Fish are FRIENDS, not expendable!

[phoenixkiller]

What I have seen is that some of the posts in this thread that are against my point of view are "We shouldn't mourn fish". I just said, IT IS NOT THE FACT THAT HE DID NOT GRIEVE THE FISH!! IT IS THE FACT THAT HE ACTED AS THOUGH THE FISH WAS EXPENDABLE!! Yes, he has many guppies, but he treated the dead one with disgust. Sure, none of us should mourn fish. They only have a few year lifespan. But not caring about the fish is not the correct way to exploit this hobby. ALL fish need great care, from zebra danios to gouramis to stingrays. Understand that respect is not mutually transferred, the fish could care less about his keeper. (Save for Discus, lol) But would you want to be someone's pet if you live in your own feces and the air is poison? Well, it's the same for fish, and any other pet for that matter. Guppies are numerous. They overrun tanks. But utter disgust for something that you nurtured from birth is not something to take for granted.

 

[chew valley]

It is not all about care. I do lots of research and my fish are all in suitable tanks and are looked after. But I lost a zebra Daniel and a plenty after a very short time. Now had it been my fault then I may feel bad about it but as it wasn't my fault then I just accept it as being one of those things. Why do I think it's not my fault? Well all the other fish are fine, I do regular water changes and test conditions etc. So I don't dwell on it. Fish are very sensitive and can die for any number of reasons.

 

[phoenixkiller]

Yeah, they do tend to die for strange reasons. This hobby needs more responsible people, like you, me, and the experienced moderators. I say that, yes, the little girl got a betta for her birthday, and she takes care of it well. That's fine. What I don't like is my neighbor with six fish tanks cleaning his tanks once a month, feeding his fish Tetramin all their life.

 

[darkmatter_3500]

I feel upset when one of my fish die , I house and raise them , I get attached to some of my fish , some more than others but I try and give them the best life possible since I choose to keep them, Fishkeeping or having any pet is something we choose to do for our personal enjoyment and really nothing more than that. This is why we should be as ethical as possible because it is really just for our entertainment. Fish do not need us.

 

[Mlani]

I'm a little off today, I only came in to read, after seeing this thread I feel the need to express my opinion too. Lol! I think that like anything else people do, it comes down to how much you allow yourself to become invested. For example if you're passionate about the hobby, and that passion is directed towards a certain aspect of it. Some people breed therefore their goals in the hobby are different. I think it comes down to why the individual enjoys the hobby. Which part of it excites them most. Some it's the learning of the natural environments and recreating those others it's learning about the behaviors of the different species. As harsh as it may seem, but when people are dealing with a high volume of aquatic populations I think they may almost become desensitized to the deaths, unless they are emotionally invested. I don't think fish are expendable by any means, but in some cases with certain species you do expect more frequent deaths because of the natural lifespans of some fish. I myself like to challenge the lifespans and try my best to see how long past that expected timeframe I could keep my fish alive. I do think, like with any hobby, the way in which you enjoy the hobby is a great reflection of who you are as a person. You can really tell a lot about a person based on the hobbies they keep.

 

[phoenixkiller]

I feel upset when one of my fish die , I house and raise them , I get attached to some of my fish , some more than others but I try and give them the best life possible since I choose to keep them, Fishkeeping or having any pet is something we choose to do for our personal enjoyment and really nothing more than that. This is why we should be as ethical as possible because it is really just for our entertainment. Fish do not need us.

You are right. Fish actually do better in the wild than in a glass box. But we can make their time in aquariums a bit more suitable to their needs. I think we all are more attached to some fish than others. Just make their time here better now since they are in your care and not the enthusiastic girl down the street. (I hope that you know that my references to neighbors and people down the street were just examples and are not real people.)

 

[gypsydancer]

phoenixkiller . . . . Understand that respect is not mutually transferred, the fish could care less about his keeper. (Save for Discus, lol) . . . . . I would also add goldfish & bettas to this list. Mine are VERY attentive to my presence. Namaste, Gypsy

 

[gypsydancer]

I've seen posts, pro & con, on naming fish. I wonder if there is any correlation between being male or female on the desire to name fish. My son doesn't because every time he named one it died, so he stopped. I know he's lost fish since then, but he says he's not as attached to them when they don't have names.
Namaste,
Gypsy

 

[phoenixkiller]

You have to be kidding. So by this logic humans should not name cats, birds, dogs, or any other pet either. You are pretty much saying that a fish can live at best 3-4 years which is totally wrong. Some fish can live 10+ years. If you had a 10 year old fish your saying you WOULDNT be attatched to it? If i had a 10 year old fish i would i would be very attatched to it, an probably name him/her. You are lying to everyone if you say you have never named a fish. And, this means you must not name your dog either, just because it will die in 10-15 years doesnt at all mean that i wont name him just because of his unavoidable end. Yes, i will be devistated when that pet dies, but it doesnt matter because it lived a good life

What is the oldest livebearer you have owned? Hmm?

