seachem stability

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Somethingclever said:
MAD??? YEAH I'M MAD (insert argument multiple times saying the same thing over and over)


This is ridiculous, either use it or don't. I generally will try things out without asking, and if it doesn't work i know not to use it anymore. I trust jeta and eco more than most people on this site, specially because jeta does know what he is talking about.
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lol i know you mad du! :p
 
Bubble_B0y said:
Yes it did work for me. Several times in fact!
I have 3 tanks in my house: a 65 gallon, 10 gallon, 30 gallon.
All of which I used the stability product to cycle the tank (it took less than 2 weeks) AND all 3 tanks I immediately added fish on day one.

The 10 gallon and 30 gallon have been running for over 3 years.
And my most recent tank, 65 gallon has been running since January 2011.
I have never experienced a crash in any of the tanks.



No, I don't continue using it during my weekly water changes.
In fact, I stopped using stability once my tank had cycled.

Now I would consider myself an experienced fishkeeper.
I am very pedantic about my weekly water changes and maintenance.
I keep all of my tanks understocked and I overfiltrate.
Now whether or not these aspects play a factor (I'm willing to say yes), is another discussion.

But to answer the original question, yes stability did work!
As to the 'science' behind that....well... At the end of the day these products claim to speed the cycle and help the biological filter - My experience is that this is true.
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How did you cycle your tank were you still putting ammonia in it ? I have been using stability for 3 days I started fishless cycling for 4 and the first day I dosed the ammonia to 4ppm and hvent had to re dose it's still at 4ppm
 
brittanykluss said:
How did you cycle your tank were you still putting ammonia in it ? I have been using stability for 3 days I started fishless cycling for 4 and the first day I dosed the ammonia to 4ppm and hvent had to re dose it's still at 4ppm
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I cycled my tank with fish - so there is always an ammonia source present!

If you are doing fishless cycling, why are you dosing your tank with 4ppm ammonia? That's too HIGH!
Dose your tank up to 2ppm maximum (I like to keep it as low as 1ppm).

Bacteria only need a low source of ammonia to keep the cycle going. Too much ammonia will slow the cycle process.
 
ilostnemo said:
no 4ppm is reccomended no fish in the tank so it dont hurt anything.
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+1. The purpose of a fishless cycle is to establish a large colony of beneficial bacteria which can handle a heavy bio-load of fish immediately upon completing the cycle. If you keep the ammonia level low and only prepare it for a few fish...why fishless cycle at all? 4ppm is right in the sweet spot...it's what I advise to everyone and have never had a complaint / negative experience from doing it.
 
ilostnemo said:
no 4ppm is reccomended no fish in the tank so it dont hurt anything.
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:rolleyes:

well I guess you just have to wait longer to see any changes occurring.

Bacteria need ammonia to survive. In fact, as little as 0.25ppm ammonia is enough to get the bacteria colony started and growing.

For a newly setup tank, 4ppm ammonia is alot to breakdown (considering there is no bacteria to begin with)
Why not start at 1ppm and slowly build up? That makes alot more sense and you can actually see "DAILY" changes to your test kits.

It will take several days till any changes are seen to 4ppm in ammonia.
 
seriously, to each their own.

The guy asked for help and I gave my advice.
He is obviously having problems with his cycle, so i assumed your method is clearly not working.
 
Bubble_B0y said:
seriously, to each their own.

The guy asked for help and I gave my advice.
He is obviously having problems with his cycle, so i assumed your method is clearly not working.
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I'm not sure how you view a cycle that started 3 days ago as "having problems and not working". Fishless cycling, although not always necessary, has many benefits. The problems that come with it are usually from poor recommendations from people with limited experience who don't understand what those benefits entail...and basically throw things like being able to fully stock the tank initially, not having to do water changes, etc...out the window. You're idea of increasing the level slowly doesn't make sense to me...there's a disconnect on the logic there.
 
the only dsconnect in logic is the fact that you think your fishless cycling method is "full-proof" and "perfect". And as you state, "no complaints"

You continually recommend it to all the beginners and newbies that come to this forum, and everyday we always have threads about people with water quality issues and cycling problems.
For something that you describe as having "no complaints" - you sure create alot of negative threads.

Perhaps, maybe, a disconnection in the logic ;)
 
Bubble_B0y said:
the only dsconnect in logic is the fact that you think your fishless cycling method is "full-proof" and "perfect". And as you state, "no complaints"

You continually recommend it to all the beginners and newbies that come to this forum, and everyday we always have threads about people with water quality issues and cycling problems.
For something that you describe as having "no complaints" - you sure create alot of negative threads.

Perhaps, maybe, a disconnection in the logic ;)
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What can I say...some of us are here to give advice and are respected for what we contribute....others just like to stir up trouble (which I find entertaining TBH ;) ). There's also, still (throughout this entire thread) a few of us handing out referenced, researched, factual advice...and others who are only providing their limited experience without a real knowledge on the subject, apparently taking things emotionally and giving out sub-par advice IMO/E.

