Sand or gravel?

[mfdrookie516]

It comes in one ugly color

Ugly (to you) or not, this is simply not true (ironically, much like your signature). PFS comes in several colors. Some even looks exactly like your miracle sand.

 

[Fishguy2727]

Stocking definitely has more to do with water changes than volume. Obviously volume is a big factor, but to a limit water changes can completely undo the volume of a tank.

Yes, if you search every pool store in town and special order it you may be able to get other colors. Or you could go to the aquarium store and buy sand that runs an astronomical price of...the same as gravel and be done with it.

 

[NYgiantsRP]

I have never used sand, but have seen other tanks with it, and I don't like it because you can see all the crap on the bottom, gravel hides it. When you have bigger fish there poop isn't very pleasant to look at.

 

[GodFan]

Stocking definitely has more to do with water changes than volume. Obviously volume is a big factor, but to a limit water changes can completely undo the volume of a tank.

Yes, if you search every pool store in town and special order it you may be able to get other colors. Or you could go to the aquarium store and buy sand that runs an astronomical price of...the same as gravel and be done with it.

Maybe you are lucky but my LFS told me there sand starts at 60 bucks.

 

[Fishguy2727]

You have to ask for a particular type. The type I recommend is sold in five pound bags that most shops sell for $4-5.

 

[Sharkbait54]

So what brand of aquarium gravel do you guys recommend??

 

[Mumma.of.two]

It's all a matter of personal preference isnt it. Some don't care what 'shade' their sand is while others do. I wanted black sand for my new tank. Not grey, not brown but black. So I bought the expensive aquarium stuff. The other tanks I just wanted sand. It did not matter to me what exact color it was. If we didn't have our personal likes and dislikes wouldn't the world be a boring place!

 

[Fishguy2727]

I don't think the brand of gravel makes a big difference, and I think most people prefer sand.

 

[mfdrookie516]

Stocking definitely has more to do with water changes than volume. Obviously volume is a big factor, but to a limit water changes can completely undo the volume of a tank.

Just pointing out that your signature DOES say

Stocking has NOTHING to do with tank volume, it is all about water changes.

So, which is it?


Me and you have been through this PFS vs Estes thing time after time (and several others as well). Every time, you say how bad PFS is and how great and holy Estes is. I have NO problem with you liking Estes. I will not sit here and watch someone say bad things about something they have no experience with when I do. You've said before that if you can't afford to buy something made for an aquarium, you shouldn't be in the hobby... yet you recommend using quilt stuffing (designed for... quilts) for filter media. If you can't prove something, don't post it as factual information... that's all we are asking. "IMO" being posted after many of your comments would really help you a lot... IMO

 

[Mumma.of.two]

So what brand of aquarium gravel do you guys recommend??

Real gravel, made from rocks. Not plastic coated rubbish.

 

[Sharkbait54]

Real gravel, made from rocks. Not plastic coated rubbish.

Oops. Meant the brand of aquarium sand.

 

[Fishguy2727]

Sorry, let me breakdown my signature. I make it that blunt because in effectively every discussion of stocking no one ever brings up water changes. They simply focus on volume. Anyone with any sense at all will realize that no matter how many water changes you do, you can't put an oscar in a ten gallon. If you cannot figure that out please get out of the hobby, for the sake of the fish.

When something is EXACTLY the same, aquarium or not, yes, I may recommend a product that is not specific to aquariums (although this is rare). 100% polyester filter floss and pillow stuffing are the same. PFS and sands made for aquariums are not the same.

 

[ejaramillo01]

Sorry, let me breakdown my signature. I make it that blunt because in effectively every discussion of stocking no one ever brings up water changes. They simply focus on volume. Anyone with any sense at all will realize that no matter how many water changes you do, you can't put an oscar in a ten gallon. If you cannot figure that out please get out of the hobby, for the sake of the fish.

When something is EXACTLY the same, aquarium or not, yes, I may recommend a product that is not specific to aquariums (although this is rare). 100% polyester filter floss and pillow stuffing are the same. PFS and sands made for aquariums are not the same.

