Wigglers At Last!!!!!

[Mr Fisher]

Woke up to dead fish. One from the pair and one of the ones in the breeder box. The pair showed the same as every other I've lost. Staying in one place, heavy gill movement then death wwithin 24 hours.

 

[Kelly5978]

Can you use too much m.blue? About a month ago, I used a betta 1/2g tank on some angel eggs, because there weren't that many. Some literally turned blue, and none hatched. I haven't had that type of trouble since then, and chalked that failure up to temp. However, the m.blue bottle directions say "10 drops per gallon". I couldn't find my baby dropper this last "pull" and think I used a dropper with too big an opening, and too much m.blue. The water is deep blue. They've been in this for 2 days. I believe I saw some starting to wiggle, but I some others look like they're turning blue (can't really tell due to the dark blue water). Can I just put carbon over the side? How bad is "too much methylene blue" for the eggs? Are they doomed? If there's even a chance....I want to try. But, I'm supposed to leave the tank alone until they swim! So....if I hang carbon over the side (as they're just starting to hatch), should I just go ahead and remove all the m.blue now? Or pull the carbon when it looks light blue? Sorry for all the questions. I feel so stupid for such a dumb mistake!!!

 

[Andy Sager]

Can you use too much m.blue? About a month ago, I used a betta 1/2g tank on some angel eggs, because there weren't that many. Some literally turned blue, and none hatched. I haven't had that type of trouble since then, and chalked that failure up to temp. However, the m.blue bottle directions say "10 drops per gallon". I couldn't find my baby dropper this last "pull" and think I used a dropper with too big an opening, and too much m.blue. The water is deep blue. They've been in this for 2 days. I believe I saw some starting to wiggle, but I some others look like they're turning blue (can't really tell due to the dark blue water). Can I just put carbon over the side? How bad is "too much methylene blue" for the eggs? Are they doomed? If there's even a chance....I want to try. But, I'm supposed to leave the tank alone until they swim! So....if I hang carbon over the side (as they're just starting to hatch), should I just go ahead and remove all the m.blue now? Or pull the carbon when it looks light blue? Sorry for all the questions. I feel so stupid for such a dumb mistake!!!

You want the good news or the bad news? The good news is that there is no bad news. I have read countless articles about overdosing M blue and the general consencis is that you can't overdose M. Blue. Just put a carbon bag in there and let it start absorbing the blue. If they have hatched, you can let it clear out. If they haven't, remove the bag when you get to a nice shade of blue. Remove it all when they start swimming.

 

[Kelly5978]

Mr fisher, I am the very furthest from an expert, and I am not even able to go back further than 3 pages on this thread to see what all types of problems you've had. But, I lost my favorite male breeder recently to a similar fate. He started breathing heavy, stayed at the top for 1 day, then crashed at the bottom. His eyes still moved, but he was paralyzed. Died minutes later (as I cried). His partner was exhibiting similar symptoms, so I cleaned my filter and tank, changed media, and fed anti-biotic food for 5 days. (Kanaplex laced food from angelsplus). She's alive and healing. I know this is not the thread for treatments of sick fish, but I feel you're pain, am so sorry for your loss, and just wanted to share how I saved my female.

 

[Andy Sager]

Woke up to dead fish. One from the pair and one of the ones in the breeder box. The pair showed the same as every other I've lost. Staying in one place, heavy gill movement then death wwithin 24 hours.

Sorry to hear this. I think we need to talk and see what's happening

 

[Kelly5978]

Oh thank you Andy! (Whew)!!! Ok, so....the time they turned blue....it was probably dead eggs just being dyed right? I'm going to put in carbon, but I am not freaking out anymore! Thank god for this site!
Hey, I have pantyhose and carbon....but I don't have the pantyhose package, and can't be sure there's no dye in the material. Is it ok to use a bio-carb bag (with ammonia remover and carbon mixed)? Or just hope for the best with straight carbon?

 

[Andy Sager]

Oh thank you Andy! (Whew)!!! Ok, so....the time they turned blue....it was probably dead eggs just being dyed right? I'm going to put in carbon, but I am not freaking out anymore! Thank god for this site!
Hey, I have pantyhose and carbon....but I don't have the pantyhose package, and can't be sure there's no dye in the material. Is it ok to use a bio-carb bag (with ammonia remover and carbon mixed)? Or just hope for the best with straight carbon?

Yeah, Carbon or Bio-carb bag is fine. When all else fails, a white sock from your local Wallyworld will suffice. ( I used a lot of white socks growing up. Mom couldn't understand how she'd buy me six pairs and only wash 2 or 3 pairs. The rest, she later found out, were all in filters )

 

[Andy Sager]

So the next batch of eggs hatched and they all looked right( tail down, head up). That one spawn was just weird I guess. But they are all wiggling now and just flopping all over the place. LOL I really need to get some more tanks set up. It's really getting serious. :^o

 

[Autumnsky]

Congrats on the next batch as well, Andy, and it is seeming very serious now.

Sad to hear about your Angel Mr Fisher.

Kelly I am rooting for you to get a good batch this time. You have worked so long and hard for these!

 

[Andy Sager]

Bumping to keep this on the front page. My OOPS spawn hatched but dummy me, I didn't set the air right ( I'm used to the slate or rock holding the airstone down on the bottom) so the fry never became free swimming and died. That's what happens when you make OOPSies I guess. I've had 2 spawns since that one come up so it has to be the airstone not being at the bottom of the bottle with the fry. Oh well, you live and you learn

 

[Autumnsky]

Well I added about 30+ stems of Guppy Grass in the tank with the Koi Angel Pair and added a new slate for them. Did a pwc on the tank also and been feeding them some new meaty food to see how they like it, have been continuing to add new varieties to fulfill their nutritional needs and spark some breeding interests!!! fingers crossed!

