So I just got my cousins 20g fish tank with 4 little jewel cichlids he caught from a pond. He barely did water changes ever and fed them every 4 days. He says there almost indestructible lol. My question is, I tested this waters ammonia and it's maxed out.. 8ppm max reading and the fish are doing just fine. Is that even possible that the fish adapted to it??
Fish ammonia
- Thread starter bulatz
- Start date
The friendliest place on the web for anyone with an interest in aquariums or fish keeping!
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
No. There are a few possibilities why they arent showing any effects.
1. Its possible that the cycle got disrupted somehow when you took possession of the tank and ammonia is now showing up where it was ammonia free before. Or something got disturbed and released ammonia into the water. They might not be showing issues now, but high levels of ammonia can be toxic, taking account of point number 2 however.
2. Ammonia comes in 2 different forms. Free ammonia and ammonium. Its only free ammonia that is toxic. Your test kit detects total ammonia nitrogen (TAN) which is free ammonia + ammonium combined. The proportion of free ammonia to ammonium in your detected TAN is dependant on pH and temperature. If the water is acidic or the water is colder, more of the TAN is ammonium and less toxic. If the pH or temperature increases ammonium turns to free ammonia and your water gets more toxic. The upshot is that if the water pH is below 7 TAN is pretty much only ammonium with very little free ammonia and non-toxic to fish. Do you know the pH and temperature?
Here is a more in depth thread on ammonia toxicity.
https://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums/f12/your-guide-to-ammonia-toxicity-159994.html
1. Its possible that the cycle got disrupted somehow when you took possession of the tank and ammonia is now showing up where it was ammonia free before. Or something got disturbed and released ammonia into the water. They might not be showing issues now, but high levels of ammonia can be toxic, taking account of point number 2 however.
2. Ammonia comes in 2 different forms. Free ammonia and ammonium. Its only free ammonia that is toxic. Your test kit detects total ammonia nitrogen (TAN) which is free ammonia + ammonium combined. The proportion of free ammonia to ammonium in your detected TAN is dependant on pH and temperature. If the water is acidic or the water is colder, more of the TAN is ammonium and less toxic. If the pH or temperature increases ammonium turns to free ammonia and your water gets more toxic. The upshot is that if the water pH is below 7 TAN is pretty much only ammonium with very little free ammonia and non-toxic to fish. Do you know the pH and temperature?
Here is a more in depth thread on ammonia toxicity.
https://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums/f12/your-guide-to-ammonia-toxicity-159994.html
Andy Sager
Aquarium Advice Addict
It will all depend on what your Ph level is. Under 6.8, the toxic ammonia is naturally converted to Ammonium which is non toxic to the fish. There are areas in S. America with water so acidic that it burns the human skin ( according to an old boss who was there collecting fish) and it was filled with fish like Discus and Angelfish.
So we'd need to see your readings before you can say they adapted.
Well I live in florida ph is about 7.7-8ph the temp in my 75g is always about 80f and its still cool to the touch and my cousins tank I've acquired has no temp readings, has a heater but is pretty warm to the touch. I'm sure 75g vs 20g sticking finger in there for temp feeling might be different if I had to guess my cousin had his tank mid 80s ferenheit which I think is pretty high.
I'll post a pic.
These fish I don't really care for them but I don't think anyone would want them they got no color or anything very plain. I will still try my best to keep them alive and well
I'll post a pic.
These fish I don't really care for them but I don't think anyone would want them they got no color or anything very plain. I will still try my best to keep them alive and well
Andy Sager
Aquarium Advice Addict
Too many guesses here. I lived in S. Florida and had very hard alkaline water down there but get enough nitrates in the water and the Ph drops like a lead balloon. Now in Central FL, my water is soft but still alkaline so the Ph falls if I don't do routine water changes.
Get yourself a thermometer and if you don't want to get a good liquid test kit, have some of your water tested at your local pet shop so we know what we are dealing with. Jewels are called jewels because they have some nice color to them. Your ammonia or low Ph could be why they are not coloring up?
Get yourself a thermometer and if you don't want to get a good liquid test kit, have some of your water tested at your local pet shop so we know what we are dealing with. Jewels are called jewels because they have some nice color to them. Your ammonia or low Ph could be why they are not coloring up?
The nitrogen cycle takes the ammonia in the water and turns it into nitrate. To do this it needs oxygen and carbonate hardness (KH). In addition to being needed for the nitrogen cycle to function, KH also protects your aquarium from pH swings by absorbing acid. This is called buffering. Once the KH in the water runs out, 2 things happen. The nitrogen cycle stops working and you start to see ammonia in the water, and there is no buffering so your pH can start to fluctuate. One of the reasons you do water changes is to replenish KH so it doesnt run out.
The natural processes in an aquarium tend to acidify the water. Nitrate in the water forms nitric acid. Fish respiration puts carbon dioxide into the water which when disolved forms carbonic acid. If their is sufficient buffering this acid gets absorbed and you see little sign of these acids. Once the buffering is gone, your water can become acidic quite quickly.
The flip side of this is that ammonia in acidic water is mostly ammonium and non toxic. So despite the nitrogen cycle ceasing to function and you starting to see ammonia build up the fish will be fine. This is commonly called old tank syndrome, where people generally get lazy with tank maintenance after a while, dont keep up with water changes, and there is a degrading of water quality. But you see no signs of this due to the nature of ammonia toxicity.
What you have to be careful of is then jumping right in and getting on top of your water maintenance. You do a big water change, ammonia goes down, but the water change also replenishes the KH. With buffering now in the water the acidity gets absorbed, pH rises. The ammonia left over becomes toxic free ammonia and you see effects in the fish. Smaller, more frequent water changes are better than bigger ones so you dont see this sudden leap in ammonia toxicity. Products that deal with ammonia toxicity can also help when you start to get on top of water maintenance too.
The natural processes in an aquarium tend to acidify the water. Nitrate in the water forms nitric acid. Fish respiration puts carbon dioxide into the water which when disolved forms carbonic acid. If their is sufficient buffering this acid gets absorbed and you see little sign of these acids. Once the buffering is gone, your water can become acidic quite quickly.
The flip side of this is that ammonia in acidic water is mostly ammonium and non toxic. So despite the nitrogen cycle ceasing to function and you starting to see ammonia build up the fish will be fine. This is commonly called old tank syndrome, where people generally get lazy with tank maintenance after a while, dont keep up with water changes, and there is a degrading of water quality. But you see no signs of this due to the nature of ammonia toxicity.
What you have to be careful of is then jumping right in and getting on top of your water maintenance. You do a big water change, ammonia goes down, but the water change also replenishes the KH. With buffering now in the water the acidity gets absorbed, pH rises. The ammonia left over becomes toxic free ammonia and you see effects in the fish. Smaller, more frequent water changes are better than bigger ones so you dont see this sudden leap in ammonia toxicity. Products that deal with ammonia toxicity can also help when you start to get on top of water maintenance too.
Thanks, the fish seem to be doing fine I just continue to do small daily water changes and I've been putting a little aquarium salt in there for the jewel cichlids. I see my sponge filter I put in there is pretty dirty/brown in less than a week so might do a little something with that. Putting also a little bit of substrate from my established tank in there to get some good bacteria in there. Should get it all sorted I imagine in a week or 2 I was worried about the fish but they seem to be doing just fine
Andy Sager
Aquarium Advice Addict
It's still a good idea to find out WHY the fish are doing what they are doing. If the issue is low Ph, that helps with ammonia but if you add too much high Ph water that changes the Ph level above 7.0, your fish are screwed.
Similar threads
