Second HOB filter ideas

[Sf1]

Hi,
I ordered a second Fluval C3 to my 29g tank.
What is the best order to put the media?

My actual idea is:
First C3:
Poly foam from Fluval (need to change it to something else, fluval's one is not reusable).
Seachem Matrix (a little)
Filter floss (much)
Seachem Matrix again

Second C3:
Polyfoam
Seachem Matrix (much)
Seachem Purigen (100g)
SeaChem Matrix

Is Purigen will reduce water flow?
Do I need to put a small piece of filter floss before Matrix to catch the dirt?

Any better idead?

Thanks

 

[Paul1792]

I have two C3's running on my 38 gallon and and a C4 on my 29 gallon. Since 100 % of water flows through the media in the mechanical frame, the chemical chamber and biological tray need no futher "protection" with floss but the floss does make good "stuffing."

You will love operating your C3's in tandem. My water is so crystal clear & polished, it looks like I have a cannister filter and a UV Sterilizer going just like this:

How to get crystal clear aquarium water - YouTube

But without the mess.

My recipe for flawless filtration with two C3's is as follows:

Mechanical Frame:

Cut to fit medka that works even better than the factory poly/foam pads. The C3 mechanical frame is just under 5 x 5 x 1/2" and I find the best results are obtained with the following cut to fit media:

Filter #1 running at full flow:
1) Acurel debris reducing pad (3/8 thick) +
2) AquaticLife 100 micron non-woven polishing pad (1/12th inch thick)

Filter #2 is set to run at lower flow and has a Fluval Edge Pre-Filter on the intake tube. Then in the mechanical frame:

1) Same Acurel debris reducing pad as filter #1 +
2) AquaticLife 50 micron non-woven polishing pad (1/12th inch thick)

[Note :100 micron pads are probably enough, but I recently started using the 50 micron variety in one of the two filters]

No good micron polishing pad can be rinsed clean and re-used. The debris they collect is so fine it becomes embedded in the pad. Go here to this picture of my non-reusable OEM pad and read the caption ......

http://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums/members/82012-albums13125-picture62190.html

The factory pad is about 150 microns. The AquaticLife 100 micron pads clogged about every 3-4 weeks when I was running one C3 on my 29 gallon fully stocked tank. They cannot be re-used. Petland sells sheets of the 26" x 30" polishing pads for $10 so you are talking about 40 cents per filter per application (taking into account some waste in the cutting process). If you are running two filters, you probably will need to change it out only about every 6-7 weeks in a fully stocked tank.

Chemical Chamber: (both filters identical)

1) 100 ml bag of Seachem Purigen +
2) Seachem Matrix in a bio-bag topped off with floss.

NOTE: Purigen does not slow down the flow of water when used in the chemical chamber.

Biological:

I use Factory C-Nodes and drip tray pursuant to the instructions. In one of the filters, I also added some seachem matrix to the trickle tray. Watch out for Matrix only in the bio-chamber. The Matrix "rocks" are bigger than the factory media and so you may not get as much bio-filtration when you try to fit them in a small space.

*************

Here is a link to my photobucket account and the section called HOB filtration that contains pictures of mechanical and biological media and chambers on my C4. Click on the relevant pictures and there is a description under each one.

http://s948.photobucket.com/user/Pau...?sort=6&page=1

[note: The unused mechanical media sitting on my desk in the picture is the recipe I use for my C3's.]

Also, it doesn't do any good to "overdo" the bio-media. You may want to watch this for an explanation and some additional information.

http://checkoutthelatest.com/uarujoey&watch=eOOBTJB791I

 

[Sf1]

Thanks Paul

Those items are reusable? How fast they become dirt and need to clean?

1) Acurel debris reducing pad (3/8 thick) +
2) AquaticLife 100 micron non-woven polishing pad (1/12th inch thick)

Did you use a vaseline fix for your C3 noise?

How much Matrix I need to put? I have 500g.

Do you have any improvements of Nitrate level?

Thanks

 

[Paul1792]

Thanks Paul

Those items are reusable? How fast they become dirt and need to clean?


Did you use a vaseline fix for your C3 noise?

How much Matrix I need to put? I have 500g.

Do you have any improvements of Nitrate level?

Thanks

***************
Acurel debris reducing pad IS re-usable. Just rinse in "clean" but used Aquarium water. It's good for a few rinses then falls apart so to speak. Replace it maybe every two or three months ..... it's up to you.

NO zero nada as far as good micron filtering pads goes. Good 100 micron polishing pad for an HOB cannot be rinsed and re-used for more than a couple days. You are going to have to "bite the bullet" on the 40 cent cost. Let me assure you ....... the clear, clean polished look of running your water through 100 micron pads is CLEARLY worth 40 cents a month.

