Panther Crab (Parathelphusa pantherina) breeding project

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you need a light, go to home depot and get a t5 fixture and some 5500k bulbs and that moss will grow much better. You wont get much growth with that lack of light. for $ you will have your moss walls.
 
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Week four pics:







So, the reason I take these pics three at a time is due to the aquarium stand build, which I hope to start this week. This stand will be situated in the corner (bottom pic) with three of the aquariums to a level, so it'll be three levels tall. I hope to only have to use one air pump, but we'll see how that goes.

Also, has anyone else had issues with mosquitos in the fish room? If so, what are some effective ways to get rid of them without ruining the aquariums or killing the inhabitants? I will be getting some guppies this week, so hopefully this'll help with some of it (the larva will at least be food for the guppies). Any suggestions are greatly appreciated!

:thanks:
 
Well I didn't read quite everything, but most of it. This is very cool!

A few things:

IMHO a wattage meter is a bit overkill unless it's super cheap. Unless you really want to document everything.

The moss seems like it's growing slowly. A long T8 or T5 light would help, or multiple CFLs. Depending on the watts and how high you hang each one, you could get anywhere from low to medium light. I think it would be a worthwhile investment.

How much do these crabs go for? I've never heard of them TBH.

Are the guppy fry going to be crab food?

I'd like to keep everything legit since this will be an actual business in the future, so i'll go ahead and invest in a wattage meter, though it will be one of the cheaper ones :) (kinda have to since I'm on a budget lol)

The moss is growing slowly, and I'm investigating the lights. I found a great resource on how much light to provide, but just like any great resource it's a LONG, LONG read lol. Also, since I'm on so much of a budget, I am trying to make the most worthwhile investment. I know CleverBs mentioned going to homedepot and for 70$ I'd have the moss wall, but IMO that's a bit much. However, if it's truly worth it I'll end up doing just that :)

These crabs usually go for a few dollars for a 1-1.5 inch crab, but I've found a great source that sells them for just a couple of dollars and they're 2-2.5 inches (including legs. w/o legs they're 1.5-2 inches)! So by far that's the best deal :D

And, yes, the guppies will be food for these crabs, but most likely not the fry. I'll use the older guppies/the ones I cull for that :) (I won't be breeding these for profit/credit like some do yet, but am looking into the possibility via a few other threads on this site. But TBH it looks like a lot of work lol) Reason? These crabs grow to 3 inches along the carapace, and I've been told to feed them food the size of their claw, so any fry would likely not be big enough

These crabs are opportunistic generalists (meaning they'll eat almost anything, vs some crabs that specialize in fish or plants or even detritus), so I'll also feed them black worms and other foods. Also, a couple of the crabs in my first batch actually took pieces off of the moss balls i had with them, so I'm sure these ones will also graze on my moss walls :)

Hope this answers your questions!

:thanks: for the input and support, as well as the compliment! It's very much appreciated! :D
 
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Here's the week five pics





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I scavenged some light fixtures plus bulbs from some old equipment I have stored in the room. It's only temporary, and isn't great, but hopefully it's better than what they previously had (I'll look into purchasing new bulbs for them all soon. In the meantime this'll have to do):



*I suspect the light that's purple may be a UV light, so I'll need to check on that and change it if necessary. Oh, so much to do, yet so little time to do it all in...



In the next couple weeks I hope to have the filters on the aquariums with a few guppies to start the self-sustaining food web system. We'll see how that goes lol

Also, in the next month I hope I'll be able to start the build for the stand (I'd rather not be eaten by mosquitoes, so it's been pushed back. Well, that and I started another class at college so I have even less time for my projects), and finally figure out exactly how many pairs/trios I'll need to make this work.

Be sure to stay tuned as this is just starting to gain momentum!

:thanks:

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See, the weird thing about that purple bulb is I don't think it's supposed to be purple.


Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but it doesn't seem to make much sense to me lol

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If you go to Menards or Lowes, Home Depot, plant bulbs are pretty cheap.

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It says 8000k so probably not.

I've gotten mosquitoes before when collecting plants from ponds. But only one or two.

