Crab acting strange

[Gauge]

I have an arrow crab, and he is laying down on his side with this legs kind of curled up in a ball. I've never seen them molting, but I've also never seen one dead. Which do you think is the case?

 

[Gauge]

Just FYI, I'm not at home looking at him. My wife described what he looks like. Apparently he's still moving, but he's not getting up. She's sending me a picture, and I'll post it as soon as I get it.

 

[Gauge]

Here is the picture... hopefully it'll upload. I usually have trouble with it.

 

[steve-s]

This is since all the drastic changes you described yesterday, correct?

Most likley one or more of these changes has upset the balance or introduced a contaminant. I would suggest running through the normal tests when you get home and if nothing "odd" shows up do a 10-15% water change and run some carbon to remove any "unseen" chemicals. I would also suggest a water conditioner added (normal amounts) to the tank to neutralize any possible metals or other contaminates.

I would also still highly recommend that you reconsider returning the inverts until you have everything under control... :?

Cheers
Steve

 

[Gauge]

Well, I did all those changes last night, and everything seemed fine. I did about 19 out of the 20 gallons of water change. I had a gallon left over which I kept in the same container last night because my filter holds about that much. When I put the filter back on I put the last bit of water in, and 10 minutes later this happened. I thought I'd done quite enough to get the bleach out of the filter (I assume you read that part already in my other thread), but maybe the water caused it. Still, 1 gallon in a 42 gallon tank when the only possible differences between last night and today as far as the change water is concerned is temp and PH.

I don't have anything to put the inverts in at the moment. My QT tank was taken down.

 

[Gauge]

Oh, and couple other things...

First, I already have a bag of carbon in there. I thought it would be a good idea since I'm trying to start the tank from scratch anyhow. Plus, after using that bleach, there's no telling.

Second, what is a water conditioner? Never heard of such a thing, or used it. The water *should* be clean. It's RO water, after all, and was mixed in a freshly bought rubbermaid container in which I haven't had anything else.

 

[steve-s]

A water conditioner is used to neutralize chlorine, chloramine and some help with toxic metals. If one of these was not used to counteract the bleach, then it has most likely leached into the tank when the filter was placed back on.

Changing 50% af the water can be a concern if proper temp, salinity and PH where not exactly matched. Inverts are increadibley sensitive to these kinds of changes. Adverse effects may not be immediately appearant but can cause the problem(s) you describe.

I would still recommend running the tests when you get home.

Cheers
Steve

 

[Gauge]

There were a few cups worth of water left, and I went home earlier. I noticed a couple things about the water. First of all, the PH was about 0.3 lower than the tank water. I flat forgot about that part. The other part was that there were white specks floating in it. Now, last night when I changed the bulk of the water, my tank looked like a snow globe. I was wondering why the "sand" (which I assume it wasn't) wouldn't sink quicker than that. I didn't think much more of it, but today the same thing happened when I put a gallon of water in. I still wasn't sure it was the change water. When I did the PH test I saw the junk floating in the water. Any idea what that could be? I'm sure the container was clean. I'd just bought it, and it was sitting upside down on the shelf.

 

[steve-s]

The only thing that comes to mind by your description is calcium carbonate precipitate.

Was anything added to the RO water when you where preparing the water change other than saltmix?

Cheers
Steve

 

[Gauge]

Nope, just synthetic sea salt, and that's all. Just poured it in, threw a PH in the tub and was done with it. Other than that, the only thing that should have gone in was dust settling on the surface of the water or something.

What is calcium carbonate precipitate, what causes its presence in water, and what does it do to your tank inhabitants?


Oh, and small update on the crisis... the crab is dead (or close enough to count as dead). The corals all "snotted" for a few minutes, but they stopped and are open and normal looking. All the other crabs are accounted for and okay with the exception of an emerald crab who's always hard to find. I have a Red Bali Sea Star who has some snot-looking material on him, and I'm not sure what that means, but otherwise he is acting normal.

 

[Gauge]

And another question...

