Go Back   Aquarium Advice - Aquarium Forum Community > Saltwater and Reef > Saltwater Reef Aquaria
Click Here to Login

Join Aquarium Advice Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about them on AquariumAdvice.com
 
Old 09-21-2004, 07:06 PM   #1
Aquarium Advice Regular
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 68
how to get rid of red stuff

My tanbk is about 6 months old and all of a sudden last 2-3 weeks i am getting red stuff growing on the rock and sand . It looks ugly!!! My nitrates are 0 and all other test are ok. I think i have plently of flow 1 maxi 1200 and 1 maxi 900 in a 30 gallon tank. I siphon it out during a water change and in grows right back. What can i do ???

Thanks
Richard
__________________

__________________
rbarb1111 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2004, 07:35 PM   #2
JG
Aquarium Advice FINatic
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: New Hampshire
Posts: 727
I had the same problem in my daughter's tank. I switched the bulb out for ones that had less red spectrum and more blue. Within a couple of days - a noticeable difference.
__________________

__________________
You know you are a true fish-o-holic if you can field strip any powerhead on the market.
JG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2004, 08:48 PM   #3
Aquarium Advice FINatic
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Richmond, Va
Posts: 804
If its cyano it is a sign of excess nutrients in your tank. Your water flow sounds fine. Try frequent small water changes using RO or DI water, change old bulbs and make sure you are not overfeeding.
__________________
46g SW, 65 lbs Fiji LR, 4" Aragamax DSB, Coralife 2X96w CF, CPR Bakpak II, CPR Aquafuge 12 w/ 2x9 Coralife Mini Aqualight, 4 Maxijet 600's, PCI 200W Titanium Heater, 2 Blue Green Chromis, 1 Gold Bar Maroon Clown, 1 Purple-Stripe Dottyback, Finger Leather, Trumpets, Rose Coral Open-Brain, Pagoda Cup, Xenia, Star Polyps, Yellow Polyps, Various Mushrooms, Toadstool Leather, 12 Astraea, 10 Nassarius, 4 Bumble Bee, 6 Cerith Snails, 12 Red Tip Hermits.
phases99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-21-2004, 10:26 PM   #4
Aquarium Advice Activist
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: CA
Posts: 103
coraline algae?
__________________
piggybank2005 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-2004, 12:03 AM   #5
Aquarium Advice Activist
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Sydney Australia
Posts: 124
Send a message via Yahoo to melissfish
red spots

i have this too, but only since i added the blue light ( i only had white before) am i overdoing it with the reef supplement???
__________________
Happy Fishing!!
melissfish is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-2004, 01:08 AM   #6
Aquarium Advice Activist
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Corpus Christi, TX
Posts: 128
Might I make a suggestion or two in the form of a few questions?
Where are you getting your water from? Have you looked at your water under a scope with a Sedgwick-Rafter chamber? I would be curious to see what is colonizing your substratum. I can think of a few obvious culprits like the Cyanobacteria, but I have a couple of other culprits in mind that are a little more rotten. Have you noticed any fish behavior that might suggest a dissolved oxygen crash? This would be particularly noticable in the early morning hours and your DO concentrations would probably be less than 4 mg/L O2. Fish are obviously stressed at 4 mg/L and fish kills in natural systems are common at O2 levels below 1 mg/L. The strange thing about this is that it is easily explained. An algal bloom at the right time can cause DO levels to drop dramatically in natural waters. Algae shift to O2 respiration at night acording to a supposed Circadian rhythm. Once the light of day hits, they revert to photosynthesis.
Just my $0.05...was $0.02...****ed inflation...

EDIT: Are you using NSW as make up water? If so, where are you getting it? Is it oceanic or is it bay/estuarine?
__________________
"If you don't fish, you should..."
diverdown69 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-2004, 01:15 AM   #7
AA Team Emeritus
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 5,833
Send a message via Yahoo to quarryshark
Also you may want to check your PO4 level. it is notorious for feeding cyno. Check your source water for the same. A deionizer on your RO unit (if you have one) may be in order.
Also carefully siphon off you rock and substrate. It is not enough to break it up. In fact, this just helps it to spread.
__________________
quarryshark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-2004, 01:39 AM   #8
Aquarium Advice Activist
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Corpus Christi, TX
Posts: 128
Quote:
Originally Posted by quarryshark
Also you may want to check your PO4 level.
Yep...this one will cause an algal bloom in a natural system too.
Hmmm...got pics of the colonies? Microscopy would really help too.
__________________
"If you don't fish, you should..."
diverdown69 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-2004, 12:18 PM   #9
Aquarium Advice FINatic
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Indianapolis, IN
Posts: 852
Send a message via MSN to sumphead
It definately sounds like cyanobacteria when you mention siphoning it out and it returns. Quarryshark hit the nail on the head when he mentioned Phosphates. A six month old tank is still relatively young and "most" tank go through this type of problem at one point or another. Well planted refugiums help a great deal by eating up all the excessive dissolved organics before the nuisances get the chance. Also as mentioned above, you water source is a big issue. But from what I have read here the "reef supplements" you are adding is most likey your bingo. Depending on what you have in the tank additional supplements other than water changes is rarely necissary. Especially in a 30 Gallon tank where water changes of high percentaes is relatively easy. How is it stocked? If your fish stock is within normal limits and your calcium load is light (no stoney corals) then I point my finger at the supplement.