Maybe just open any doors or windows and let them fly out. Will the crabs eat any larvae that they create?
 
It says 8000k so probably not.

I've gotten mosquitoes before when collecting plants from ponds. But only one or two.

Maybe just open any doors or windows and let them fly out. Will the crabs eat any larvae that they create?

8000k is on the cool end of the spectrum, a lot of companies call it cool white, but it is most definitely not.
 
Here's the week five pics





---------------------------------------------
I scavenged some light fixtures plus bulbs from some old equipment I have stored in the room. It's only temporary, and isn't great, but hopefully it's better than what they previously had (I'll look into purchasing new bulbs for them all soon. In the meantime this'll have to do):



*I suspect the light that's purple may be a UV light, so I'll need to check on that and change it if necessary. Oh, so much to do, yet so little time to do it all in...



In the next couple weeks I hope to have the filters on the aquariums with a few guppies to start the self-sustaining food web system. We'll see how that goes lol

Also, in the next month I hope I'll be able to start the build for the stand (I'd rather not be eaten by mosquitoes, so it's been pushed back. Well, that and I started another class at college so I have even less time for my projects), and finally figure out exactly how many pairs/trios I'll need to make this work.

Be sure to stay tuned as this is just starting to gain momentum!

:thanks:

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Where are you located that you still have mosquitos? I wish I had that problem. 50 degrees here in Northern Indiana. And also if it's warm where you are can you do any of this project outside during summer? I don't mean building but can livestock be outdoors at all? Sorry if that's ignorant I really dont know much about this.

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Maybe just open any doors or windows and let them fly out. Will the crabs eat any larvae that they create?

Last week i lit some special candles with the window open that were supposed to deter them, and moved the candles every so often. I'm pretty sure that took care of most of them, but without the candles I'm hesitant to open my windows due to mosquitoes coming AND going. Only thing, the candles don't take care of the larvae. As for the crabs eating them, I don't really know tbh. It'd be cool if they did :D




Where are you located that you still have mosquitos? I wish I had that problem. 50 degrees here in Northern Indiana. And also if it's warm where you are can you do any of this project outside during summer? I don't mean building but can livestock be outdoors at all? Sorry if that's ignorant I really dont know much about this.

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I'm in the Phoenix area of Arizona, and I don't think you're ignorant. I'm just glad you're asking questions :D if you didn't, then I'd be concerned ;)

My grandpa lived in Wickenburg until he passed, and he used to keep pigs, chickens, geese, ducks, as well as fish outdoors. He even kept some aquariums indoors as well, which is how I think I got hooked :') So, raising livestock outdoors is doable, but of course I'd rather go all out.

I have grand plans for when I get my own place, building the house from the ground up, completely sustainable and off the grid (mostly high-tech), with a self-sustaining food system for not only me but my neighbors (permaculture, aquaculture, and when combined aquaponics), eating mostly real food, etc. Of course, what I've been asking myself recently is how much of it is realistic? We'll see...

The point of the last paragraph is this: I'd much rather not have to worry about needing to water my goats or feed my chickens in the future (especially with my schedule, assuming it's similar in the future). If designed correctly, a permaculture system can maintain itself and feed not only a family of four, but also collect enough water and produce enough food for goats and chickens as well. Now, you don't want them free roaming too much, but it's like the system I'm doing with this breeding project. Everything feeds each other, YOU just have to move it to the proper place in the proper time. A lot less maintenance, hassle, and worry. (Of course, you'd only have to harvest the food, feed the livestock, and all; the system would mostly water and grow itself, with less maintenance every year)

So, while definitely doable, I'm not at the scale I need to be to feel comfortable trying to raise these outdoors. In this heat and environment, it's too likely they'll die from exposure if I don't have that type of system up and running. That, and if they do survive and escape (talking specifically about my breeding projects now), I could be responsible for an invasive species, something I'd much rather not chance. I've had an idea to do something about the number one cause of invasive species in the hobby, though, but a lot more needs done before that can happen.

