Stocking a 20 gallon tank

[Kryten]

I'm restarting a 20 gallon tank following a 4 year hiatus. I'm proposing the following as a population:

2 Mini Mexican lobster
2 Dwarf blue lobster
4 Kuhli loach
2 Dwarf sunset gourami
2 Female beta
4 Neon tetra
4 Cardinal tetra

I know the rule of 1 gallon per inch of fish. But my thought is that the lobsters and loaches (as they are bottom feeders) would help reduce the bio-load and not have such a negative effect.

What are your thoughts on my stocking intentions?
Would you like to see other fish included while keeping the lobsters (no live-bearers!)?
Are my thoughts on the bio-load issue sound?

 

[Skai]

That rule is a little outdated, I mean it's still a good general rule but not the end all be all. I don't know much about lobsters so I won't comment on those but I do know there has been known to be aggression issues with dwarf Gourami if you keep multiples. I'm not sure if a twenty gallon is enough for more than one territory wise. Then again it's been many years since I kept any dwarf gourami. They also have had issues with betas though I'm not sure if that would be an issue with the fact you're planning on females. As for the tetras I think those should be fine since they should school together despite being technically two different kinds.

What kind of filter are you thinking of for this tank btw? That will also play a role in the bioload matter.

 

[Brookster123]

The lobsters will eat the loaches and anything else they can grab.. the gouramis and the bettas will battle..

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[Kryten]

The lobsters will eat the loaches and anything else they can grab.. the gouramis and the bettas will battle..

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You might assume so but these are of the species Cambarellus patzcuarensis. They are quite safe in a community.

 

[Kryten]

What kind of filter are you thinking of for this tank btw? That will also play a role in the bioload matter.

The filtration is quite robust, it is a Fluvel system sufficient for up to 50 gallon tank, the flow will regulated sufficiently to avoid damage.

 

[sinibotia]

Sorry, but kuhli loaches are quite thin and would constantly be running into the lobsters. I would not do it. And as has been said, the gouramis and bettas will not get along. General rule is also having at least 5 in a school so you should include more kuhlis, neons and cardinals.

Your stocking plan isn't too much for bioload IMO but the animals aren't well-suited to live together.

Also, 1 inch per gallon is nonsense. Bioload is way too complicated to be broken down that simply. Your tank shouldn't be overstocked. That said you are way off base with the notion of bottom dwellers decreasing your bioload. They will increase the bioload just as much as the same amount of middle-dwelling fish. They don't eat fish waste and they don't reduce the ammonia output of the other fish, and they do put out ammonia of their own.

 

[Brookster123]

They're crustaceans and crustaceans are more or less the same.. khulis would be fast food

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[Kryten]

They're crustaceans and crustaceans are more or less the same.. khulis would be fast food

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Actually in doing further research I've learned it's the other way around these little crayfish are extremely docile. So much so in fact that when they molt they actually become the targets of the loaches.

I understand the concern that many have with introducing crayfish a.k.a. freshwater lobster in a community tropical tank. However if you do some looking around in the available resources on this specific species you'll see this one is not as aggressive as many think it is.

In a way they kind of remind me of a shrimp with claws.

I would never put a traditional crayfish or even a miniature crayfish and a community tank because they are opportunistic feeders. But my local aquarium hobby shop which is been in business for well over 30 years has a sample tank set up with these guys and they're doing just dandy.

 

[Kryten]

Your stocking plan isn't too much for bioload... Also, 1 inch per gallon is nonsense. Bioload is way too complicated to be broken down that simply.... That said you are way off base with the notion of bottom dwellers decreasing your bioload. They will increase the bioload just as much as the same amount of middle-dwelling fish. They don't eat fish waste and they don't reduce the ammonia output of the other fish, and they do put out ammonia of their own.

As I have learned more recently things have changed since the last time that I did a lot of my research on this hobby.

...General rule is also having at least 5 in a school...

That's the magic number, I was wondering what a minimum school would be.

 

[sinibotia]

As I have learned more recently things have changed since the last time that I did a lot of my research on this hobby.




That's the magic number, I was wondering what a minimum school would be.

Yeah, I know what you mean. I was out of the hobby for a little while myself a few years ago. Stuff changes so much. Always good to catch up!

The more I think about it though, the more I realize how silly "1 inch per gallon" always was. I mean, a 3 inch kuhli loach shouldn't "count" as much as a 3 inch rainbowfish with several times the mass? 15 neon tetras is way different from a 15 inch oscar.

5 is what I use for a minimum school. But more is always better! I had a school of 15 glowlight tetras in a 20 gallon (now in a 55 gallon) and it's quite impressive to watch!

 

[Brookster123]

Actually in doing further research I've learned it's the other way around these little crayfish are extremely docile. So much so in fact that when they molt they actually become the targets of the loaches.

I understand the concern that many have with introducing crayfish a.k.a. freshwater lobster in a community tropical tank. However if you do some looking around in the available resources on this specific species you'll see this one is not as aggressive as many think it is.

In a way they kind of remind me of a shrimp with claws.

I would never put a traditional crayfish or even a miniature crayfish and a community tank because they are opportunistic feeders. But my local aquarium hobby shop which is been in business for well over 30 years has a sample tank set up with these guys and they're doing just dandy.

See how it goes than

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[Kryten]

Since I started this thread I will continue here.

When should I concern myself with adjusting pH: Prior to, during, or after my fishless cycle?

 

[sinibotia]

Since I started this thread I will continue here.

When should I concern myself with adjusting pH: Prior to, during, or after my fishless cycle?

Never! Unless your water is very extreme in ph you don't need to adjust it at all. In fact messing with it does more harm than good.

 

[Kryten]

My test just completed appears to be closest to 7.6 on the API test kit. Since I'm considering stocking a community tank I figured getting it closest to neutral would be a natural choice, no?

 

[Brookster123]

Never! Unless your water is very extreme in ph you don't need to adjust it at all. In fact messing with it does more harm than good.

+1

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[keegster803]

Never! Unless your water is very extreme in ph you don't need to adjust it at all. In fact messing with it does more harm than good.

1+
When I first started the hobby, I accidentally killed my whole 20 gallon off by dumping chemicals to change my ph, as long as it's stable, it should be fine, the fish are very good at adjusting to ph


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[LayzorBeams]

If you PH is 7.6 youre fine.

Anything in the range of 6.8-9 can usually work. Dont go too low on the scale, or you will screw up the nitrification process.

Only fish that would need it would be an expensive, delicate, wild-caught specimen. And even then they will probably adapt over time.


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[Laeris]

+1 longer acclimation process for delicate fish. I'm at 7.6 pretty much of the time and my nano fish, shrimp and snails are koalas in the rain about it.

 

[Kryten]

Okay, so I've added some ammonia to the tank.

I'm going to add some plants and add some filter squeezings from another established aquarium into my filter.

Then I wait for the nitrogen cycle to kick in.

Does anyone have any suggestions or comments on what I should be looking out for?

 

[Kryten]

I put a nice sized ornamental bridge from a friends tank into mine. But I think I may have over did it with the ammonia.

I know that I may have to do a partial water change.

But by putting in too much ammonia did I harm the helpful bacteria I am trying to cultivate?