Fins stuck to body of severum - also question on KH and GH

[spiritskr]

Hello all,

Seems I have a new problem. I just noticed several of my severum look like their fins are stuck to their bodies. I have never seen this before.
I also did a KH and GH test, the numbers are:
KH 143.2 PPM
GH 248.9 PPM
The GH numbers appear kind of high to me, but I am not sure.
They still seem lethargic after I raised the PH to 7.0 from 6.2. They are still eating good.
I was reading that if I put de-ionized water in the tank it would lower the KH in the water. I am confused. Is de-ionized water the same as distilled water? Should I even do anything at this point?

Thanks,

Gary

 

[BrianNY]

Hi Gary, I used to keep severum. They were one of my favorite fish.

A couple of questions? How many fish, how large are they, and in what size tank, has the tank been cycled?

Your KH and GH numbers seem a little whacky. Here's what I'd do. Take a jar of aquarium water to your lfs and ask them to test for GH, KH, ammonia, nitrites, and nitrates. I think the fish are stressed and you need to find the cause before making any drastic changes.

 

[spiritskr]

Hi Brian,

I had 4 severum, unfortuantely they all died yesterday. After I took them out, and buried them, I did a 30%water change. About a month ago they all had ich, so I am thinking that they never fully recovered from that. It was a pretty bad outbreak, I have since raised my water temp to 83 degrees.
I have a 30 gallon tank with 3 parrot-fish, a tin-foil, 2 half inch cat-fishes.and 2 pleckos left. I am thinking about getting more severum, as I really enjoyed them

Gary

 

[TankGirl]

That is terrible to lose all 4 severum! I am very sorry to hear that.

I would definitely want to know the ammonia, nitrIte and nitrAte levels when the fish have their fins clamped. Anytime you see that, regardless of the cause, you will want to do a partial water change to dilute the effects of whatever is going on in the water. I will amend that to say that, in general, partial water changes are called for in just about any treatment regimen, for a wide variety of problems/ailments.

Good luck, and post back once you get things rolling again.

 

[spiritskr]

Thanks tankgirl.

I did a 30% water change. I also am running my diatom. I checked the ph levels and they were off the chart. Somewhere around 8. Lat time I checked they were in the 7 range. I think I might have caused the problem. Last week the ph dropped to 6.2 and I raised it to 7.0 in a 6-8 hour window. Yesterday my severum died, and I checked the ph level, and it jumped to almost 8. I put in ph neutrelizer, and it is down to around 7.2. I am hoping my parrot-fish dont die. I have 3 of them. My wife and 2 kids went out and bought them, I told them I was against it as they are cross-bred, and have deformities. But, now that we got them I am taking very good care of them. (hopefully).
I want to get more severum, as they are enjoyable fish. But I will wait until everything in the aquarium settles down.

 

[Kerrinne]

Anytime you see that, regardless of the cause, you will want to do a partial water change to dilute the effects of whatever is going on in the water. I will amend that to say that, in general, partial water changes are called for in just about any treatment regimen, for a wide variety of problems/ailments.

You know, that seems like the main lesson I have picked up from this board. When in doubt (and if you don't have meds in the tank), do a water change first! LOL I'm finally down to changing 25% water once every four days, slowly pushing out to once a week since parameters seem to be holding mostly steady. It is to my daughter's dismay though as she does enjoy helping mommy use the gravel vac to suck out the water.

 

[BrianNY]

Changing water has so many benefits.

Gary, get your water checked. Do some salt therapy on the tank. And get yourself some more Severum

 

[spiritskr]

severum dying

I have checked the water, and everything comes up normal. The ph level is normal, the nitrites are normal the ammonia is normal. Today I lost 2 of my parrot-fish, and the 3rd one is on its way out. It is heart-wrenching to see them die, and know there is nothing I can do about it.

