My otocinclus (otto catfish) is missing part of his fin.

[kayladc]

Hello, I noticed last week that one of my ottos is missing part of his caudal (back) fin and possibly part of his dorsal (top) fin.
He (Solomon) is much skinnier than my other otto, Kirby, though I'm not sure if that is relevant.
I don't think the missing fin is due to fin rot, but I'm not certain.
Since Kirby is larger than Solomon, in width, depth, and length (even though they were both the same size when I got them four months ago), I'm wondering if maybe Kirby is a bully and is eating Solomon's fins?
I have never seen them be hostile or even chase each other around, but maybe they could secretly be enemies?

They live in a 10 gallon, 80 degree, cycled tank, with a filter (carbon and sponge) set on low, and a muffler on the filter to lower water movement. They currently live alone. (I bought them to keep my betta company, but my betta seems to prefer living in a 5 gallon, bare, unfiltered tank for some reason (every time he's in the 10 gallon, decorated, cycled tank his fins start to disappear - this happened far before I got the ottos. My betta has spent his life in and out of quarantine. Any ideas as to why he prefers the 5gal bare, unfiltered, uncycled tank would be appreciated, too.)
The ammonia and nitrite readings are 0ppm, the nitrate reading never gets over 5ppm, and the pH is always a solid 7.6.
Algae does not grow in my tank, so I feed them a piece of organic romaine lettuce twice a week (put a piece in and keep it there for three nights, skip two nights, repeat) (they will ONLY eat organic romaine lettuce. I kid you not. I tried buying regular romaine and they would not touch it. I've tried iceberg lettuce, zucchini, different cabbages, etc. and they will only eat Whole Foods organic romaine - yes, they're even particular about the supplier! Haha.) --if I need to feed them something else, please let me know and I'll try.
I do water changes every time I take a leaf out, so about twice a week, siphoning the poop from the gravel and doing about a 35% water change each time. And I use Prime to treat the new water.
I have had Solomon and Kirby since early November, 2014.

Attached are pictures of both Solomon and Kirby. Solomon is the skinnier fish with his tail missing (the first two pics). Kirby is the fatty (last two pics).

 

[serena00]

Interesting, my ottos love each other. And are growing equally the same. I would say it has to do with the lack of algae. Lettuce is not a full diet for them.

 

[kayladc]

Thank you, but that doesn't really help me.
If the fin loss is due to improper diet, why is one otto fat and the other one normal-sized? Wouldn't they both be normal-sized or skinny?
Furthermore, what can I do to help re-grow Solomon's fin, as that's what I'm really worried about?
Thanks.

(I just realized that I have two accounts on this site, sorry)

 

[serena00]

One could possibly be bloated from poor diet... But this is just my guess. I would use melafix for the fins

 

[stooker]

Otos would be more comfortable in a larger group. They also like to constantly graze, so your 3-on/2-off schedule might be part of the problem. Recommend getting algae wafers and/or growing your own algae for a comprehensive diet, not sure if romaine is enough.

I haven't heard about otos attacking each other, maybe your feeding schedule and food selection is contributing to it.

 

[kayladc]

So I should just use algae wafers to feed them?
What should I do to help heal his fins? They seem to have gotten worse and I'm afraid to use salt as I've heard that ottos are sensitive to salt. I also don't want to use melafix because I have only heard bad things about it, but I feel like I should do something.

 

[Coursair]

Weird. Otos do best in groups. Single Otos often waste away. They are NEVER aggressive IME. I have lots of live plants for mine. But their favorite is Repashy gel food. Do you have any driftwood in the tank ?

80f is a little hot. The warmer the water the less oxygen in it. If you can, I would very gradually drop the temperature down to about 76 to 78°F.

I have no idea why your Oto is missing part of its fin. At first I thought maybe one of your Otos was not an Oto but from your pictures that is not the case.

A pump oto may just be Gravid.
My gravid female.


I would go ahead and turn the filter flow back up a little bit that will also help oxygenate the water.