HTH,
R-
__________________
I wish I had a nickel for every miracle that you easily tricked me into. -Chris Robinson
sumphead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-2004, 02:36 PM   #10
Moderator Emeritus
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Indiana USA
Posts: 2,694
Good luck, I have been fighting cyano for about 3-4 months. I bought a RO/DI, have a fuge set up and it is flourishing, I have 3 maxi 1200's, a mag7 return and I just added a Seio 620. I should have pushing over 2000 gph on my 75 gal. I really hate having 4 PH's in the tank too!

I tested my PO4 last night and came up with 0.

I added a spray bar to my return to help spread the return flow out a bit. Now I have cyano growing on the back of the tank. I have tried phosguard too.

At this point I wonder if it is my skimmer. Don't know what I will do next.
__________________
ellisz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-2004, 08:36 PM   #11
Aquarium Advice FINatic
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Richmond, Va
Posts: 804
Quote:
Originally Posted by ellisz
I tested my PO4 last night and came up with 0.
I have heard that if the algae absorbs the phosphate as fast as it is created, your test results may never show a reading even though your tank is producing it. It makes sense, Phosphate test kits are more accurate if used to test your water source, not the tank.
__________________
46g SW, 65 lbs Fiji LR, 4" Aragamax DSB, Coralife 2X96w CF, CPR Bakpak II, CPR Aquafuge 12 w/ 2x9 Coralife Mini Aqualight, 4 Maxijet 600's, PCI 200W Titanium Heater, 2 Blue Green Chromis, 1 Gold Bar Maroon Clown, 1 Purple-Stripe Dottyback, Finger Leather, Trumpets, Rose Coral Open-Brain, Pagoda Cup, Xenia, Star Polyps, Yellow Polyps, Various Mushrooms, Toadstool Leather, 12 Astraea, 10 Nassarius, 4 Bumble Bee, 6 Cerith Snails, 12 Red Tip Hermits.
phases99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-2004, 09:03 PM   #12
Moderator Emeritus
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Indiana USA
Posts: 2,694
I have tested both before and have had minimal readings in the past. Dead spots in my tank always seems to be hit the hardest but I can't add any more PH's at this point.
__________________
*180 gal Display, 100 gal basement sump, 33 gal refugium, 3x250 MH, 2x160 VHO actinics, zoos, some softies, LPS & lots of acros and other SPS.
*100 gal prop tank plumbed into main system w/ 2x96 PC lights and 1x150 MH,
ellisz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-2004, 10:22 PM   #13
Aquarium Advice FINatic
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Indianapolis, IN
Posts: 852
Send a message via MSN to sumphead
Mike, you have to remember it isn't the "dead spots" causing the cyano. Powerheads and flow isn't a cure, just a symtom treatment. Like I posted above look into thing YOU introduce to the tank: Foods, supplements...

When you upgraded to halides, did it get any worse, better, or about the same?

What salinity/SG are you running? If you are running a bit on the low side, 1.021-.022 try pumping it up to .025 (slowly of course) and see what happens. Most nuisance algeas don't fare well in higher gravities.

Other things: Get a sea hair, clean daily for a month, chenge salts, drink more beer... I think I am trying to suggest finding someway to break the chain.

HTH,
R-

BTW, how have you been? LOL
__________________
I wish I had a nickel for every miracle that you easily tricked me into. -Chris Robinson
sumphead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-2004, 11:12 PM   #14
Moderator Emeritus
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Indiana USA
Posts: 2,694
LOL, been fine really

I did add 2 aquacultured conchs. SteveS had mentioned strombus snails will eat cyano and I believe these are of that family. Not sure if they are working though.

I would say it got a bit worse with the Halides. The PC bulbs I had before were approaching 10 months in service as well. Some parts have got better where other areas still get the same.

SG is 1.023 via a deepsix. I know my temps are higher since the MH. I hit 83.6 at the end of the day. I keep meaning to either try blowing air in vs out or swapping the bigger fans in I bought but that waould mean taking the top off the tank and I have not done it yet The tank is in the basement so room temp is pretty steady and cool.

