Sick angel - what killed my angels?

[src]

EDIT: I've changed the title - 3 are dead, one is dying. What did it?

One of my juvi black angels (2") is having serious trouble. He's listless (sitting on the bottom, on plants, etc), having trouble maintaining his orientation (idling with his mouth straight up and doing "backflips"), and occasionaly seems to stop breathing for a few seconds. IMO, he's on death's door.

There are no visible signs of parasites/infection, he has good color (solid black, no fading), no fin damage, no ich, no spots, no dropsy, no nothing that I can see.

The source tank is my planted 120 - PH 6.4 (due to CO2 injection), KH 3, Ammonia 0, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 10 (just did a water change this morning), Temp 80.

I've moved him to the hospital tank (freshly filled, PH 7).

I'm about to head out the door to pick up some meds - I'll get a variaty of items I've seen discussed, but what should I use to treat this poor fella (assuming he's still alive when I get back)?

Thanks!

 

[Jchillin]

This is the subject I dread the most, sick angels. It is not likely that he will recover as the symptoms you describe usually result from a genetic form of swim bladder disease. Although it's not likely, a 30% PWC followed by Melafix can be tried.

I have my fingers crossed.

 

[src]

He's in the Rx tank, and I have Melafix and Pimafix in right now (I just took my best guess). He's mostly lying on his side on the bottom, but he's still kicking.

Genetic swim bladder is both good and bad news. Good in that it's not contagious so the rest of my fish (including 3 other angels) will hopefully be OK, bad in that he probably won't make it. Also bad in that the other 3 angels are from the same stock - hopefully they will be lucky.

Thanks for the information, Jchillin. Knowledge is much better than ignorance.

 

[Jchillin]

Not a problem, and you are correct; you won't have to worry about the other fish. The other good news is, it rarely affects more than one fish from the same spawn.

 

[src]

Unfortunately, I lost that angel and now another is exhibiting similar symptoms. I think I caught this one earlier in the game, and he is in the QT tank with the Melafix and Pimafix. I'll continue dosing the Melafix for now. Now I'm really getting worried about the remaining two angels.

 

[rich311k]

Sorry for your loss. Good luck with the others.

 

[src]

So far the one I moved to the Rx tank is looking better. He's hanging around in a corner near the surface, rather than lying down on the bottom. I think he's hating being in a totally empty tank - he's skittish, diving for the corner whenever the tank is approached, while in the big tank they come up to the glass to see me whenever I walk by. I'm going to add some plastic plants tomorrow.

Maybe I just over-reacted to some normal behavior before, but I'm going to keep him in the Rx for a few more days at least.

 

[src]

Well, the second angel died today. It seemed to be doing great last night, then this morning it was wrapped around the filter intake. It was still alive, but obviously crippled and in a bad way once I got it off the filter. Died sometime today while I was at work.

The only good news is that the other 2 seem to be doing well. Only time will tell, I guess.

 

[src]

OK, I don't think I can blame it on "genetic swim bladder" - another angel is in trouble. The fourth looks great, but then this one looked great yesterday. I'm at my wit's end with these guys. Tank parameters are still good - Ammonia 0, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 20, KH 3, PH 7 (I've turned off my CO2 in preparation for a blackout), temp 78. The only problem with the tank is the algae, and while it's an ugly issue, it isn't overrun.

I can't imagine what is causing these angels so much trouble. Still no visible signs of problems - good color, no deformities, swelling, spots, etc., gills seem good, fins in good shape. I hate to see such beautiful fish go through this.

 

[src]

So 3 are dead, and the last one is now showing all the same symptoms. What in the world could cause this type of die-off? All the other fish are doing great, tank parameters are great (except for the algae), no physical signs, no "distress behaviour" (flashing, gasping at the surface, twitching, etc.).

Am I just bad for angels?

 

[rich311k]

Sounds to me like a bad batch of angels. How big were they and did they all come from the same place?

 

[Jchillin]

I'm am sorry to hear this but from what you are describing, it is the swim bladder issue. I did mention this:

The other good news is, it rarely affects more than one fish from the same spawn.

...and if this disorder was strong, it could very well affect all. Hence why I mentioned being rare.

 

[src]

Sorry, Jchillin, I did misread your original post - out of hope, probably. They were a little over 2" long (and high), and were all from the same batch. A LFS got them from a local person who bred them (not sure if he is a "breeder", or just someone who got lucky).

I've been watching for nice angels for a while, and was so happy to find such a nice batch. It's been agonizing to watch them all die like this.

 

[rich311k]

I am so sorry SRC, it took me two LFS and a couple of batches of juvenile before I found healthy juveniles. The3 next time I will try to find them online. The extra money will be more than worth the agony of watching those pretty fish die.

 

[Ichthyologist]

Have you been moving each one of them to a quarantine tank when they get sick? I noticed your first one you did, and the pH shock likely did not help matters.

 

[Jchillin]

No problem SRC, just wanted to get the issue clarified. When I had this issue (one angel out a group of four just suddenly starting showing those symptoms and died shortly after), I wanted to know what caused it. Discussions with breeders and other Angel experts shed a really bright light for me, albeit an unfortunate one.

 

[justrelax]

is swim bladder disease only a genetic disorder or something that can develop too?

 

[src]

Have you been moving each one of them to a quarantine tank when they get sick? I noticed your first one you did, and the pH shock likely did not help matters.

I moved the first 2 into QT. The second two I left in the main tank, because I had the same concern about shock. Same result either way, and in about the same amount of time. The last one was dead when I got home from work today.

My pH in the main tank has been low due to CO2 injection, but I've read that fluctionations due to CO2 weren't harmful, just changes due to KH. I still had my doubts though. Withouth the CO2, the pH is very close between the main tank and QT (right at 7).

Thanks again for all the information and advice, everyone. I just wish I could have done something to spare the little fella's.