This is the jungle my 4 Otos lived in.
http://youtu.be/aptmdICahvM

25-50% PWCs weekly


Sent from my iPhone using Aquarium Advice

 

[kayladc]

I bought some algae wafers on Saturday and both of my otos have round bellies now, so they're not pregnant.
But the round belly is normal? Because they look like they're bloated.

I'm lowering the temperature to 76 degrees. Right now it's at 78 degrees.

I still don't know what to do about Solomon's fin, though. One of the forks in it it at his body. I would really like to know how to help him grow the fin back - with specifics about what medication, what dosage, how often, should I quarantine, etc.

Can someone please help with the original question?

 

[absolutangel04]

Fins generally grow back in clean water. No need to medicate unless it is a serious issue. It doesn't sound serious at this point. Just stay on top of your water changes and keep everything clean and it should grow back. It may have snagged on something, caught while swimming, or just gotten a bit of bacteria working on it because of a lowered immune system from stress (associated with the skinniness)I doubt your trouble has anything to do with bullying. As was said, otos just aren't like that. I am not saying it is impossible, but I am saying I find it highly unlikely. There is not really any way for us to know what happened to it, but give it time and clean water and it should heal up just fine.
I think that your skinny oto got skinny because of an insufficient diet. It sounds like you are working to fix that, so that is good. Honestly, your chunkier oto may have been gravid or else may have just been a faster eater. Otos eat the biofilm in the tank as well as certain forms of visible algae. A 10g tank does not usually make enuogh to feed many otos and they need additional food. They also can be picky and you are definitely not the first person to have trouble with them taking veggies or other sorts of prepared food. They can be finicky, some more than others. Lots of otos are wonderful and hardy and have no issues. Some are more sensitive. They are pretty much all wild caught, and not all of them make the transition well. With some TLC, hopefully yours will be fine.
Post some pics of their bellies now so we can see if they are bloated if you can.

 

[kayladc]

When you say "may have been gravid", you mean pregnant, right? If Kirby is a she and is pregnant, will I soon see baby otos?

I am attempting to grow an algae farm. I got a clear container with a clear lid, filled it with tank water and rinsed the filter in it, put some rocks in it, and have it in the sun, so hopefully I will get some real algae for them soon.
In the meantime I am using algae wafers, but don't really know how to. I broke a wafer in half and put it in the tank yesterday. Do I just let the wafer dissolve (as it seems to be doing), or do I take it out and put in a new wafer? Should I change the wafers daily? The bag says to leave them in for a few minutes and then take them out, but then the otos couldn't eat whenever they want to, so I don't know what to do.

I'll post new pictures as soon as I can. Right now they're both laying around, where I can't get a good angle on them. Solomon's tail looks worse, though...

 

[absolutangel04]

When you say "may have been gravid", you mean pregnant, right? If Kirby is a she and is pregnant, will I soon see baby otos?

I am attempting to grow an algae farm. I got a clear container with a clear lid, filled it with tank water and rinsed the filter in it, put some rocks in it, and have it in the sun, so hopefully I will get some real algae for them soon.
In the meantime I am using algae wafers, but don't really know how to. I broke a wafer in half and put it in the tank yesterday. Do I just let the wafer dissolve (as it seems to be doing), or do I take it out and put in a new wafer? Should I change the wafers daily? The bag says to leave them in for a few minutes and then take them out, but then the otos couldn't eat whenever they want to, so I don't know what to do.

I'll post new pictures as soon as I can. Right now they're both laying around, where I can't get a good angle on them. Solomon's tail looks worse, though...

Gravid means, "full of eggs." Females can deposit the eggs and the male can fertilize them after that. So, it is technically different from "pregnant" on a biological standpoint. Though, essentially that is what we are getting at.
Do you have a test kit to check your water parameters? That would help us know your best course of action. For now, up your water changes. When in a doubt, a big pwc (like 50%) is always a good first course of action. Also, get pictures when you can. I know fish don't always cooperate with that part though. What do you mean by worse? More splits? Is that one split further down the fin?
Do your fish seem more comfortable eating at night? If so, go ahead and put in the water at night and leave it over night. It will dissolve some and gunk up your water. You will have to vacuum the gravel more. But, the fish need to eat! You can take it out if the wafer has been in there for a day and gotten too icky and replace it with a new the next night. I suppose that depends on exactly how much is left and its condition. Make your best judgement call. Definitely feel free to also keep feeding the lettuce (or trying other veggies) as a supplement as well sometime.