I will keeping fighting the fight
__________________
*180 gal Display, 100 gal basement sump, 33 gal refugium, 3x250 MH, 2x160 VHO actinics, zoos, some softies, LPS & lots of acros and other SPS.
*100 gal prop tank plumbed into main system w/ 2x96 PC lights and 1x150 MH,
ellisz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2004, 10:24 AM   #15
steve-s
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by phases99
Quote:
Originally Posted by ellisz
I tested my PO4 last night and came up with 0.
I have heard that if the algae absorbs the phosphate as fast as it is created, your test results may never show a reading even though your tank is producing it. It makes sense, Phosphate test kits are more accurate if used to test your water source, not the tank.
Excellent point! The test kits will also not be able to detect organic PO4 which can be just as bad if not worse than what can be read by the test kit.

PO4 in whatever form is typically the main cause for cyano problems above all else. Eliminating them should be the first step in combating cyano. I would honestly suggest a non-aluminum based PO4 granular sponge at your next opportunity. It would need to be changed daily for the first few days and should not be left in long term. You should notice a difference before the end of the first week if it's working or not.

Salinity and temp will also play a role to some degree but moreso the temp. If you can get that heat down and keep the tank stable closer to 80¬į, it will help.

Cheers
Steve
__________________
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2004, 10:28 AM   #16
Aquarium Advice Activist
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Corpus Christi, TX
Posts: 128
If the test kits are unable to test for organic forms of PO4, then what sort of test would you recommend? Would a Hach or Lamotte kit be able to detect the PO4 in that form? I have access to a Hach 2010 spectro and the necessary reagents to test for just about anything under the sun...or the sea.
__________________
"If you don't fish, you should..."
diverdown69 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2004, 10:39 AM   #17
AA Team Emeritus
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 5,833
Send a message via Yahoo to quarryshark
eleminating PO4 does work. I spent the last couple of months attacking this problem and have eliminated it.
I first added a deioniozer to my RO unit, did weekly 15 gallon water changes with the improved water, siphoning everything I could get.
Upgraded to a monster skimmer.
Added some more LR (got a mantis as a bonus, just found him last night )
Added a couple of powerheads and ran a PO4 sponge every week until it was all but gone.
Changed or cleaned my polyfilter every 3-4 days.
Nice to be able to see my coraline again. Its a bit of work, but worth it.
__________________
quarryshark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2004, 10:49 AM   #18
steve-s
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by diverdown69
If the test kits are unable to test for organic forms of PO4, then what sort of test would you recommend?
There is no standard test kits you can get at the LFS or online that will read for organic PO4.

Quote:
Would a Hach or Lamotte kit be able to detect the PO4 in that form? I have access to a Hach 2010 spectro and the necessary reagents to test for just about anything under the sun...or the sea.
I think it should but I have never had the opportunity to try. I found >>this tidbit<< that might help, it's near the bottom of the page. >>This<< brief description of Phosphorous may also be useful.

Cheers
Steve
__________________
  Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2004, 11:22 AM   #19
Moderator Emeritus
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Indiana USA
Posts: 2,694
What sponge would you recommend? I have tried phosguard and no changes seem to be apparent. I have also read that cheap carbon can release phospahte back into the water. Is this true?
__________________
*180 gal Display, 100 gal basement sump, 33 gal refugium, 3x250 MH, 2x160 VHO actinics, zoos, some softies, LPS & lots of acros and other SPS.
*100 gal prop tank plumbed into main system w/ 2x96 PC lights and 1x150 MH,
ellisz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2004, 11:28 AM   #20
Aquarium Advice Activist
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Corpus Christi, TX
Posts: 128
Cool page! The one describing the different methodologies is great. One of my first research projects involved membrane filtration of NSW and microbiological media looking for Enterococcus in beach waters. The methodology for fecal coliform and Enterococcus is different only in the growth media used and the verification techniques.
I may get a sample of my tank water and bring it here tomorrow so I can run a spectro test for PO4. I have never seen the one that they are describing. The ones I have used recently use the PhosVer powder pillows and the spectro as a means of quantifying the PO4 load in the water. It doesn't involve boiling the sample or anything like that. If I get the chance to run a sample, I'll post up results and detection limits of the test I use. It is an all-in-one PO4 test that will look for orthophosphate (P2O5) and standard PO4 in oxidized and reduced forms.
__________________

__________________
"If you don't fish, you should..."
diverdown69 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about them on AquariumAdvice.com

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Some small stuff to get rid of fishb0ne Archive 0 09-18-2007 01:57 PM
red stuff on everything bapski Freshwater & Brackish - General Discussion 3 04-07-2006 10:52 AM
Best way to rid your tank of RED SLIME? Pics Enclosed gump3842k Saltwater Reef Aquaria 2 08-09-2004 01:18 PM
What is this red stuff and white stuff dwarr1088 Saltwater & Reef - Identification 3 01-19-2004 05:01 PM







» Photo Contest Winners







All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:22 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.