Yes, that's true, SOME fish live to be 10+ years old. I know a gourami that has lived for more than 8 years now. Koi and goldfish live for decades. But do ALL fish live that long? Of course not. The oldest livebearer I had was 5 years old when he died, and had lived through ich, gourami attacks, and a fungal infection. My brother loved that fish more than any other. It died, and we thought of that fish as greatly loved and cared for as my cats. But when a molly died a few days later, I didn't even notice. It does depend on how long it lives, you're right, but the more common fish really aren't the longest livers.

 

[gypsydancer]

I have never named a fish. When you name it, you get pretty attached to a single fish. Do you know what that is called? Stupid, on my part. Why? Even if that fish lived longer than the rest, most fish only live about 3-4 years in the aquarium. When it dies, (Like your son) you are devastated. Humans should not name fish.

Well, I have 58 bettas. It is just easier for me to keep records and remember what I may need to do with a certain tank, if the fish has a name. It's much easier than saying" the red betta needs water change and the blue betta needs a new plant etc. Especially when you may have multiples of a specific color. I see nothing "stupid" about it. It makes perfect sense. It also makes caring for my bettas easier. Maybe you should try not being so harsh with your choice of words when speaking in a PUBLIC forum. The moderator already removed one of your posts because of tone of voice. Try to lighten up and embrace other peoples ways of doing things and stop being so judgmental. You COULD scare off a less confident newbie with your words when a poster doesn't agree with YOUR philosophy. Just saying.
Namaste,
Gypsy

 

[Nu-Nu the eel]

What is the oldest livebearer you have owned? Hmm?

Yes, that's true, SOME fish live to be 10+ years old. I know a gourami that has lived for more than 8 years now. Koi and goldfish live for decades. But do ALL fish live that long? Of course not. The oldest livebearer I had was 5 years old when he died, and had lived through ich, gourami attacks, and a fungal infection. My brother loved that fish more than any other. It died, and we thought of that fish as greatly loved and cared for as my cats. But when a molly died a few days later, I didn't even notice. It does depend on how long it lives, you're right, but the more common fish really aren't the longest livers.

Why are you talking about livebearers? That was never even in the conversation. Even if your fish lives for 5 years it deserves a name and special care. I think yourprevious post about how it is just "stupid" to name fish is irrational and subjective. Please put more thought into your posts and dont be so sarcastic, you cant have a conversation that way.

 

[phoenixkiller]

Well, I have 58 bettas. It is just easier for me to keep records and remember what I may need to do with a certain tank, if the fish has a name. It's much easier than saying" the red betta needs water change and the blue betta needs a new plant etc. Especially when you may have multiples of a specific color. I see nothing "stupid" about it. It makes perfect sense. It also makes caring for my bettas easier. Maybe you should try not being so harsh with your choice of words when speaking in a PUBLIC forum. The moderator already removed one of your posts because of tone of voice. Try to lighten up and embrace other peoples ways of doing things and stop being so judgmental. You COULD scare off a less confident newbie with your words when a poster doesn't agree with YOUR philosophy. Just saying.
Namaste,
Gypsy

Ok, if I had 58 bettas, yes, I would name them. But only to keep them distinguished. I wouldn't think I would get attached to a single betta when I have 57 others to choose from.

 

[phoenixkiller]

Why are you talking about livebearers? That was never even in the conversation. Even if your fish lives for 5 years it deserves a name and special care. I think yourprevious post about how it is just "stupid" to name fish is irrational and subjective. Please put more thought into your posts and dont be so sarcastic, you cant have a conversation that way.

My bad, sorry I sounded rude! I don't mean to...

 

[Tetra1990]

I'm of the point of view, as this is my "hobby" and not so much as my pet. Now... That does not mean I don't become attached to some of my fish, and at the same time it does not mean I won't sell/trade that same attachment to try something new that may interest me.

