What's your tap water like?

[Sinuhe]

The tap water around here, and I think in most places in Finland, is somewhat problematic: It's soft, but alkaline, and hence not ideal for any fish . The water straight from the tap has a pH of about 8,0, total hardness of 3 dH and carbonate hardness of 2 dH. Raising the hardness with something like crushed coral has turned out to be quite difficult, not to mention most things that raise hardness also raise pH, which really is not welcome, since 8,0 already is too high for most fish ideally. And when I put a Mangrove root in, it'll not lower the pH, just softens the water, hence making it even worse, if possible. I wish either the pH was lower, or the hardness higher. Now, I'll try to choose fish that are not too specific about the type of water they need. At least the values tend to stay stable.

What's your tap water like?

 

[Voodoo Chilli]

Most of Tennessee is sitting on limestone- as a result, we have hard, alkaline water. The pH runs towards 7.8-8.0 with a GH of 160 and a KH of 120. I played "Mad Water Chemist" for years in the futile attempt (at least futile without the aid of an RO unit) to make it inviting for dwarf cichlids to spawn in. The old saying, "if you can't beat 'em, join 'em" rang true one day- and I'm a convert to the Rift Lake species. They love my water straight out of the tap- and the L. multis are overrunning their tank with babies to prove it!

 

[William]

My water is 7.0-7.2 pH range.

Havn't tested any of the other params.

Altho... its apparently quite good since I've had molly spawn, crabs molt, ect ect.

 

[silvi-p]

hi sinuhe,
well, your water is even worse than ours - I didn't think it possible!
I live close to the alps in Germany, and consequently the water is hard and slightly alkaline: ~13KH and probably ~15GH; 7.5-8pH.
I stopped wanting to change it since I don't have any possibility to store treated water. and changing ~150l (~38gal) per week is just too much otherwise!

It's ok for malawis (I know a breeder, he's all happy ), but the stuff I'd want is not cool here without RO. so, I stick to gobies and livebearers and some others that don't bother so much about hardness

Your case is hard to treat though. I'll ask in the german forum if anybody would have an idea, this is interesting.

-s.

 

[peterp]

Mine is comming out of the tap at ~8KH ~11GH ~7.8pH.

In my large tank I changed substraight to agronite and silica sand, and started keeping rift lake cichlids They seem to be doing quite well in this water.

My planted 33 with gouramis (Flourite Red substraight) seems to also be doing quite well with this water.

I gave up trying to chemically alter the parms, the water never seemed to want to listen.

 

[peterp]

Actually Sinuhe, take a look at Discus,
I think they like quite soft water, with a PH around 6.0
So you would just need to adjust your PH down.
They do grow quite bigish.

Discus page Holland

 

[TankGirl]

Mine is much like Voodoo's water. In my heavily planted tank with CO2, the pH is 7, down from 7.6 out of the tap. In my rift lake tank with buffering substrate and CC in the filter, the ph is 8.4 or 8.6 (this tank is patiently waiting for some of Voodoo's multis when they are ready ).

I do get fluctuations of pH in the planted tank between night and day, so I am not planning on keeping tricky fish in there, and it is much easier for me to keep hard water-loving fish like livebearers and Africans.

There are many factors that influence pH so it is a tricky thing. I'm gonna have to do some research on your particular problem, Sinuhe!

 

[Voodoo Chilli]

Tankgirl-

Those five or six babies I told you about a few weeks ago? There are about 25-30 in there now! 8O I'm going to have to upgrade tank sizes in a few months. I have a few theories on the virility of my breeding stock; I think the Barry White music I play for them has something to do with it.....

Anyway, there'll be some with your name on them just as soon as they're big enough to leave.

 

[captainGregor]

Voodoo Chilli

I wonder if water in Nashville is any different than the water in Athens. Tap water comes out about 7.0 - 7.2 and in my tank it is 7.6 (go figure) My kH reading was 20 ( ) maybe I was drunk I need to measure tap water again today to see what GH and KH is. I wish that test kits had more precisely-divided color swatches so that the measurements could be better, rather than give us ball-park figures - I have A.P. FRESHWATER MASTER TEST KIT

 

[silvi-p]

hello sinuhe,

you know what? the guru in the german forum I read said that you should just.............. do nothing!!

he explains that water from the tap is often overly saturated with o2 because water works don't like co2 in the tubes too much (makes water acid -> more corrosion), and the more o2 you put into the water, the less co2 stays in it.
once you put it in a tank or other vessel that has water/gas exchange and stands still, the o2 will gas out, shifting the balance to more co2 than before and -tadaa- you have a lower pH. he also says it should work its way down to 6.5-7.

maybe you can try it out with some sort of vessel? if you have a pH test?

kind regards,
silvia

 

[sweetsuvvyb]

silvia is right on...