 

[TankGirl]

Well, there is normal and there is normal. It would be helpful to know exactly what your ammonia, nitrites, nitrates and pH are measuring. The fluctuations in pH are quite difficult for fish to tolerate, so that could be the entire thing. I think they will do fine in a relatively broad pH range, but changing it up and down is what will do them in. It may be best to leave your tap water alone and acclimate the fish to that, so there is not such a fluctuation.

Post back with your water parameters and maybe there is a solution we can find.

 

[spiritskr]

Fish problems

Hi,

Just brought a sample to the fish store (absolutely fish) what a great store. Turns out my nitrite levels were off the chart. My ammonia levels were a little high. As soon as I told the guy the fish looked like they were having problems breathing he suspected high nitrite levels. My test kit was bad, it was showing me normal readings. They had some pwdered stuff that they use on their marine tanks. He was going to give me something called bioflora(?), but they were all out of it. He told me to do a 50% water change every 2 days.
It also appears that I had the tank over-stocked. I thought it was one inch of fish for every gallon of water. He explained to me that it is only small skinny fish that, that rule applies to. If you have big fish (severum, parrot fish) they count for a couple of fish, as many as 5. From now on I am going to stick to small community fish,

 

[TankGirl]

Well now! That sounds like some good advice you have received. I think he wanted to give you some Bio-Spira (well, not GIVE, it is kinda pricey.. ) and that is probably what I would do, and have done when I have had a mini cycle. You lost some of the good bacteria that keep your ammonia zero (that is the only normal value for ammonia) and nitrite zero (ditto). You will show some nitrates when you have a cycled tank, and generally you do your water changes to keep nitrates at under 40ppm, or less depending upon your tank. That is the information I was looking for. The Bio-Spira is the actual bacteria that keep a tank cycled.

However, partial water changes will save the fish. You need to get fresh test kits, if you did not already, for ammonia, nitrite and nitrate. You should never have any measurable levels of the first two, and low levels of the third. Water changes are the way to control that, and that is the "secret" to fishkeeping!

It may take a couple of weeks (hopefully less) to get this under control, and if you are patient it will resolve. I must smack myself for not paying attention to your stocking levels. If the plecos are common plecos, what most LFS carry, then even one is almost pushing it for that size tank. Maybe if you return the plecos (not sure what the half-inch catfish are, and how big they will get) you could get more severum - I believe they are relatively peaceful, so maybe you could get a pair, but severum keepers please help me out here! I think if you like severum, which you obviously do, then you should have severum.

(I get so excited when a mystery is solved...)

 

[BrianNY]

Hi Gary, I agree with everything Tankgirl told you. And your fish load was huge for that size tank.

Severum can get big. Mine were over 6 inches. Plus, being cichlids they are messy eaters and produce a lot of waste. That makes gravel vacs and water changes a must.

I think you've gained some valuable experience here. Don't give up on keeping any fish you want to. Just know a little more about the fishes basic habits and needs. Good Luck.

Brian

 

[Allivymar]

*nods and agrees*

This is what we were telling you in your "lethargic fish" post, both in terms of bio-load, adult fish size and water parameter problems. I'm glad the lfs is willing to take the tinfoil; some places won't take fish from the public (Petsmart is one).

You don't have to just have small community fish. You also mentioned in that post you have a 55g packed away. You might want to consider small community fish for the current tank, and a larger fish for the 55g. But I strongly suggest researching the fish you chose, and then popping on here for some opinions/personal experiences so you can avoid the probs you are having now.

And yeah, that 1 inch = 1 gallon rule is an old wives tale. It doesn't take into account adult size, bio-load, temperament, required swimming space, etc. For example, 10 inches of neon would work well in a 10g tank; a 10 inch oscar certainly would not. I think many of us went by that rule when we first started, not knowing any better. *grin* is why the internet is such a great place to learn; I'd have never known my common plec was going to be 2 feet long as an adult if I hadn't gotten online when he put on 3 inches in 4 months and I realised something was wrong LOL