...ia/T1/F55CA+0062+0361/EDP/51592/Itemdy00.aspx
Wow. If I had to do that everytime I wanted to test for ammonia, I sure wouldn't be doing it much! 18-23 minutes total time and 3 minutes of shaking? Ouch.
That's why I like Aquarium Pharm I guess. For ammonia, drop in 8 drops of #1 liquid, drop in 8 drops of #2 liquid, shake momentarily, let sit for 5 minutes and read color. Heck, from my experience even after about 30 seconds you'll know if you have any ammonia or not. But then I guess that's why there are so many different brands!
Well if I told you that I stood there and shook the vile as long as they ask, I would not use that test kit!! I have noticed that as soon as the powder goes in that it immediatly dissolves. Also I think someone on here told me that this particular brand I use is the only one you can use when using Prime?? Is this correct?
I tested my nitrites last night and they are at .3 according to my test kit. The test kit goes up to 3.3 - 33 mg/l. Since my ammonia is .8 and my trates are 40-60 ppm, does this seem in line?
Also as I asked before is there a specific test kit that one needs to use in order to accomidate Prime when using it? I have heard that Prime sort of messes up test kits unless you use a specific one.
Also as I asked before is there a specific test kit that one needs to use in order to accomidate Prime when using it? I have heard that Prime sort of messes up test kits unless you use a specific one.
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