I've always wondered about this, and now is a little late to ask, but oh well. My arrow crab used to sort of "unhinge" his outer shell near his anus, and he would sort of pick at himself with his pincers. Is this normal? What is (*ahem* was) he doing?

 

[Hara]

sounds like undisolved salt..

 

[Gauge]

Well, it didn't quite look like that. It was a bit too bright white to be salt, I think. I could be wrong, though. How could be undisolved after 3 days, though?

 

[Gauge]

I'm home now. I just looked at the tank, and the corals aren't terribly happy. They're open and not "snotting," but they're not open all the way. That white junk settled all over the rock. I swirled my hand around over it a bit and stirred it up again. It's definitely not salt. At the very least it's salt that's disolved, dried, and then disolved again, because it's not in granular shape. They look like really small flakes of some kind.

 

[steve-s]

What is calcium carbonate precipitate, what causes its presence in water, and what does it do to your tank inhabitants?

In most cases it just makes a mess and will often affect the operating efficiency of pumps and other moving equipment that give off heat. It shouldn't really harm anything else unless the precipitate was very heavy.

Precipitate is basically when the calcium in the water reach's too high a concentration and literally falls out of solution almost like snowing. By the sounds of the reply post I am wondering if it might not just be the salt mix or preparation instead.

The corals all "snotted" for a few minutes, but they stopped and are open and normal looking. All the other crabs are accounted for and okay with the exception of an emerald crab who's always hard to find. I have a Red Bali Sea Star who has some snot-looking material on him, and I'm not sure what that means, but otherwise he is acting normal.

With such a large water change the corals (which I didn't know you had) are showing distress to such a drastic change in their environment. If will usually be short lived unless something is askew. The "slime" hanging on the start is most likely a string of nematocysts a coral may have cast off. If there is no other discoloration or sign of necrosis, it should be fine.

What types of corals are in the tank and how long have you had them?

Cheers
Steve

 

[Gauge]

I picked up the red bali star and cleaned him off. He's just fine. I think the slime stuff was from a coral like you said. That white stuff still hasn't disolved into the water. The salinity in the tank is 1.021 or thereabouts. Is there any way it could *still* be undisolved salt? It certainly doesn't look like it. Very opaque white, it's flakey, it's light (doesn't sink quickly at all).

As far as me not mentioning the corals, it's because I don't really care about them. They just came on the rock as a kind of free bonus. I use them to gauge how well things are doing in the tank (at the recommendation of others), but other than that, they don't concern me in the least. Everything seems to be back to normal. I believe my arrow crab was having a bad time before this anyway. He was getting sluggish. He stopped picking food off the substrate and spent most of his time hunkered down between a couple of rocks. This was probably just the proverbial straw that broke the camel's back. I wouldn't really know, but that's my theory anyway.

Thank you all for your help. I really appreciate it. If you have any more information on the white stuff, I'd love to hear it.

 

[ReefLady]

The salinity in the tank is 1.021 or thereabouts.

That salinity is not going to cut it for invertebrates and/or corals. You want at least 1.024 - 1.025 is better. But raise it slowly - gradually, over the course of a couple weeks.

As far as me not mentioning the corals, it's because I don't really care about them.

 

[Hara]

As far as me not mentioning the corals, it's because I don't really care about them.

Thats a horrid thing to say and I, for one, cannot abide to help someone with so little disregard for life. Lucky for you, there are other people here that will help you.

 

[Gauge]

Saying that I don't care about them doesn't mean "Hey, let's kill them." It means I didn't buy them intentionally. The focus of the tank is the fish, not the corals. I'm sorry if you took it that way.

 

[reefrunner69]

Something you got to understand, saying you don't care about living corals in your tank here, is like going to a dog board and saying you don't swerve to miss a stray dog, simply cause it wasn't your dog. I can understand the focus of the tank is the fish, but if you have some animals in the tank, you should strive to provide a proper environment. Frankly, I've gotten the impression that fish are a disposable pet, in your eyes. You will find that that attitude is not real popular amoung most hobbyists these days. I hope you get the problems with your tank solved, I for one will continue to try to help you, but I think everyone needs to take a step back and take a few breaths right now.