The OP is welcome to select any path and any advice they choose...but only a few of us on this thread have a track record worth following (not naming names ;) ).
 
First of all, you need to get of your high horse!
I really don't appreciate the condescention and there are many others that feel the same way.

I don't know what makes you think your advice is any more credible than any other member on this forum. You seem to think you are the expert in everything (judging from what I have read)
This is a discussion forum and I am giving my advice based on many years of experience.
I wasn't aware that making a contribution and helping others is a crime - unless that advice comes from your mouth alone.
You appear to have joined this forum in March 2011, I have been here since June 2005....but whatever.

Anyways, perhaps we should just leave the advice to the so-called "Experts" like yourself - Since you seem to know it all :rolleyes:
 
Bubble_B0y said:
First of all, you need to get of your high horse!
I really don't appreciate the condescention and there are many others that feel the same way.

I don't know what makes you think your advice is any more credible than any other member on this forum. You seem to think you are the expert in everything (judging from what I have read)
This is a discussion forum and I am giving my advice based on years of experience.
I wasn't aware that making a contribution and helping others is a crime - unless that advice comes from your mouth alone.
You appear to have joined this forum in March 2011, I have been here since June 2005....but whatever.

Anyways, perhaps we should just leave the advice to the so-called "Experts" like yourself - Since you seem to know it all :rolleyes:
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Wow, a bit emotional? I'm not sure the date you join the site has much bearing on the quality of information you provide. You've stated several times you've kept fish for 10 years...I guess technically I've had them since I was 6, but that obviously holds no importance or relevance to any discussion on this or any other forum.

So, in closing (again)...the OP has been provided information on this particular topic as well as several others. Feel free to read over the numerous scientifically backed articles I and others have linked, or go another direction...the choice is yours. I've said all I have to say on this topic, and also to posters who simply enjoy stirring the pot and becoming emotional when the purpose, as you said, is about giving (correct) advise on aquariums.

I'll let you go ahead and get the last word in again. If anyone has any additional questions or relevant opposing views I'm happy to respond...but going around in circles on the same topic serves no purpose here.
 
Wow I def. didn't know this question was a hot topic LOL I'm doing a fishless cycle with stability. I'll let everyone know how it works for me :)
 
funny logic - if we disagree with Eco, we must be wrong.
Dellusional much?

For someone that prides themselves on 'science'
The science of fish-keeping will tell you there are several ways and explanations for many things in this hobby - including how to cycle a tank.

And since you are so adamant that these products are a failure.
Why don't you publish your own journal article (with proof of the matter - including daily test kit information and readings) that say these products don't work.
In the journal article - It should include proof on the following
1) they don't speed up the nitrogen cycle
2) they lead to an unstable biological filter in the long-term.

Then Send it to a reputable, credible and peer-reviewed biology or chemistry scientific journal. I bet there aren't many (if any) published papers disproving these so called products. So that should give an "edge".
Just a thought.
 
One of them (from the patent site) is an interesting read, but you'll notice it is not described as a product designed to establish a bio-filter...it claims to reduce toxins, not colonize nitrifying bacterial colonies. In other statements from the links it explains that these products work in the same way as Stress-zyme by introducing bacteria which will consume ammonia and protect the inhabitants...again, not establishing a stable bio-filter. They are also related by the author to the "sludge busting" products you've mentioned. There's also lots of assumptions where they say it reduces nitrIte "presumably with Nitrobacter" (which I believe you've mentioned yourself is not the correct strain).

Trust me, I love Seachem. Near each of my tanks I have Seachem Prime, Seachem Flourish Comp, Seachem Excel and Seachem Matrix. I honestly wish they had a product I could support here. If the science made sense I would happily promote it, I'd even mention and recommend it on the write up I put together. Unfortunately the science doesn't line up.

We've said this a bunch of times in this thread...it's not about whether it (appears) to work, it's about HOW it works and what the long term effects may be.

Honestly though, thanks for actually providing links and information instead of blindly supporting it. I'm always happy to read actual info to support people's beliefs.
 
Bubble_B0y said:
funny logic - if we disagree with Eco, we must be wrong.
Dellusional much?

For someone that prides themselves on 'science'
The science of fish-keeping will tell you there are several ways and explanations for many things in this hobby - including how to cycle a tank.
Click to expand...

Only one of us is making personal attacks here. I suggest you cool it down a bit. We're still discussing the facts...but you're on the verge of crossing a line which goes against community rules not to mention personal decency.
 
But you saw that they assure that it can be package and store at room temp for a year!

And thats nitrosomonas and nitrobacter!!
Some says they are not the best but over time the best come and establish. But at the beginning of a cycle its useful to do it within 1 to 3 weeks depending on Ph and Temp.

I really go for fishless though!
 
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