For ex- I have kept many many SA cichlids. And currently have a 30g tank set up with a mated pair of cons. I am intensely thinking of selling my cons to maybe start up a brackish tank so I can eventually get a green spotted puffer.

Another ex- I have a bichir I have had roughly for 8months who I think is so cool... But... He's hogging a 55g tank to himself and I think I wanna try cons/FM's. So he may get sold too.

Now in both examples I gave, I do care for my fish well and are kinda attached to them, but this hobby and my time invested is to what best keeps ME... Interested and available to keep giving my best effort to provide to the needs of multiple tanks as well as fish.

I have lost year+ old fish due to reasons out of my hand ie-"winter power outages" I once lost a Jag cichlid. And all though it bummed me out for a day or two it gave me a reason to Learn and look up new fish. It's loss is the reason I have the most amazing Trimac now.

One thing is for sure I like changing things up in my tanks, I love learning about new species of fish and I'm always open to trying new things. I guess with this mentality and a great lfs which I sell back/trade with, I don't allow myself the time needed to properly get attached.

Might be why all my friends in the hobby refer to me as a "fish flipper"

Anyways just my point of view. I don't tend to sweat the way people treat or care about their fish. I just try to give my advice the best I can and they can take it or leave it.

Some people will act as if they don't care about any pet, fish/turtle/snake/dog/cat. And some act as if any of these listed are their baby's.

::shrugs:: peoples emotions are just as random/unpredictable as any fishes.

Agree. With your examples. I get attached to fish, but if I was going to get another fish and I had to rehome a current fish, it would be ok for me. I would just get attached to the new arrivals

 

[Laser]

Well, I have 58 bettas.
Gypsy

58 bettas, wow!

Naming a fish personally doesn't give me any more or less emotional attachment to it. I wouldn't name every fish that was part of a school of ten neon tetras for example. A name should mean something and applying arbitrary names to fish is silly, but if I'm watching a fish and it makes me think of something or someone I might name it.

 

[gypsydancer]

58 bettas, wow!

Naming a fish personally doesn't give me any more or less emotional attachment to it. I wouldn't name every fish that was part of a school of ten neon tetras for example. A name should mean something and applying arbitrary names to fish is silly, but if I'm watching a fish and it makes me think of something or someone I might name it.

Yes, my names are all based either on color or some sort of trait they display. I have a white and blue female crowntail whose name is "Jumper". I'm pretty sure you can figure out how she got her name.
Namaste,
Gypsy

 

[phoenixkiller]

Yes, my names are all based either on color or some sort of trait they display. I have a white and blue female crowntail whose name is "Jumper". I'm pretty sure you can figure out how she got her name.
Namaste,
Gypsy

Ooh, did she jump out of her tank once?

 

[gypsydancer]

No, she hovers at the top of the tank wiggling her trail as if she were a hummingbird. When I put my hand over the water she jumps up and takes food out of my fingers. She really loves doing this with the thawed bloodworms. She's a character. I had a female jump out shortly after I got into bettas, after that they ALL got glass tops.
Namaste,
Gypsy

 

[phoenixkiller]

No, she hovers at the top of the tank wiggling her trail as if she were a hummingbird. When I put my hand over the water she jumps up and takes food out of my fingers. She really loves doing this with the thawed bloodworms. She's a character. I had a female jump out shortly after I got into bettas, after that they ALL got glass tops.
Namaste,
Gypsy

Wow, I want a Betta like that!!

 

[Lotsofbabies]

EVERY LIVING CREATURE is entitled to a good life without abuse.

I name every single fish, because I've decided to keep them as pets and I am responsible for them. I am not a breeder or out to make a quick buck with them, thus my fish are my children as are my 2 doggies...

Pet store owners i.e. don't name their fish as they use them for business purposes.

Thus, to each their own.

I don't dislike pet store owners because they trade in animals, I respect them (mostly lol) for giving the rest of us a chance to enrich our lives with animals.

Even some fish have problems with liking their mates. Fantastic example is Bruce, my rainbow shark. I've been trying to teach him that fish are friends not food, but he couldn't care less! As long as he sees me lifting the lid of his tank and giving him food, he's happy all alone! And trust me, he knows when it's meal time! He'll follow my movements around his tank to come up and try to catch the flakes/pellets/food. So if after 12 years living with Bruce and his antics he should die, I will actually cry.

RESPECT other people's opinions and respect animals. And if you don't feel a loss for ANY dead animal *shrugs* that's your problem. I know what animals mean to Earth and myself and I will shed a tear for ANY dead animal.