Can you be more specific about the difference besides the color? Materials? Chemicals? Or what are you talking when you said it is not the same?

 

[OBEYtheFISH]

What a heated conversation
I think pfs & ps are as good as the actual "aquarium sand"
Plus its very affordable

 

[ronnieroach]

What a heated conversation
I think pfs & ps are as good as the actual "aquarium sand"
Plus its very affordable

gotta loooove AA the only place where sand can trigger such an uproar haha

 

[Fishguy2727]

The Estes sand is very uniform and the perfect size. Something play sand is far from, but PFS is very close to. The Estes is also coated with a polymer/ceramic coating to prevent the silicates form causing a problem (brown algae). WAIT! Before anyone gets their underwear all knotted up over that: YES, I know that isn't always an issues and such and such said that form of silicate...and it glass is made from silicate...and on and on. BUT I have seen it happen with too many people too many times where their tank is fine, they change nothing but the substrate from gravel to a cheapo sand, and then have unbelievable brown algae problems right up until the day they breakdown and take the sand back out. Coincidence? If so that is a huge coincidence. Happens every time? Obviously not. But IMO why risk it, get stuck with effectively one color option (CALM DOWN! Yes, I know you can track down other colors of PFS if you try hard enough) for about the same cost as gravel and get a better product. The Estes also requires absolutely no cleaning at all. Cut the bag open and pour it in the tank.

Over the years I have seen many issues come up involving sands and a wide range or problems it can cause. However, IME that has everything to do with the type of sand and not sand in general. I have only ever encountered two problems with the sand I use and they re not even the sand's fault: 1-it can get in the filters IF cichlids decide it is fun to spit into the intakes. 2-If you use those driftwood mounted to slate decorations the slate blocks the oxygen from getting to the whole sandbed and creates those toxic hydrogen sulfide gas pockets you hear about. Obviously both of the issues are caused by other factors than the sand itself. Even with three inches of the sand I use I have not encountered toxic gas pockets, something I have seen happen in no more than an inch with other types of sand.

I want to clarify one thing: IF you do want to use a cheapo sand that isn't made for aquariums, pool filter sand seems to be the way to go because it is usually so uniform. From seeing people on forums and my own clients and customers, the PFS seems to cause fewer problems than play sand and other types.

I know it is a 'flaw' that my experience with PFS and the others is so limited, but I am thankful I found something so good when I first started using sand and didn't have to deal with tracking down exact types of cheapo sand, dealing with the problems that they really can cause (again, obviously not every time, but these issues do happen). And the color alone is more than enough for me to spend a little more to get a much better look, and my clients agree.

 

[meegosh]

The Estes sand is very uniform and the perfect size. Something play sand is far from, but PFS is very close to.

I have to disagree with this. The perfect size to me can be river rocks or playsand. It all depends on what look I want in my tanks.

You can't really say one type of substrate is best. It all depends on the application.

For the record, I've used regular aquarium gravel, AquaQuartz's PFS, Quikrete's Premium playsand, and EcoComplete. I have never had a problem with either of those substrates. They all did exactly what I wanted and caused no unwanted side effects.

 

[Fishguy2727]

Perfect size as in it is small enough to be sand, which means it doesn't trap tons of debris and create more work for the aquarist and pollute the water like gravel does. At the same time it is large enough to allow enough space between the sand grains to allow the entire sandbed to get oxygen. That is how I define the perfect size. The result is the least amount of work (none for any of my tanks or my clients' tanks), an easier to maintain tank, happier fish, and the time to enjoy it and not work, on it.

 

[mrwizard]

I use play sand and never had a problem with it, no brown algae nothing, I'd recommend it to anyone. I prefer sand over gravel cause I like to keep my tank spotless and when the sand is dirty you can see that it is(if it's white sand), with gravel you can't. Just my opinion.

 

[GodFan]

I like pfs but I do wish there were more color options. But I will not pay the prices that my LFS offers for sand. Not happening.