[My idea is in essence to set up a system of drones kind of like our commercial flights that picks up unwanted fish and brings them back to a "safe house" where they'll be kept, and instead of trying to intercept them, one could send a message to it saying they're interested in the fish-in-transport and can house it, and it'll reroute to drop it off. Of course, I'm getting new ideas on how this might work as I type lol]

So, yeah, doable but not recommended as far as doing this outdoors atm. Too many risks, not only for they're survival, but for their thriving in my state's canals and such which would be a VERY bad thing considering that's how come I've never been able to keep crayfish, which were my first choice once upon a time. Now, I find crabs immensely more fascinating :D

Thank you for the quick replies, and I'll definitely look at home depot and the other places mentioned for the plant lights :)

:thanks:

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I'm sorry it's been so long since my last post. The mosquitoes combined with my college studies and the aggravation of trying to get adequate pics is the reason I've been mostly absent, though no excuse or reason is adequate for not posting when I said this thread would be updated every week.

So, now on to today. I figured out a new way to take pictures of the moss, which eliminates the glare and darkness from the photo. It's pretty simple, but just figured it out this week when I installed my heaters. I take the moss out, put the canvas with the moss on the corner of an aquarium, and snap the pic with my tablet (Nexus 9, which I commonly post from).

Here's this week's pics (I have no idea what the week number is):
















There's heaters in three aquariums:






I'm heating the aquariums this way to save money. I noticed it was effective when I kept guppies and RCC next to each other, with a heater in the guppy aquarium but not the crab's. The water in both aquariums was within one degree of what it should be, but after testing the water temp this afternoon I noticed in the winter there seems to be a 5 degree difference, but that's still good. However, it's nighttime when it dips lower, so I may want to check to be sure they stay within an appropriate temp range for the panther crab.

Also, yesterday I purchased 18 feeder guppies and one bunch of hornwort. The guppies were 6/$1 and the hornwort was $5/bunch. So, my total was less than $10. Here's some pics:

*hornwort


*some of the guppies

Hopefully the hornwort allows a lot more fry to survive, though I totally forgot all the other things in the tank that'll also contribute to their survival :lol:

Also, I talked to my LFS manager about selling some inverts and fish to him. He said he can get a lot of them already, but if I were to breed some of the novel inhabitants he'd be interested. Now I have an excuse to get another breeding project going :D More info coming soon!

:thanks: for sticking around! Hope you have a fantastic week. Another update next week
 
That's a great deal!

Normally you don't need to try very hard to breed guppies. Hornwort will work well to take nitrates out of the water. Frogbit is also great for that. How large is the guppy tank?


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I've been watching this project silently along with others and Let me just say it seems like you know what you are doing and all bout these crabs! Great job! This is an awesome project!


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Cn
 
Disclaimer: a lot of this post is off topic, so read at your own risk. ;) :lol:

That's a great deal!

Normally you don't need to try very hard to breed guppies. Hornwort will work well to take nitrates out of the water. Frogbit is also great for that. How large is the guppy tank?


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The guppies are in a 75 gal tank. I have two more spares if necessary :p
though I'll need to clean those to use them :( :lol:

Is frogbit as invasive as duckweed, or is it the polar opposite? I'm pretty sure it's a floater, as I think I recognize the name, but feel free to correct me if I'm wrong :lol:




I've been watching this project silently along with others and Let me just say it seems like you know what you are doing and all bout these crabs! Great job! This is an awesome project!


Sent via the power of my aching thumbs
Cn

Thanks! I really appreciate it :D I think the reason I know so much is because I literally spent 6 months researching these crabs before I was able to get them the first go around (like currently, they were out of stock for that time). During that first time, I made every mistake I think I possibly could've, and I've learned from it (or at least tried to).

This is primarily why I hold to the belief that if you thoroughly research a hard-to-breed species, whether it's never been bred before or is considered "expert", you'll do fine trying to breed it. Many of the fish and inverts I'll attempt to breed are those that have never been bred before due to the sheer difficulty of succeeding, so this is good practice. However, some, like the first species of shrimp I plan to breed simultaneously with these in separate aquariums (I'm currently doing the necessary research), will just breed when given optimal conditions as most shrimp do (as long as they don't have a pesky larval stage :lol: ).