I did not do the Vaseline fix. That is a great question on your part. Look at this thread I posted when I first got my first C3 last August:

http://www.aquariumadvice.com/forum...alc3-are-enough-best-quiet-filter-276431.html

In the end, it was totally silent within a month without me doing anything to it. My second C3 arrived quiet on Jan 6, 2014 ....... but not silent. Within about a week, it became totally silent.
*********
As for the Matrix ......... take your time with it and just use your judgement. I have a 500 ml bottle of it and in two tanks ....... I probably have another 6 month supply which is about equal to one year's supply total for two tanks.

Recently I learned Fluval ceramic media is the best for our Fluvals. I plan to use it in the future:

http://www.filtersfast.com/P-Fluval...00-grams.asp?gclid=CMi97--V3LwCFUcV7AodakgAAw

 

[Paul1792]

Oops. Forgot your quesiton about nitrates.

Thanks Paul

Those items are reusable? How fast they become dirt and need to clean?


Did you use a vaseline fix for your C3 noise?

How much Matrix I need to put? I have 500g.

Do you have any improvements of Nitrate level?

Thanks

*************
Yes. It is very easy to control nitrates when running two C3's. Now always under 20 ppm nitrates ---- before weekly PWC's -------- with only 20% weekly water changes on a tank that is way over-stocked. Seachem Purigen works wonders. I recently added some Poly-Filter which takes nitrates down to under 10 ppm. It is expensive ..... but I have to use $1 spring water for water changes so it pays for itself.

 

[Sf1]

Thanks
What about bio-screen? It become very dirty and block the flow.

 

[Paul1792]

Yes, Bio Screen on top of the drip tray must be cleaned

Thanks
What about bio-screen? It become very dirty and block the flow.

***********
I think I posted this nasty event elsewhere .. but yes ....... after 6 months of use by my oldest C3, I noticed that the water was overflowing into the out-take without passing through the drip tray containing the C-Nodes.

It was totally clogged. Pathetic. And you can't just "rinse it out." The media must be rubbed and squeezed real hard. There was more dirt in the water than when I rinse out my pre-filter. I had to do the cleansing process with three stages of distilled water.

The good news: it works fine now. I plan to replace these once a year ....... but the price they charge is highway robbery.

 

[Brookster123]

*********** I think I posted this nasty event elsewhere .. but yes ....... after 6 months of use by my oldest C3, I noticed that the water was overflowing into the out-take without passing through the drip tray containing the C-Nodes. It was totally clogged. Pathetic. And you can't just "rinse it out." The media must be rubbed and squeezed real hard. There was more dirt in the water than when I rinse out my pre-filter. I had to do the cleansing process with three stages of distilled water. The good news: it works fine now. I plan to replace these once a year ....... but the price they charge is highway robbery.

you must own stock in fluval huh?

 

[anibis]

The bio-screen was partially clogged after only a month on my C3. I only have 3 fish in the 29g it sits on, so it's certainly not overstocked. The maintenance tab came up after 2 weeks, so I must have dirty water lol. I was able to get it pretty clean again after just squeezing/rubbing it in aquarium water. I figure I'll replace it every 3-4 months. The bio-screens are $6.99 for a 3 pack on Amazon, so if I can get one to last 4 months that's not too bad for a years supply really.

I've seen some people remove the bio-screen on youtube, you do not want to do this. The c-nodes are porous, if dirty water gets in that tray they will get clogged up which will hurt your biological filtration.

I tried the vaseline trick, and I wish I hadn't. It didn't help with noise, and it was a pain to clean up. A week after I applied the vaseline I took my filter off to try applying it again, and noticed a not so good smell. It was the Vaseline. It had run down the shaft and accumulated at the bottom where it turned into a white paste kinda thing. I got it all out but it took some doing.

I'm not sure what to do with the noise on my c3. I've had it for a month, and while it has gotten better, it's not "dead silent" like my Cascade. Taking the cover off does quiet it down a bit. The cover isn't rattling or anything, it just amplifies the impeller noise. I don't really care anymore, kinda helps me sleep tbh.

 

[Sf1]

I installed another C3 with Seachem Matrix and 100g of Purigen. I put Matrix in Stage 3 and 5 of filtration. Water is much cleaner now. I think 1 C3 isn't enough for 29g.

 

[Sf1]

Somebody tried to put filter floss on bio-screen?

 

[anibis]

They did? I was saying people (not just one) were removing the bio-screen and letting the water trickle through the bio chamber unfiltered. Not smart.

I don't think 1 C3 is enough for a 29, but you can do well with 1 C3 and another cheaper filter. I like to run carbon, so just I use standard cartridges for my Cascade, and use my C3 for clarity. I'm really itching to put some Purigen in, next payday! My water is crystal clear as it is, hopefully my fish will be floating when I get the Purigen in there.

