55gal fertilizing questions

[J rider]

ferts

Hi,

I also have a 55 gal planted tank minus the CO2. Tank is 4 months old and contains 10 inches of fish. I ordered dry ferts from Greg Watson and have done all the water tests.

Last week:
phosphates: 1 ppm
nitrates:5 ppm
KH: 11.5 dKH
pH:7.6
amm: 0
GH: 8

I did 50% water change and added only 5 mls of Kents Iron and Micronutrient liquid fert.

This week:
phosphates: .5 ppm
nitrates: < 5 ppm
KH: 11.8 dKH
pH:7.6
amm: < .25 ppm
GH: 8

I did 50% water change and added 5 mls Kents, 2 dashes potassium nitrate, 2 dashes potassium sulphate.

I am still battling algae, hair and thick dark green mossy stuff mostly. It seems each plant suffers from a different kind. My water sprite is doing the best at pulling through. I was away for 4 days and our pet sitter over fed. In addition at the start of this big storm in NJ our heat went out and the tank plumeted to about 65 degrees. It was slowly acclimated back up to 75 and I hope the fish do OK.

My question is? How do I know how much weight in dry ferts I'm adding if I don't have a scale. The only measuring device I have are the measuring spoons I ordered with my dry ferts. I thought they were real small measurements. In fact they say dash, pinch and smidgen. Go figure.

I thought this would relate to the origical topic. Sorry if it doesn't I'll repost my own topic.

Jackie

 

[hforney]

Re: ferts

Hi,

I also have a 55 gal planted tank minus the CO2.

Thanks for joining this thread JRider. Do you plan on getting CO2 sometime? I just added my setup and finally got it working right. It takes a time making the final adjustments for the bubble count and ph controller. I have seen some small changes so far. I guess like everything it takes time. I don't have any pearling plants yet so this is one of the reasons I need to understand the fertilizing part. I guess when you are just starting out it takes some time to just understand the basics. At least I know about cycling LOL, so now we move onto plants.

 

[J rider]

Hi,
Thanks for the welcome. Yes, I do plan on getting CO2. As I proceeded through the set up of my planted tank I was aware of certain things that I needed to purchase. I bought the ferts, test kits, substrate, lighting etc. I was not initially told about the possible need for CO2. I consider my pet store (which I drive 45 minutes to get to) very good. I think the different advice that you may get is do dependent on what you need to buy at the time. Which, is not so good. So, it wasn't until my third or fourth trip there for tank supplies someone explained that I might need CO2. Since this cost is an estimated 25% of total tank set up I can see why they try to spring it on you after you have purchased the plants and lighting. Maybe if I had purchased it early on I wouldn't still be battling algae. Anyway, I want to get it but its very expensive. I have encountered so many problems with algae and fish disease already that I guess I'm waiting for it all to calm down before adding another variable.

Since you are earlier in the process I would warn you to be extra cautious about purchasing your plants and fish and accepting advice. I have been sold sick fish, plants with snails and told to buy pH buffers.
Thankfully, everyone on this site has been helping me through this process. I hope to one day look at my tank and not think hmmm is it "gill flukes or fish TB killing all my fish" or "darn another plant killed by algae" ; ).
BTW since our tank and lighting are so similar would you mind giving me some more details on your CO2 system?
Thanks,
Jackie

 

[hforney]

"By the way"]BTW[/acronym] since our tank and lighting are so similar would you mind giving me some more details on your CO2 system?
Thanks,
Jackie

My CO2 equipment was selected from information I received on this forum. Without the help of so many here it would have been a very tedious process.

1) Milwaulkee Regulator with solenoid valve and needle valve, and a Milwaulkee ph controller. From what I read I believe it is JBL who also makes a compatable product. I chose Milwaulkee because I found what I thought was a good price online $160 for regulator etc. and ph controller, plus I lucked out and got free shipping.

2) Aqua Medic 1000 Reactor. My choice for this reactor was that I could mount it inside my cabinet below the tank. I did not want to put any additional equipment in the tank. I also purchased this online, I think it was between $65-$80.

3) 5lb CO2 tank and CO2 resistant tubing. At the time I was searching for the equipment I couldn't find a local place to get the CO2. I did find an online vendor who will ship a tank filled with CO2. I purchased it online thinking it would give me several months to find a local place for a refill. The filled tank was $120 shipped and $5 for the CO2 tubing.

As you can see it is not cheap, but in the long run I think it is a good investment. The past weeks I have just monitored the gauges, bubble count, and ph reading. Once it is fine tuned you can forget about it untill time to refill the tank.

Do a lot more research before you leap. You will also read about DIY CO2.

 

[malkore]

Jackie,

tell me about the lighting on this tank...type of lighting and total wattage.

Your nitrates are a little low compared to the phosphate levels. You want about 10ppm of nitrate for every 1ppm of phosphate. You're at about 5:1 instead of 10:1, so you're seeing phosphate related algae blooms.

Dosing potassium nitrate to 10ppm will help. you can use this site to determine how much KNO3 is needed to hit 10ppm: http://www.csd.net/~cgadd/aqua/art_plant_dosage_calc.htm

The trick to using the above page to dry dose ferts (instead of mixing a stock solution) is to set Amount of water to mix with to a value of 1. In your case, .5 teaspoons of KNO3 will add 8.24ppm of nitrate to your 55gallon tank. You're currently under 5ppm, so a .5teaspoon dose would get you to roughly 10ppm, which would be more balanced to your .5ppm of phosphate.