 

[Autumnsky]

Well my excitement didn't last long last night one of my angels was hiding, then this morning hiding, didn't come out to eat tonignt home from work late and down on the bottom breathing heavy. Laying flat mostly, very sad. I am doing a 50% wc and maybe some med idnk what's wrong.

 

[oscarchic11]

Where did the slate come from??? Pull everything new from the tank and do a WC in case its something from that...

Sent from my NX008HD8G using Aquarium Advice mobile app

 

[Autumnsky]

The slate came from the auction/unknown source. I smelled it and it smelled like a rock from a rock pile aka dirt, looked unused. It is a pale sandstone like the rocks found around here, and didn't seem "used", no water marks, algae stains, etc. It is about 14" long and about 1.25 -2" thick, up to about 2.5" thick and long-kinda like a cubic rock log, smaller on one end, bigger on the other.

Scrubbed it vigorously with a new scrubby pad and left it under running tub faucet for about 5+ minutes and soaked it in a bucket for about 10 min. Dipped it into treated water and set it in.

Good idea, I will take it out.

What about the Guppy Grass? I just gave it a little rinse in tap water. And shook it off. I did add a splash of Prime to the tank after. It was very green and strong and healthy looking. (not melting or degrading)

The Angel is in the bucket and alive, swam when I moved the bucket to check in, still looks bad, thin and ill.

 

[Andy Sager]

I would add some vitamins to the bucket water as well. ( I use bodyguardRX by ACUREL.) A couple of things may have happened: Either you brought something in with the plants or rock ( something that should have effected all the fish tho) or you may have freaked this fish out with all the commotion in the tank. A massive water change may have also done it in. You should always test your water prior to a change so you know what the fish are living in. This way, if the fish react poorly after a water change, you know what parameters you need to duplicate to get them back into a happy place.
For now, keeping the fish quiet is the best thing. Just make sure there is enough aeration in the bucket and a heater so the water doesn't get too cold.

Keep us posted

 

[Autumnsky]

I would add some vitamins to the bucket water as well. ( I use bodyguardRX by ACUREL.) A couple of things may have happened: Either you brought something in with the plants or rock ( something that should have effected all the fish tho) or you may have freaked this fish out with all the commotion in the tank. A massive water change may have also done it in. You should always test your water prior to a change so you know what the fish are living in. This way, if the fish react poorly after a water change, you know what parameters you need to duplicate to get them back into a happy place.
For now, keeping the fish quiet is the best thing. Just make sure there is enough aeration in the bucket and a heater so the water doesn't get too cold.

Keep us posted

Thank you I will look into that. I will usually do 2 5Gal buckets so that would actually be around 8+ gallons on a 35/36G I say 37G due to the special built in filter just for continuity sake (as the name of the tank), but I am note using that filter it is a AC110 so maybe that is around a gallon in there and I keep it filled to the brim.

The bucket has a 5G heater (10W) which heats the 5G tank well. Though the bucket is about 1/2 full.

The fish is looking very bad, barely breathing.

 

[Mr Fisher]

Sorry to hear about your fish Autumnsky.

 

[Autumnsky]

Thank you MrFisher.

So this morning the fish is still alive and able to one time swim upright.

I switched the med to broad spectrum anitibiotic, completely changeing the water first so only new med with fish. Rinsed everything else in tap water and sprayed 90% alcohol on everything til wet and let dry(net, extra bucket, cup for mixing med)

The fish is still alive which I was kinda surprised about, i hope it is a good sign.

So probably no wigglers for me now. I still have 2 Koi Angels but I am not positive about the sex, I think I still might have a male and female. I could tell the difference when the pair were together, but harder now that they aren't. I will try to get some picks tomorrow or Friday and maybe you can help me figure out if I am still in the running for babies or not. Finding nice orange Koi Angels around here is hard.

If I have the 2 males, fine, I will just move them to pal around in the 72G for show. There are the youngster 4 Angels I have two silvers and two others with some orange on them.

Thanks for the support.

 

[Andy Sager]

Thank you MrFisher.

So this morning the fish is still alive and able to one time swim upright.

I switched the med to broad spectrum anitibiotic, completely changeing the water first so only new med with fish. Rinsed everything else in tap water and sprayed 90% alcohol on everything til wet and let dry(net, extra bucket, cup for mixing med)

The fish is still alive which I was kinda surprised about, i hope it is a good sign.

So probably no wigglers for me now. I still have 2 Koi Angels but I am not positive about the sex, I think I still might have a male and female. I could tell the difference when the pair were together, but harder now that they aren't. I will try to get some picks tomorrow or Friday and maybe you can help me figure out if I am still in the running for babies or not. Finding nice orange Koi Angels around here is hard.

If I have the 2 males, fine, I will just move them to pal around in the 72G for show. There are the youngster 4 Angels I have two silvers and two others with some orange on them.

Thanks for the support.

If you read through my trials and tribulations with "Scaredy Koi", she came back from the dead twice when I used the isolation and vitamins ( every other day) routine. In an unrelated case, I recently moved all the fish from a tank I had to put the lone unpaired adult fish in to a larger tank outside. The scenery was definitely different than the porch. LOL But I noticed this adult ( Scaredy Koi's tankmate when I bought them in VA) was not coming up for the feeding. I used the vitamins and the next day it came to the top for some FD worms and from the next day on, it comes to the surface for flakes. Coincidence? I think not.
The fact that your fish didn't die overnight sounds more like it's not disease but it's stress. Works it's mind as well as it's water.

Hope it all works out

 

[oscarchic11]

question? did you do the vinegar test on the slate... limestone and sandstone can both alter ph... i test all new rocks with vinegar before using... if they bubble it indicates a reaction and they are no good. just rinse after to get the vinegar off.