I'm still using the stock pad. I found the acurel waste pad, but was unable to find any polishing pads. So I bought another 3 pack of the stock pads since I'll have to order the polishing pads online. I did notice my water is more clear with the new pad. I figure I'll have to change the polishing pad every 2-3 weeks to keep it this way. That is one benefit to having 2 C series filters, it should go longer before the polishing pads get clogged.

 

[Sf1]

I have 2 C3 right now. With 250g of SeaChem Matrix, 100g of purigen and filter floss.
Next I'll try those acurel stuff. I want to put a layer of filter floss on bioscreen to protect it from dirt.

Why it's not smart to remove bioscreen? There is no bioscreen in Aquaclear filters and it's fine.

 

[anibis]

Ahh gotcha. If you clean the bio screen every couple weeks it's really not a big deal. I didn't have too much difficulty getting mine looking new again after a month of use. If you just give it a quick cleaning every week when you do a pwc it shouldn't get too dirty.

Do the Aquaclears use C-Nodes? The C-Nodes are porous, which allows bb to grow inside as well as on the outside. Basically it increases the surface area, which increases the bio filtration. If dirty water gets in that chamber it will clog the pores, thus reducing the surface area for the bb to adhere too. It's not a huge deal, but better to have things setup right imo.

 

[Sf1]

My bio-screen become blocked by brown algae after maybe 2-3 days max...

I tried filter floss, it doesn't work, it block the water flow. I need something much more thin. Maybe "AquaticLife 50 micron non-woven polishing pad (1/12th inch thick)"? Need to try it. Or maybe 100 micron pad, it's much cheaper (13$ vs 18$ on Amazon).

 

[Paul1792]

My bio-screen become blocked by brown algae after maybe 2-3 days max...

I tried filter floss, it doesn't work, it block the water flow. I need something much more thin. Maybe "AquaticLife 50 micron non-woven polishing pad (1/12th inch thick)"? Need to try it. Or maybe 100 micron pad, it's much cheaper (13$ vs 18$ on Amazon).

************
Something else is wrong with your water chemistry that the brown algae is taking over.

Just as information - Pensacola PetLand sells AquaticLife micron pads 26" x 30" (5.4 square feet) at the following rates:

300 Micron: $8.99
100 Micron: $9.99
50 Micron: $10.99

The prices quoted from Amazon are more than Petsmart sells them for at retail. Petsmart is usually at least 50% over Amazon prices ....... so something is wrong there at Amazon.

And, no ....... don't try 50 micron pads over the drip tray. Just for fun, since I have scraps of it, I cut to fit 100 micron aquaticlife pad and yes ...... it worked. But no better than just taking the original old pad and squeezing it between my fingers under tap (yes, tap) since I have so much excess BB).

Also note to everyone using aquaticlife100 micron polishing pad: I said this elsewhere that there are no directions on the package, but it does have a flow pattern. One side of it feels like felt ........ that is where the incoming water should go. The "finer" side feels like it is plastic coated and takes out the smallest particles.

When used with the correct flow pattern, the 100 Micron AquaticLife pads FAR outlast the OEM polishing pads. And the water is so crystal clear it is incredible.

Also, I have found the 50 Micron pads I have been using on one of the C3's in my 38 gallon don't make the water any more crystal clear at this point than 100 micron pads ....... since 50 microns is less than the human eye can see.

 

[Sf1]

How about pre-filter mesh to protect the shrimps?

 

[Sf1]

So, I added Acurel Waste & Debris pad with 100 Micron Felt (3$ for 18" x 30 at Aquarium Filter Media: Drs Foster and Smith Mechanical filter Media) as Paul1792 suggested. Fits perfectly, looks very promising.

 

[Sf1]

upd.
Acurel Waste & Debris pad with 100 Micron Felt work well only 2 weeks or less.
After that Acurel become very thin and water bypass it, so the 100 micron felt become blocked very fast...

So, I add a standard Fluval C3 pad (without felt) + used and thin Acurel Waste & Debris pad + 100 micron felt. Fluval pad traps large debris, Acurel small and 100 mic. feld micro debris

 

[Paul1792]

upd.
Acurel Waste & Debris pad with 100 Micron Felt work well only 2 weeks or less.
After that Acurel become very thin and water bypass it, so the 100 micron felt become blocked very fast...

So, I add a standard Fluval C3 pad (without felt) + used and thin Acurel Waste & Debris pad + 100 micron felt. Fluval pad traps large debris, Acurel small and 100 mic. feld micro debris

*************
Interesting. I do agree the Acurel pad can become "lame" over time and your solution looks good. I just go ahead and replace it when I can tell it's reached the end of its life cycle so to speak.

Also, the micron pads you ordered from Drs Foster are the felt ones and are not the same as AquaticLife non-woven pads I use. I'd be interested to know if the felt ones let you get crystal clear polished water.

I am using 50 micron pads now in two of my four filters as explained here in my filter media update:

http://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums/f12/filter-efficiency-306017.html