Stop PWC

[Dbouchard]

im a newbie finding this thread confusing, im doing a fish in cycle with Zebra Danios on a 20 gal tank.

I assumed that clean water was my best bet so ive been doing pwc`s every day...ive been changing out about 50% of the water and still see 0.25 ammonia

am I doing this correctly then

I assumed once i start seeing nitrites and nitrates then ill have to adjust my planning but for now im only really seeing ammonia


i figure after reading this that not doing pwc cant be good while cycling...ammonia is bad for the fish why wouldnt it be good to keep it in as low as numbers as possible


sorry if im misunderstanding this, but i am just learning

Dee

 

[jlk]

im a newbie finding this thread confusing, im doing a fish in cycle with Zebra Danios on a 20 gal tank.

I assumed that clean water was my best bet so ive been doing pwc`s every day...ive been changing out about 50% of the water and still see 0.25 ammonia

am I doing this correctly then

I assumed once i start seeing nitrites and nitrates then ill have to adjust my planning but for now im only really seeing ammonia


i figure after reading this that not doing pwc cant be good while cycling...ammonia is bad for the fish why wouldnt it be good to keep it in as low as numbers as possible


sorry if im misunderstanding this, but i am just learning

Dee

It sounds like your doing fine!!! Healthy water is the best thing you can offer your fish while cycling (and in general). Keep up the good work with daily testing & water changes as needed to keep your toxin levels down. Just make sure you are using temperature-matched, properly conditioned water for your changes. Heres a link you can read for some more information.

I just learned about cycling but I already have fish. What now?!

 

[aquaponicpaw]

I just learned the hard way that aquaponicpaw is completely correct. I hadn't had a fish die for approaching a year (48 litre tank, with 4 x corydoras, 6 x guppies, 1 x Kuli loach and 5 x neon tetras, which was a little overstocked and everyone was doing just fine!).

Last week I did a complete substrate change and swapped a couple of ornaments. By the next morning ALL of my tetras were dead. The corydoras, loach and guppies all made it, but they weren't happy at all (coming up for air all the time, the loach was going crazy). I realised what the problem was (total lack of bacteria) and took an old ornament, old plant and some of the old substrate out of the bag I'd put in the outside bin (which overnight would have reached almost freezing temperatures!) back into the tank. After a few hours, everything was looking better and now 5 days on I am beginning to see bacteria building up on the glass again (never been so happy to see dirty brown marks on the tank!).

I guess the moral of the story is A) don't take too much "dirty" stuff out of your tank at the same time, and B) bacteria lives for a LONG time outside of the water, so if you make a mistake just stick something covered in it back in the tank and hope for the best!

Strange how ALL the tetras died, but none of the guppies, corydoras or the loach. I guess they aren't as hardy to new water conditions!

With "negligence" being a key part of old tank syndrome. I don't think that is the case. as it is very difficult to keep fish alive in a tank that is stocked by the 1" per gal. rule. Whatever the case whether it is Old, or New tank syndrome the key component is bacteria. When you replaced "some" of the Old decor. And the tank stabilized that kind of validates the fact. Remove a large enough colony of BB from even the most pristine tank and the results would be the same. The diatoms "microbes" you see on your glass are vital whether you tend to allow them to live on the glass or not.

 

[bs6749]

I don't believe that the changing of the substrate in Johnno1234's case caused the death of his fish. Certainly I would agree that there was a substantial amount of beneficial bacteria in the old substrate and that swapping the old for new might result in a spike in ammonia and nitrites as the BB colony in the filter and throughout the remainder of the tank was unable to process all of the ammonia and eventually convert it to nitrate.

Jetajockey and I share the very same ideas on the old tank syndrome topic, however I don't feel that it was the case here. Though I agree that old tank syndrome can, and does happen in the way mentioned, I don't believe that the fish would succumb so quickly to ammonia poisoning, unless the levels were extremely elevated, which would indicate neglect, as would high levels of nitrates. More information is needed to determine, in my mind, the true culprit here. We would need to know the ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, and pH readings before and after the substrate was changed and whether or not new water was introduced. It could be something as simple as not putting dechlorinator into the tank when it was needed.

 

[Johnno1234]

Hi I think you experienced what some people call 'old tank syndrome'. I experienced this myself a couple of times years ago when I thought water changes only had to be done once every 6 or 8 months.

What happens is a tank that has been neglected for a long amount of time (as in no water changes for a very long period of time) ends up having a very high level of TDS and the pH tends to drop very low. The major shift in TDS with a big water change affects fish, especially sensitive tetras. The other thing about the pH is that as it drops, nitrification slows down, and this leads to a buildup in ammonia levels. This isn't a problem in a tank with low pH though, because another effect of a low pH is that the free ammonia (NH3) becomes ammonium (NH4), which is far less toxic.

However, when a big water change is done after all this time, the pH jumps back up to normal and the ammonium reverts back to ammonia suddenly becomes toxic again.

Bacteria is invisible, you won't be able to see it, but can sort of 'feel' it as the slimy stuff on the tank surfaces. The brown stuff on the tank walls is diatom algae.

Ok thanks for the extra information, it's really helped me understand things a bit better. Just out of interest, how long do you think it might take for the bacteria to get back to a decent level? And the diatom algae; is that beneficial or problematic in any way?

 

[KaylNeko]

Diatoms are neither beneficial nor problematic--they just look funky. Unless you have algae eaters that are less than willing to eat prepared foods--then they can be beneficial.