CO2 dissolves in water to form carbonic acid (good trivia bit on why all rain is acid rain ).

 

[Voodoo Chilli]

CaptainGregor-

Glad to see another Tennessean lurking about!

I've noticed differences in the exact pH and hardness throughout the state- but we've all got hard, alkaline water. I lived in Murfreesboro for six years and the levels were a little lower than here; I've got a friend that lives in Bon Aqua (west of Nashville) and his levels are sky high!

You shop at Aquatic Critter? That was my LFS of choice when I lived in the 'boro. I have the great fortune of living near Bernie at The Fish Store now-so's I go there to get my fix.

 

[TankGirl]

once you put it in a tank or other vessel that has water/gas exchange and stands still, the o2 will gas out, shifting the balance to more co2 than before

Won't the CO2 gas out over about a day's time as well? It is my understanding that many people have CO2 in the tap water that gasses out, and their pH will rise over about 24 hours.

 

[Sinuhe]

hello sinuhe,

you know what? the guru in the german forum I read said that you should just.............. do nothing!!

he explains that water from the tap is often overly saturated with o2 because water works don't like co2 in the tubes too much (makes water acid -> more corrosion), and the more o2 you put into the water, the less co2 stays in it.
once you put it in a tank or other vessel that has water/gas exchange and stands still, the o2 will gas out, shifting the balance to more co2 than before and -tadaa- you have a lower pH. he also says it should work its way down to 6.5-7.

maybe you can try it out with some sort of vessel? if you have a pH test?

kind regards,
silvia

Hmmm, I do have a high range pH test, and both the tap water, and the water in tanks repeatedly reads 7,8-8,0, and has consistently for the 4 weeks I've had my new tanks going. I don't have any excessive aeriation, just an internal power filter that breaks the surface of the water. Right now, I only have a few small fish, and a lot of live plants, which may shift the water towards more oxygen and less CO2.

 

[ostrichkiller]

i just found out that the place i am going to be moving into doesn't even have tap water... it has a well the entire town sits on a large surfer plate and the well water smells like sour eggs even after you run it through a purifier. i didn't have any of my test stuff with me but i was very depressed. after talking with one of my employees that lives neer there i found out that there is a local bottleing plant that lets you get all the spring water (like aquafina stuff) that you want for free as long as you are a resident of the town. he told me that he has been useing it on his 120gal FW for years without problems.

 

[sweetsuvvyb]

If the water is hyperoxygenated, then the excess oxygen bubbles out.

Likewise, if the water has a great deal of excess CO2 dissolved in it, it will also bubble out when left to sit.

There is an equillibrium that is reached either way. Not all (or any!) municipalities hyperoxygenate their water, but it sounds as if that might be the case in parts of germany (i wouldn't really know lol).

Might be a fun experiment for the curious....see what your pH is fresh outta the tap, versus after letting it sit for awhile. I'd say generally speaking, your pH is going to be more dependant on factors other than dissolved gases, but in places where oxygenation is used instead of chlorine, for example, it might make a difference.

 

[sweetsuvvyb]

Sinuhe -

To test if your water might have this oxygenation effect, pour some tap water into a cup, and let it sit awhile (the longer the better). If the pH is still as high as when it came out of the tap, well then you know its something else causing the alkalinity.

Because there are soooo many factors effecting the pH in the tank itself, comparing the pH there to the tap pH isn't really a just comparison, when you're trying to play investigator!

 

[captainGregor]

Voodoo Chilli

I have bought some stuff at Aquatic on Nollensville Road, but I would not buy any equipment or accessory from them because it is overpriced. I buy big stuff at www.bigalsonline.com and will buy my fish at Aquatic Critter or Emerald Bay (little store in Bellevue) My 55 g is cycling right now with zebra danios and cherry and gold barbs.