As a prime example of breeding a species that's difficult to, I know for a fact I can breed the Denison's Barb, Sahyadria denisonii, but I can't afford it at this time. I've only shared the secret once on a different forum, but I doubt it's easy to find since most forums only show the most recent threads, and it's been several months since any activity on that thread. However, if someone had some and was willing to try, I'd be willing to give you my secrets, but only because it's way past time someone sold captive bred stock.

For most such species, just look into how they breed in the wild and you can do it; that's all I do. It does take me around six to eight months to fully figure it out though.

But besides those mentioned, there's only one more I'm definitively going to try to breed: the ropefish. This species has been bred accidentally once, but the fry are extremely difficult to keep alive (I think they managed eight to fourteen days???). There's many more I'm looking into, and a few I want to run some experiments on (primarily the Bala/Tricolor/Silver shark, if the commercial breeding with hormones has any affect with being able to breed them in captivity naturally, i.e. without the hormones), but that's a different thread for a different time.

That's just a taste of what I hope to accomplish for our hobby. Just the tip of the iceberg ;) First step is becoming a recognized and reputable breeder, which I'll accomplish with the shrimp and these crabs, followed by the barb, ropefish, and other fish & inverts (with accompanying profiles and threads, of course). And yes, this is why I'm getting my BS in Conservation Biology and Ecology, and am currently looking into PhD programs in Florida (most aquarium inhabitants come from similar climates as Florida, so that's why I chose it vs California or the upper east coast).

Stay tuned! And as always, :thanks: for the input and feedback! It helps motivate me to keep updating this thread, and motivates me to continue on my quest in helping our beloved hobby become more sustainable, or as I term it "more ecologically sound" :lol:

Also, for future reference, I'll try to not digress this much in the future, but all this really ties in nicely, don't you think? :cool:

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Frogbit is a floating plant. It's not nearly as invasive as duckweed but when it gets going it can get close to as prolific. It's large so if you want to be rid of it you won't have trouble. This is some of mine, with salvinia minima next to it:



The tubing in the picture is standard airline tubing, for reference.

Salvinia is also a good option. It's more prolific, I think, but less easy to remove. Not nearly as invasive as duckweed though. It does suffer under high flow because it gets pushed under the surface easily, although frogbit doesn't appreciate high flow rates either.

They are both very good plants.


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Frogbit is a floating plant. It's not nearly as invasive as duckweed but when it gets going it can get close to as prolific. It's large so if you want to be rid of it you won't have trouble. This is some of mine, with salvinia minima next to it:



The tubing in the picture is standard airline tubing, for reference.

Salvinia is also a good option. It's more prolific, I think, but less easy to remove. Not nearly as invasive as duckweed though. It does suffer under high flow because it gets pushed under the surface easily, although frogbit doesn't appreciate high flow rates either.

They are both very good plants.


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Looks good! After looking up some more pics on Google, I can see why the frogbit is good for fry tanks. I'm considering it for my shrimp tank, and I'll send you a pm soon (probably around 1:30pm), but I've got to get ready to go to class. If you wanted, you could send me a pm with the cost to ship me a plant or two (though I know you'll need my zip code to pin it down), and hopefully we can work something out before it becomes impossible to ship due to being too cold. It's starting to get chilly here in Arizona, but it's not too bad compared to some areas. Great pic!

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Looks good! After looking up some more pics on Google, I can see why the frogbit is good for fry tanks. I'm considering it for my shrimp tank, and I'll send you a pm soon (probably around 1:30pm), but I've got to get ready to go to class. If you wanted, you could send me a pm with the cost to ship me a plant or two (though I know you'll need my zip code to pin it down), and hopefully we can work something out before it becomes impossible to ship due to being too cold. It's starting to get chilly here in Arizona, but it's not too bad compared to some areas. Great pic!

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I responded to your PM. That pic was taken a couple of weeks ago but even still I don't have enough to ship full orders out yet. I could send you a few plants, but you could easily get the entire quantity of what's in this picture for $6 on eBay, and if you want a lot you could get more for only slightly extra.

It's a great plant and if you need any advice just ask.


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