65gallon Discus tank-to-be

[moneymike0311]

I purchased a 65 gallon tank w/ beautiful stand and wooden top (pictures to come later. Right now, I am in the process of soaking the driftwood and I have already put in the substrate (flourite). I am going to set up the under tank filter this week(the see-through kind with the plastic balls that host the bio-filter) and hopefully add the plants next week after the driftwood has been put inside. For plants, I was thinking of some amazon swords, a couple types of annubias, and a pink ammania. I have read these will be well suited for the bright lighting and higher temps needed for Discus. I want to put a couple Birstlenose for tankmates, but that's all.

Okay, I have read that adult Discus need 10-15 gallons/fish, so 4 would have more than 15gallons and 5 Discus would have 13 gallons. Can any of you seasoned Aquarium Enthusiasts and Discus keepers give me some input? I would love to know of any potential pitfalls I might be setting myself up for, or any tips to make my aqaurium optimal for the fish.

Thanks guys,
Mike

 

[bs6749]

You will need to do a partial water change every couple of days for discus, at least that is what I hear. They are pretty finnicky about their water conditions. You will want soft, acidic water. I am sure some of the members on here with experience will be able to help you out more.

 

[Zagz]

I have a 75 gal and have 9 discus in there. I have driftwood and plants for hiding spots. Mine are still relatively small, ranging in size from 3"-5". I have no aggression and everyone is good. I do 50-75% pwc's per week and keep the temps at 86F. I watch the fish closely and don't need to do any additional water changes. The best advice is to do a complete fishless cycle before adding the discus. Once the parameters are stable, keeping them that way is easy as long as you don't overfeed. Just keep monitoring the tank on a regular basis. The plants will help keep the nitrates down. I am actually having difficulty keeping my nitrates at 5ppm due to the plants. In a 65 gal tank you could quite easily have 6 discus. I would not get less than 5 esp if they are going to be purchased as juvies. Good luck.

 

[moneymike0311]

Thanks for the advice guys. So by getting 6 juvies, will I have to move a couple out when they mature? I have another 55 gallon just begging me to start it up as a spare/hospital/plant tank for now. The fishless cycle is definitely the way I will go, I don't need any more fish at the moment and I sure don't want to burn their gills just to break a tank in. I plan on putting in a little water from my tetra community tank (10gallon) to get the cycle jump started, will there be any risk of the discus getting diseases from them? The tank I would be taking (minimal) water from has neons, 3 rummies, glass cats and a clown pleco.

Also, when I fill up the tank this weekend, can I add the plants right away? I would like to get them established before I introduce the discus (in mid December or early Jan) but don't want the plants to freak out and die. the only experience I have with plants is in hygro and java ferns in my other two tanks. Thanks guys and gals....

 

[Zagz]

I wouldn't worry about moving out the discus when they get larger unless you see aggression issues. Tank water contains very little bacterial colonies, I would not add the water from your neon tank, rather steal some of the filter media from the tank to put into the new filter.

You can add your plants right away.

 

[triazole]

i'm not sure i understand moneymike0311 clearly.
do you plan to grow the discus out in the spare 55g and then transfer them as adults to the 65g? if so, that's a great plan. but keep the 55g bare-bottom (BB).
if you plan to keep juvie discus in a planted tank with gravel, i'd advise you not to. from what i've gathered so far, levels of DOC's (dissolved organic compounds) in these tanks are high enough (even with daily pwc's) to stunt discus. the frequent feedings with high-protein foods necessary to grow them out foul the water fast, and it'd be best to have a BB tank to facilitate pwc's.

 

[Zagz]

While it is absolutely true that BB tanks provide easier water maintenance and ease of cleaning, also allowing food not to rot because it is easier to see, you can have discus in a planted tank with substrate provided you are willing to keep constant vigilance on your water and not allow food to rot on the bottom. Most breeders do keep BB tanks for juvy discus. I was prepared if necessary to do water changes daily with gravel vacs. I've had my discus for several months now and they have grown at least double their original size. I would advise that you make a decision based on how much time you have to spend on your tank. BrianNY is an experienced breeder of discus for several years now and can offer you tried and true personal experiences. I did not follow the advise of the BB tank and my discus are fine and thriving. That would be my personal experience.

You could indeed put the discus in a BB 55 gal tank and plant the 65 gal and cycle it and transfer the discus over as they grow if you wanted to. Do you know if you would be purchasing juvies or adults?

 

[moneymike0311]

Thanks everyone for all the responses!

Here's my plan. I want to get 6 juvies and put them in the planted 65 gal. I was toying with having a backup plan if they get too large for the 65 gal, I could move a couple to the 55 gal if I had to. Or maybe by then I will have another larger tank. Either way, I am hoping I won't have to do that. I am going to visit the discus specialty shop near San Francisco around Thanksgiving to maybe reserve the fish, but I won't bring them home until late December or even early January until the tank has cycled and the plants have establsihed themselves. I really want to do this right and avoid rushig this.