I know I'm contradicting myself by having you go past a 10:1 ratio of nitrate to phosphate, but the truth is nitrates will get you into less trouble than phosphates. Some people go with a 23:1 ratio of nitratehosphate and have no issues.

I'd also follow hroney's advice and read up on DIY CO2. Its possible to get decent CO2 levels on a 55gallon tank with DIY. Not necessarily convenient, but it'd get you by until you can spring for a pressurized CO2 system (I'd look at www.aquariumplants.com - they sell the Milwaukee regulator for $59.99 right now. Later you'd need a CO2 cylinder for around $80, and then some way to diffuse it into the water which can range from $10-$100.)

 

[travis simonson]

Just from a quick glance at the nutrient levels in your tank I would have to agree with Malkore, you should add enough nitrate to get your NO3 levels to ~10 ppm.
And thanks for providing all of that info, it really makes it easier to help resolve algae problems

A few notes: Most inexpensive test kits are notoriously unreliable at very low ppm levels, so a reading of <5 ppm nitrates could mean you have anywhere from 10 ppm to 0 ppm nitrates. Just seeing the trend of your results going from 5 ppm NO3 to <5 ppm NO3 I would guess that you've got very low to non-existent levels of nitrate in your tank which is very likely to cause algae problems. Combine that with the fact that you are now measuring recordable levels of ammonia (<.25 ppm) instead of 0 ppm ammonia and you've got a recipe for pea soup. Algae will thrive in the presence of ammonia. Get nitrates stabilized around 10 ppm, keep your phosphates where they are, and keep an eye on your ammonia levels, hopefully they will drop back to unmeasurable levels, if not, check your filters, they may need maintenance. Hope this helps.

 

[malkore]

Good point on the ammonia levels. To follow that up, healthy plants will quickly take up ammonia as a nitrogen source.

is Kent your trace mix?

Also, a dash of potassum sulfate isn't enough. I'd add a whole (level) teaspoon of potassium sulfate after a water change. target for potassium is up to 20ppm. a teaspoon in 55gallons will yeild an increase of about 12ppm

Since potassium tests are impractical, I usually suspect it's at low levels in many tanks when the fishkeeper is new to all of this plant keeping stuff.

 

[J rider]

Hello,
Thanks very much for the response. I have been tackling some of the issues you guys pointed out.

First, regarding the test kit. I bought a Salifert following a rec from this forum and Marine Depot. Hopefully, its a good one.

Lighting, 2 65W 6700K bulbs. On for 4.5 hours off for 3 hours then on for 4.5 hours. I just upped the day light by 1 hour.

The carbon is currently out of my filter (Fluval 304) because I was treating for gill flukes. I don't think that would effect ammonia though so maybe I'll try to get some inserts. Do you reccommend any? They have peat, and all sorts of stuff. I'm sure my plants are readily uptaking ammonia becuase the only thing that is still growing is the water sprite. Everything else has green spot or hair or brownish black sluge algae yummm.

BTW I have treated for 3 weeks with Parasite Clear. My last zebra danio looks like he starting to get the first symptoms of what must be TB. Semi clamped fins, reddish slightly enlarged gills, a few scales missing maybe. We'll see how he does. I have lost a total of 12 fish to this already. All I have left is 1 clown loach, 2 siamese algea eaters, 5 ottos. They all look healthy. Makes me want a tank of SAE they are so cool. But, I won't be buying any fish for a while. Not until I rule out TB somehow?!

I found the calculator on Chuck's website just yesterday, so as you were suggesting I'll use that and dose out some more KNO and KSO. You reccommend every 3 days?

The Kents has:
Potash, Cu, Fe, Mn, Mo, Zn
This means it is a trace correct?

I was planning on getting some Tropica Mastergrow when I run out because I heard so many good things about it. Was also planning on getting some more substrate b/c I have closer to 2 inches than 3-4 and I wanted to add some Flourite.
Speaking of...do you always vaccuum up the substrate when doing a water change. I usually do but I'm not sure if my plants would do better without the disturbance and maybe its bad to kick up my substrate. I have black rocks that came wet in a bag ohhh I forget.

BTW I'm asking for a plant book for my birthday, I don't understand hoiw anyone can do this without a textbook. I have to remember its my hobby : ).

Thanks again!!!!

 

[malkore]

Ok,
Kent is a trace. When it runs out, I'd buy Plantex CSM from gregwatson.com - it'll last you years.

Salifert is a great brand of test kits, definitely as good (if arguably better) than SeaChem.

Only vaccum the surface of your gravel...with heavily planted tanks its best not to disturb under the surface. There's lots of plant roots, and good nutrients trapped in there, especially with flourite or eco-complete. You could just layer flourite over the top of what you have, eventually it'll mix together, but doesn't look bad with pea gravel.

I'm not a fan of treating disease in a planted tank. Many meds can wreck havoc on plants, and clown loaches are easily irritated by any meds due to their thin layer of 'scales'.

I doubt removing the carbon brought up the ammonia. Likely too many meds could affect your bio filter...but I honestly don't know. I've only had ich once, in a goldfish (unplanted) tank. Never anything more severe.

 

[J rider]

Malkore,
Thanks for all of the advice. Don't doubt my belief and appreciation when I say that your new picture freaks me out ; ) : ) : > )
Just Kidding!!!
But, I do think that your previous little smiley guy picture was much more reassuring * ).
Jackie