 

[kayladc]

The things I don't know. Haha. How interesting. I kind of hope she doesn't lay eggs. I won't know what to do with baby otos and I'll feel badly if they die.

I have the wafer in a weighed down plastic bowl, so that the mess stays localized, but i will definitely start changing the wafers at night. They seem to eat fine during the day, but I'm sure they're more comfortable/active at night, so that might help.

I have an API master kit and test the water weekly. Last night the water had 0ppm ammonia, 0ppm nitrite, 5ppm nitrate, and a 7.6pH. I then did a 40-45% water change, which I do at least once every week (I always want perfect water with 0ppm nitrate, though that rarely seems possible).

Attached are the picture of Solomon's fin from a few days ago, a picture of Solomon's fin now, and a picture of Kirby's belly. Solomon's belly looks like Kirby's, if you can't tell from his profile.

 

[absolutangel04]

Otos don't usually successfully reproduce in captivity, so you will not likely need to worry. It has certainly been known to happen, but it is not the norm. Thus, the wild capture.
In a cycled tank, you really won't routinely get 0 nitrates unless you are have lots of plants. Nitrate is the end of the line in the nitrogen cycle, and must be removed by plants or water changes typically. Your occasional measure of 0 are probably more realistically "close to zero" and the result of your aggressive water changes and even that is really only possible because of your minimal bioload. Nothing wrong with that though! Glad you are keeping on top of the parameters.
He seems to have a bit of fin rot. I apologize, I missed that in the first picture. From the angle, I thought it was just shadow. My guess is that it is secondary to his skinniness issue. Since you already have wonderfully clean water, I think you can move to the next step with is treating with an antibtioic for gram negative bacteria. Lots of people use Melafix. I don't. I would look for maracyn 2 or tetracycline or something similar that treats gram negative bacteria. Honestly, from the pictures the tail looks the same to me. But, you are obviously the better judge since you are the one seeing it in real life. If you would prefer, you could also try dosing with salt. Honestly, the "how" is up to you and what you prefer and are comfortable with. An already unhealthy fish can have issues dealing with meds, but you don't want that rot to reach his body either. If it was me, I would go the antibiotic route. If you are able to quarantine him during it, that would be preferred. Either way, make sure to remove any carbon filter lining and read the instructions for exact dosage.
The bacterial growth was also probably a bit accelerated at 80 degrees and should abate a bit when lowered down.
Does that help? Any other questions?

 

[kayladc]

I have Mardel Maracyn Plus on hand, so I'll likely use that. I also have a spare 10 gallon tank and a small power filter that I can use as my QT.
Do you think he'd be okay with changing temperatures gradually (I would put him in a bowl and let the temp slowly drop to room temperature - 73 degrees - and then put him in the QT tank)? Or should I not even try that and just go buy another heater?

(I previously used my spare 5 gallon as my QT and it has a heater, but as I mentioned earlier, my betta seems happier in there, without filtration, than in the 10 gallon filtered tank, so he's living there now.)

 

[absolutangel04]

A gradual temperature change should be fine. You can always keep the qt tank in a reasonable warm room in your house to keep the temp up a bit. It is preferable to have a heater, but if you don't, then do your best with what you have.
Maracyn plus should work.
By the way, I am going to head this off before it comes up. Some people will suggest also using aquarium salt for treatment. Since you have skipped right up to antibiotics, just skip salt. There is limited data about how effective salt actually is a cure. It might well be helpful in some cases, but since you already have out the big guns, no need to use the pea shooter as well in my opinion. If your really want to use it though, it would probably be fine.