About BB tanks, I really don't like them. I understand that they are easier to maintain, but I am willing to do daily gravel vaccuuming in order to have a planted tank. I plan on setting up the plants early next week. I would like to put in a few large amazon swords along with a couple cabombas for the background and some of the small amazons for the foreground. I have a beautiful peice of driftwood to be the centerpiece (I've soaked it for two weeks now).

As far as plants that can withstand 82-86 degrees, does anyone have any suggestions?

Zagz, can you expand on what I specifically do to introduce filter media to my new filter?

 

[Zagz]

It's quite easy, depending on whether you use a cannister or HOB the principle is basically the same. Take some of the seeded media, such as filter floss, or bio balls and add them directly to the filter. If you have no room in the filter you can put the media in a clean pair of pantyhose and set it right on the substrate. I prefer the filter method myself. It helps to seed the tank.

 

[severum mama]

Yes, I agree with Zagz. I've used this method many times with a lot of success. Your tank will likely cycle in under 2 weeks, and then you can add pure ammonia, fish food, a raw shrimp, etc. to keep the cycle going until you are ready for the discus.

Good luck and we would love to see pics!

 

[BrianNY]

That's exactly what made me start a planted discus tank Mike. It is a challange and a balancing act but it can be done. There are many great articles in AAs planted tank section. One of the things I found confusing is what I call snippets of information. This holds true for plants as well as discus. You really need to see the "full" picture before you focus on any one element. Example: It takes alot of light to grow plants. Or, discus require an acidic pH. It's kind of like knowing you need a key to start your car, but not knowing you have to put gas in the fuel tank.

I don't want to over complicate this for you and I'm encouraging you to proceed. I encountered many pitfalls and made many mistakes along the way. My advice is to keep things as simple as possible as you learn along the way.

I suggest you start with low light plants such as java fern, anubias, crypts, water sprite, sags, and hygro. I would especially avoid a fine leaf plant like cabomba. A plant like that requires alot of pruning and the fine leaves really mess up the tank as they fall off so easily.

Discus are quite unique for a FW tropical. Most everyone knows that they feed their fry from a slime coat on their body. Here comes a snippet. Because they have such a heavy slime coat, and must be kept at higher temperatures, the likelihood of unwanted bacterial growth is increased. Hence the need for so much water changing. The more discus you have the greater the risk.

Invest is a copy of "Discus Health" by Untergasser. You'll refer to it frequently. Also check my gallery for some pics of a few of my tanks. Good Luck and keep us posted.

 

[moneymike0311]

Zagz thanks for the clarification. I'll use my biobag and put it on top of the filter balls of my new tank to get it started.

Brian, thanks for the conceptual information, I will definitely get that book and do even more research on plants. My only dilemna is this: I have a 7800k light (92 watts) for my tank and I know java ferns are supposed to be low light plants. I have grown them in my smaller tanks along with hygro, but the hygro usually takes over and kills off the java ferns when they are both present.

 

[moneymike0311]

So here are some pics of my tank, I set it up and added the plants on Saturday.

I have a plant fertilizer solution, added some of the filter media from my other tank to the wet dry filter and have put solution in that breaks up the chloramine from the tap water,but what else should I do?

 

[Aquarium Freak]

Hey there, I just thought that I'd add Discus are really not a fish to avoid if you are an experienced FW aquarist. I was very hesitant to getting Discus but I finally bit the bullet and got them they are in a planted 90g with water changes of about 30% once a week and they are healthy and thriving! Just thought I'd add this it sounds like you are doing all the right things and you have a beautiful tank!

 

[moneymike0311]

So my cycling is coming along just fine. Adding the filter media in the new tank's wet dry really sped things up. AS of yesterday I have 0 Ammonia, 02.5ppm Nitrites and 10ppm nitrates. How high will the nitrates go usually when they spike?

Also, I noticed som algae starting up on my driftwood. I have been dosing the tank every three days an not using more than the regular dose. I added Flourish fert tabs under the Amazon Swords and the Annuibias, so hopefully that will get them going strong since they are wilting slightly.

What should I go about the algae? I keep my lights on for about 13-14 hours a day. They are Coralight 192 watts (6800K I think).

 

[BrianNY]

WOW Mike. That's more than 3 wpg. You're going to grow nothing more than lots of algae unless you pressurize CO2 in that set up. The biggest mistake newbies to planted tanks make is TOO MUCH lighting. Again, a snippet. You're lacking carbon (in the form of CO2). That equates to a huge nutrient imbalance and algae will thrive to the detriment of your plants.

Reduce the lighting to around 1-1.5 wpg and the algae should diminish. Do not increase the lighting until you're ready to add CO2. Dosing anything without CO2 is a waste of money and will only grow more algae. Read the stickies in the planted tank section.

 

[moneymike0311]

Thanks Brian. I noticed that as soon as I posted it. I guess I just put too much faith in the LFS being right about what they sell me. I have been toying with getting co2, maybe I should just do it. My only concern would be putting too much co2 in ther water to where it would affect my fish.
Thanks for the help...